Is Blown Head Gasket My Fault ?
#11
11-14-2005, 12:01 AM
Is Blown Head Gasket My Fault ?
VERY well said DuneMe, and hats off to Al as well.
In my opinion, humble opinion that is.... Don't talk about the people, because each will hit it off with different folks. Look at the product, and decide which is best for you. This HAS been an issue for some, and yes things should have been handled by now.
Look at the product and it's record before you purchase, that's the only way to get the suspect stuff out and the good stuff in. I hope that Gary has a better fix than another gasket of the same breed. I'm sure that he reading, so..... good luck and lets take care of our brothers.
my 2 pennies
In my opinion, humble opinion that is.... Don't talk about the people, because each will hit it off with different folks. Look at the product, and decide which is best for you. This HAS been an issue for some, and yes things should have been handled by now.
Look at the product and it's record before you purchase, that's the only way to get the suspect stuff out and the good stuff in. I hope that Gary has a better fix than another gasket of the same breed. I'm sure that he reading, so..... good luck and lets take care of our brothers.
my 2 pennies
#12
11-14-2005, 12:55 AM
#13
11-14-2005, 01:00 AM
#14
11-14-2005, 01:17 AM
#15
11-14-2005, 02:23 PM
Is Blown Head Gasket My Fault ?
TVI POWER & SPORTS____________________________________________ _________
34515 SW TUALATIN VALLEY HWY
P.O. BOX 3363 HILLSBORO, OR 97123
PHONE 503-648-1254 FAX 503-640-5858
This is a copy of the letter TVI wrote to the credit card company when Mr. Rhodes disputed his bill. The credit card company has since ruled in TVI’s favor and re-charged Mr. Rhodes account. This letter explains who was at fault.
Nework 1 Financial
Retrieval & Chargeback Dept.
Fax – 301-631-6717
CASE #XXXXXXXX; Cardholder #XXXXXXXX
Merchant Name: TVI Power and Sports
Transaction Date: 6/20/2005
The complaint filed by Cherie Rhodes stated that she felt that the repair work done on the charge slip in question should have been covered by the 30-day warranty policy. We will clarify what a warranty policy covers. When we warrant our work we are warranting our workmanship and parts integrity. We will explain below that there was nothing wrong with our workmanship or parts used. The customer was at fault for not being honest about work he performed or had performed on the ATV that he did not reveal to us when he brought his engine in. The change he had made to the CDI Box, and did not reveal to us, seriously changed the ignition timing on the ATV causing detonation (ping). The customer did not bring his entire ATV in for work; he removed the engine and brought it in making it impossible for us to check if any modifications had been performed. We relied on the customer’s word that no additional work had been performed.
When Jeremy brought his engine to us for repair, he was asked if he had installed anything other than what we originally installed on his ATV. He told us “no.” He didn’t tell us hey had changed the CDI box to a Ron Woods CDI. A Ron Woods CDI moves the advance plus 7 degrees throughout the advance curve and will cause pre-ignition. He was also instructed to use 110 octane fuel with the 13 ½ compression he ordered. This conversation was all witnessed by one of our technicians. I personally installed the TVI 720 big bore kit in this motor. When he called me on my home phone on a Sunday afternoon he called and said that he and his brother were at Sand Lake Recreation Area and both engines had pinging sounds when I asked if he had put 110 octane fuel in the ATV and he said “yes,” he purchased the fuel at the Sandlake Store. He proceeded to tell me that he went ahead and road the ATV even though it was pinging and had been racing the ATV. Jeremy was very upset when I told both he and his brother, Chester, to stop riding. They said they had waited too long to ride and were going to ride anyway. I asked them to bring in the complete bikes as soon as possible. Up to this point, I had only seen the engines.
Both, Jeremy and Chester (brothers) brought their ATVs in and I looked at them and saw they both had Ron Woods CDIs. When I asked about them, they told me well “you didn’t ask about that!” They were upset and continued to say we had ripped them off. I told them we would inspect the engines and call them. We removed the engines and drained and saved the fuel. Neither ATVs had 110 octane fuel in them. Federal regulations require that any fuel over 100 octane have dye in it. The fuel removed from the ATVs did not.
Between the CDI box, advancing timing, and incorrect fuel octane, there was no doubt that the engines were pinging and caused the piston rings and head gaskets to fail. I proved how the problems were created by how I corrected the problems created by the customer. Now that we corrected these issues on both brothers’ bikes, the ATVs run properly. The proof of pre-ignition (detonation) is that the top of the pistons and rings looked like salt and pepper. This cause was confirmed by Dale Maslen of Maslen Machine (Forest Grove, OR with 40 years experience in auto machine work) as well as Dan Baisley of Baisley High Performance in Portland, Oregon. We can furnish contact telephone numbers if you wish. The customer reported to you that she spoke with the owner of On Dune’s Performance.com and he said that TVI’s 720 Big Bore Kits are notorious for blowing head gaskets. We talked with Mark McAdams at On Dune today and he disputed what the customer reported to you. Mark said their comments were taken out of context. We also have photographs of the pistons, cylinder head gaskets and the fuel that came out of Mr. Rhodes ATV as evidence of these issues. I can be contacted at 503-648-1254.
To further explain – the customer requested the new MSD ignition system. He was told the cost was $450 and that is part of the bill currently being disputed.
Thank you for the opportunity to clarify this situation. The customer created the engine problems and we only charged to correct the damage he created.
Gary Tiffany
TVI Power and Sports
503-648-1254
34515 SW TUALATIN VALLEY HWY
P.O. BOX 3363 HILLSBORO, OR 97123
PHONE 503-648-1254 FAX 503-640-5858
This is a copy of the letter TVI wrote to the credit card company when Mr. Rhodes disputed his bill. The credit card company has since ruled in TVI’s favor and re-charged Mr. Rhodes account. This letter explains who was at fault.
Nework 1 Financial
Retrieval & Chargeback Dept.
Fax – 301-631-6717
CASE #XXXXXXXX; Cardholder #XXXXXXXX
Merchant Name: TVI Power and Sports
Transaction Date: 6/20/2005
The complaint filed by Cherie Rhodes stated that she felt that the repair work done on the charge slip in question should have been covered by the 30-day warranty policy. We will clarify what a warranty policy covers. When we warrant our work we are warranting our workmanship and parts integrity. We will explain below that there was nothing wrong with our workmanship or parts used. The customer was at fault for not being honest about work he performed or had performed on the ATV that he did not reveal to us when he brought his engine in. The change he had made to the CDI Box, and did not reveal to us, seriously changed the ignition timing on the ATV causing detonation (ping). The customer did not bring his entire ATV in for work; he removed the engine and brought it in making it impossible for us to check if any modifications had been performed. We relied on the customer’s word that no additional work had been performed.
When Jeremy brought his engine to us for repair, he was asked if he had installed anything other than what we originally installed on his ATV. He told us “no.” He didn’t tell us hey had changed the CDI box to a Ron Woods CDI. A Ron Woods CDI moves the advance plus 7 degrees throughout the advance curve and will cause pre-ignition. He was also instructed to use 110 octane fuel with the 13 ½ compression he ordered. This conversation was all witnessed by one of our technicians. I personally installed the TVI 720 big bore kit in this motor. When he called me on my home phone on a Sunday afternoon he called and said that he and his brother were at Sand Lake Recreation Area and both engines had pinging sounds when I asked if he had put 110 octane fuel in the ATV and he said “yes,” he purchased the fuel at the Sandlake Store. He proceeded to tell me that he went ahead and road the ATV even though it was pinging and had been racing the ATV. Jeremy was very upset when I told both he and his brother, Chester, to stop riding. They said they had waited too long to ride and were going to ride anyway. I asked them to bring in the complete bikes as soon as possible. Up to this point, I had only seen the engines.
Both, Jeremy and Chester (brothers) brought their ATVs in and I looked at them and saw they both had Ron Woods CDIs. When I asked about them, they told me well “you didn’t ask about that!” They were upset and continued to say we had ripped them off. I told them we would inspect the engines and call them. We removed the engines and drained and saved the fuel. Neither ATVs had 110 octane fuel in them. Federal regulations require that any fuel over 100 octane have dye in it. The fuel removed from the ATVs did not.
Between the CDI box, advancing timing, and incorrect fuel octane, there was no doubt that the engines were pinging and caused the piston rings and head gaskets to fail. I proved how the problems were created by how I corrected the problems created by the customer. Now that we corrected these issues on both brothers’ bikes, the ATVs run properly. The proof of pre-ignition (detonation) is that the top of the pistons and rings looked like salt and pepper. This cause was confirmed by Dale Maslen of Maslen Machine (Forest Grove, OR with 40 years experience in auto machine work) as well as Dan Baisley of Baisley High Performance in Portland, Oregon. We can furnish contact telephone numbers if you wish. The customer reported to you that she spoke with the owner of On Dune’s Performance.com and he said that TVI’s 720 Big Bore Kits are notorious for blowing head gaskets. We talked with Mark McAdams at On Dune today and he disputed what the customer reported to you. Mark said their comments were taken out of context. We also have photographs of the pistons, cylinder head gaskets and the fuel that came out of Mr. Rhodes ATV as evidence of these issues. I can be contacted at 503-648-1254.
To further explain – the customer requested the new MSD ignition system. He was told the cost was $450 and that is part of the bill currently being disputed.
Thank you for the opportunity to clarify this situation. The customer created the engine problems and we only charged to correct the damage he created.
Gary Tiffany
TVI Power and Sports
503-648-1254
#16
05-08-2013, 04:27 PM
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#17
05-16-2013, 06:51 PM
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