I have been playing with the clutch on the V for awhile now and have gone as far as possible till I called Dale at Dalton he is mostly known for clutch modification on sleds but not so much on quads. His season for sleds is coming on hard so he has not had as much time to work on the quad market but has been playing with the V force for this summer at least. His R & D department came up with this system which he has had good success with so I decided to give it a try. What I received was a blue spring, face plate, and weights. The weights are at 58 grams with holes drilled so Yamaha rivets can be installed to fine tune the clutch. The face plate has been machined to fit lower on the spider allowing for the belt to go higher up the sheave producing more top end. I found it is more responsive and gives another 3 mph in a 300 foot run and will go up to 5 mph on a 1/8 run. There are a multitude of rivets a person can install to move the power band around I have not had a lot of time to play with the weights yet but will at later date. I will probably try it on my 650 later to see if it makes any difference I do like being able to fine tune the weights though. I am also curious to try the Dalton Clutch mod on a P700 as the P700 has the same clutch as the V.

 

Alltoys:

Great news. I sent "Helix" a message as I now have the MBRP Duals and I know they did some tests and R&D work with them. I am more interested in climbing and midrange rather than drag racing. Thats how I want to be set up. I now have a little more time on my hands so I will get my butt over to your shop. I do plan to head to Brule this weekend to test out the pipes on the hills but only for a day.

Are you around this weekend?

Randy

 

Alltoys,

I wish you lived closer so I could bring my P700 over. I've been bugging Dale for a set of weights to test out on mine. How does the ramp angle compare to the stock?

The face plate cover has my curiosity. I don't understand what you mean here: The face plate has been machined to fit lower on the spider allowing for the belt to go higher up the sheave producing more top end.

Can you take some pictures?

I wouldn't expect that face plate to work with the P650 or P700 if you want to continue using the KEBC. Correct? That isn't an issue for certain competition scenarios (mud dragging, drag racing, sled pulls etc), but is an issue for general use I think.

Keep us informed.

 

I got all the same things, from Dalton, as alltoys except the faceplate. So far I like my V better this way, it feels snappier. I'll let alltoys play with the rivets, I have no idea what I am doing there.

 

I just sent an email off to dalton to get the avail and cost. I am in search of about 8-10mph more on top end. I was wondering Alltoys, if the you felt the electomotive ignition system provided enough ignition management? I have raced and built many cars in the past. When I race the v force it feels like it has all kind of power down low but is laboring to accelerate on top, just like a car with no ignition advance. I spoke to I believe it was Dirk at Electomotive and he said the cost of the components would be approx. $700.00 plus the cost of fitting it to the quad. My other question is how difficult is it to fit this system on the motor? Did you see enough improvement to warrant the investment or should I wait for a more conventional approach. Any input would be appreciated and thanks for all the R&D you have put into our toys. By the way how was that diesel race bike, any details? Thanks again.

 

Gotta lock on this thread [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

Xc800,
Saturday I am going racing in a mud bog event in Saskatchewan with my 650 only sunny screwed up my trany last weekend at a sled pull there is something I will have to post later on about a ratcheting trany is not good it has cost around $500 for parts. Sunday I should be home I won't have the V but I will have the clutch components we can install them on your machine and try them out. I still have some fine tuning to do but it should be interesting at least with this system there is more area to tweek if you don't me experimenting with your machine LOL.

DWB,
The face plate has a deeper mounting area about 0.040 deeper to allow for the belt to ramp up the sheave a little more this is where the extra speed is coming from. This is better than having to machine the sheaves and put spacers in between the face plate and spider. It has a mass of 402 grams almost 50 grams lighter than stock. The weights are the identical cut of the stock weights I thought they would be different but I can see the advantage as you can interchange 2 of them with the stock weights to move the power band. They are at 58 grams where as the V weights are at 56 grams this works well with the blue spring. The great thing about this system along with what I have already done to the V clutch it allows for more adjustment with weights, and springs. Shotgun has said it before and I go along with this analogy take as much rotating mass off the clutch as possible and use weights and springs to adjust the clutch. You are right about the KEBC it will not work on the Prairie but it does have the area for the bearing if a person wants to install it. I took mine off my 650 the KEBC slows down the take off as for going down hills all you have to do is blip the throttle and the trany holds well enough.

Needmorespeed,
I like the HPX 4 cylinder ignition because it will handle all my needs with respect to timeing advance, switch to operate Nos, tach switch, initial timeing advance, rpm retard at higher rpms, a rev limiter that is adjustable to 15,000 rpm, a timeing add on for more timeing advance if needed, the list goes on. The price is a little steep but for me it has what I need. I have had the V up to 98 mph at 10,500 rpm and there is a more throttle to go at that speed it gets a little uncontrollable. I had it on the highway with my wife hot on my heels at 98 I was from one side of the road to the other so I thought is was in my best interest to slow it down. I will make it to 100 mph yet that is my second goal.

There is a 60 tooth crank wheel that has to be installed on the crank there is spot on the crank where the pull start would be if it were a Prairie. You will have to machine a washer and spacer that has a notch cut into it to match the key way and install the reluctor this is what the wheel is called. Then a small chisel pickup has to be mounted as per instructions to get what ever timeing curve you wish. The HPX is designed with a total of 30* advance but you can alter that I have as much as 40* advance, from this I can move the timeing around to where ever I want it or retard as much as I need for a 1 or 2 or 3 stage Nos system. Here is another interesting thing about this unit that I am going to like is I adapt it to run an EFI system with absolutely no carburetors needed just injectors. Can you imagine a set of jets that can supply enough fuel for a 800 cc motor and still have enough left over for Nos. I calculate at least 60 brake hp with a 2 stage nos system.

You wanted to know about the diesel race bike, it is a 800 cc motorbike that is professionally raced at this time and is in the top 5 in Europe. They have to use an air starter like they have for dragsters to get it started. It has a compression of 450psi in both cylinders all in a aluminum block motor with a hybrid metal valves to reduce heat build up.
Rpm is maxed out at 8000 rpm the bottom end grunt is amazing there is 5 gears where most race bikes have 6 - 8 gears it is quiet I thought it would be noisy but not so. The technology is on this bike is fantastic 800cc runing with 1100's truly interesting. Both the 600 I ran and the diesel are a twin cylinder just like our Kawi's the 600 is rated at over 200 hp not sure what the diesel is rated at they wouldn't tell me go figure I guess they have to have some secrets LOL.

 

I have been doing some "fiddling around" with the V-clutch ,too. Dale at Dalton Industries has been a great help!

 

ALLTOY's... as you know, I've been playing with the clutches & belts on the 650... as per your statement
"DWB,
The face plate has a deeper mounting area about 0.040 deeper to allow for the belt to ramp up the sheave a little more this is where the extra speed is coming from. This is better than having to machine the sheaves and put spacers in between the face plate and spider. It has a mass of 402 grams almost 50 grams lighter than stock."

I don't understand how machining the plate will help ( short of lightening the rotational mass )...I'm assuming that you are talking the area, that looks like contact pads between the spider & the plate,... ( at least on my Prairie ) these pads have never made contact ( no visible mateing between the spider & the plate )... though at this point, I don't fully understand what is holding them apart... I initially thought that the belt was too short, holding the primary sheeves apart ( I thought the belt was bottoming out on the secondary, but from the wear patterns on the secondary, it appears as if the belt is not fully reaching the bottom of the secondary )

as I spend more intimate time with my spare primary, I may come to better understand it, but I currently see no "contact points" that, if machined would allow the sheaves more room to move... this leads me to believe that this "restriction", is either the relationship between the fly weight ramp angles to the sheave rollers, the fly weight mass, or mass profile, or belt width / length, lack of horsepower required to finish extending the weights to maximum engagement, or ????

are anyone elses spiders actually contacting the plate ???... maybe I just need more POWER ???...LOL... WAM

 

You beat me to it Mike. I was wondering the same thing.

How much further up the sheaves does the new plate allow it? You have confirmed this by watching it?

If that is true then we may not need to worry about different belt dimensions. Although, if more gains are to be had then more power to it.

Dang, I wish we had this setup to play with tomorrow....

Did Dale loan you a set to trial or did you buy them? Did he send you the rivets too?