I know this may inflame some people but I would like to interject a few observations and thoughts. It has been disturbing me for some time that we, as americans continue to purchase items from China.

For 15 years I traveled abroad looking for parts suppliers for a major USA manufacturing firm, an Auto manufacturer. My job was to look at a company spend time in the factory and access their capabilities, in terms of quality, and productivity. In this global market where companies are all trying to obtain ISO certification this is a very important part of any manufacturing process. I was shocked at what I found in china.

First you must understand that this country, like most others, is trying to get what we as americans have. Just like Japan back in the early 60's was trying to do, and who now compete against us in all markets globally. The chinese companies employ people for little to nothing, provide very little training, because they themselves don't know alot yet, and have nothing in the way of a quality assurance program. I had the opportunity to see a motorcycle factory, this company would build private label machines for their american distributors. The costs of the machines out the door, were less than a good motorcycle frame built in the United States.

I believe it was a pit bike that I was looking at in this factory. They did whatever they needed to do to get it out the door, and did it as cheaply as they can with whatever materials they could get. The castings they used were very poor quality, lots of porosity, and poor machining, the tubing was no where close to the ratings we use in the United States. I picked up heads for the motors and looked at the machining, the finish was very poor and no where close to a 125 finish which we use as an industry standard. looking into the cylinders, you should see a mirror finish, instead I saw tool marks. I asked about how they checked they bore diameters, and the finish. they had no equipment to do so. The quality of raw material coming into china is very very low! They are in the stone age from a manufacturing standpoint. They are trying to learn processes, that we have had since the early 1900's.

Since they have been maunfacturing garbage, and we have been buying this stuff up like it was the hottest thing since the wheel, china now has lots of money to invest. Chinese companies are sending their people here to try and educate themselves on our manufacturing processes. In my opinion they are still 20 years behind, but as long as we throw money at them they will start to catch up. I have been offered jobs with several chinese companies, at a very nice salary, to come in and help develop a manufacturing process for them which would include R&D.

This scares me as an american! I sure hope that some of us will wake up.

I would never allow my child to own or ride anything built in china, regardless of the company, or the history. I hope that you would evaluate your purchases as well.

 

So one factory making sub-par machines means all Chinese companies are making sub-par machines? The only thing disturbing is your ignorant conclusion. Do some research. Many of the big dogs contract with chinese companies to produce oem parts to their specifications. Knock the company, knock their products, but I know for a fact China is putting out some stuff for Honda (Sundiro), Yamaha (Linhai) and Polaris (QJ) so don't tell me they aren't capable.

 

I knew that someone would become irritated at my post, my objective was to provoke some thought. Not to get into a flame war.

Perhaps you should spend some time visiting these manufacturing facilities yourself and observe the process, look at the materials, watch the quality control, and see what the people live like on next to nothing per day. Then when you have we could exchange ideas. To say that my information is based on one facility is ridiculous. Please, read the post again.

I'm sorry, what company was it again you have knowledge of? I was curious how you came to your conclusion based upon your research. Have you visited them yet? Just curious.

 

Learn to read. I listed 3. And the fact is they have produced products for the major players. Eton and Kymco have mainland plants too.

I guess now is where you tell me you've visited every single atv manufacturing plant in China? Get real dude. The proof is in the pudding and there have been some decent products to come out of China. Are all good? No. I wouldn't buy some of the crap we see floating around. But some I would. That's my whole point. YOU don't know everything nor do YOU have experience with every manufacturer. So quit talking out of your butt and stick to the products you do have experience with.

 

WOW! Raptorlegs! LOL! You make me laugh!HAHAHA!

 

I think we all can agree that this is just a matter of opion yea there is chinese quads out there that might be ok but the fact is that you can not no way shape or form say they compare to eton polaris kasea dinli alphasports this style minarelli engine type or top name brands so if one guy wants to buy chinese thats his money some people have luck with them depends on how they are ridden and mantianed myself I dont like them they are to narrow and i dont like 4 strokes on mini quad unless it is a honda we race an alphasport 50cc and 90cc they both are completly modified and are very fast we have been racing about four years and have two point champ and have won 42 races chinese quads are not able to do that they wont last or run with these quads even in the woods they just wont take the abuse with out doing alot of work to them there is no arguing with these facts I have been there and seen it I dont care what company makes what thats how it is!!!

 

I agree MQ97, been pushing the Polaris clones for years. They have abundant parts and support from the race crowd. But my China quad is a Polaris clone and made by the same company that produces a so-called Taiwanese mini that often gets praise on this site. It's all perception.

 

It is ok for us to disagree on who has a better brand than the other. We each have an opinion and I respect yours. The facts will speak for themselves in terms of the quality coming from China.

I did take some time to look up the companies that you threw out there. Maybe you can assist me. I don't find any ISO certifications or registrations for any of those companies. Perhaps I did not dig deep enough.

Most of these companies were started thru some encouragement of the communist govt. They have told their people to start their own business and earn a living. These business owners have hired people, who have recently come down from the hills and were farmers the week before. They put a welder in their hands, teach them to run a bead, and Viola! We have an assembly line welder. Now do the same with the rest of the employees and guess what...your in business. How is this for sticking to the facts? Am I doing ok so far?

Can you understand the type of problems you have doing this? Now, lets factor in inferior materials that we just grabbed anywhere we could find. Looks like a real mess here doesn't it. Well it is and the facts have proven themselves in the market place. Sorry you are upset about that.

Now, again I must ask, How many of these companies did you visit, you know the ones that you sell the product? Looks like someone needs to do some research. Speaking of, maybe you could tell me how many defect claims these companies have based on the number of units sold for year 2005? What was the average claim cost? Have they made any engineering changes? If so what are they?

My original post was meant to provoke intelligent and insightful thought. Not to bash any brand, which I will not and have not mentioned. It was a simple overview of the quality of products coming from mainland China, which I observed while conducting business in that country. As a parent, I would not allow my child to ride anything from this country. My childrens safety is worth more than $599.00 worth of quality.

Just one more additional note, did the company tell you what it costs them to manufacture this 600.00 quad? I didn't think so.....

 

You're so right Mr. Smartypants, I'm sure Honda and Yamaha are not ISO certified. lmao!

Do your own research. Keywords: joint venture China Honda Sundiro or Wuyang, then try Linhai Yamaha. Known a few people to have good luck with Linhai products, including myself. And I'm not pushing $600 quads. All off brands are not created equal.

 

http://www.moxiescooters.com/diamo/turista.php
http://www.moxiescooters.com/diamo/d_index.php

Found some motorcycles...same prolly holds true for atv's

Yes it is stated as: built in a Yamaha owned factory (Linhai) and you can expect the highest level of quality and reliability.

But really these china made products are in the same price range as the real deal yamaha...so why not buy the real deal?

Any company like this is few and far between in China...and still where is the support or parts? Prolly sill not close to the big names[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]