Update: Stocker Carb on a Stage 2 sled
Aug 23, 2004 | 08:53 PM
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Update: Stocker Carb on a Stage 2 sled
Just to give you guys an update on my current carb status. As you know, I had a TM45 then went to the Lectron 46HV, and now I'm back to my stocker.
This thread is not a Pro/Con Lectron or TM thread. This is simply an informational thread that is meant to relay some of my findings. I'll give you a brief overview of what was done, and where the stocker started at. I hope it helps some of you out.
The original stocker was put on a dyno after I had the RWR CDI, the Big Gun full system, and a carb mount K&N. Dyno session yielded a 180main jet, and it worked well. The TM was an increase, but the thumb pull issue - lets just say that I'm not the tinker' that HighTower is! IN the middle of all this testing, I went to the Lectron, and really enjoyed the top end it gave me. I don't know that it had more bottem end than the TM but the top end sang a different note for me. Very NICE on the DUNES and Drags.
I started to get a little frustrated in the ultra low stuff and decided to go back to the stock. Since the stock was on, I put the high compression RWR piston in and an intake cam. I left the exhaust cam alone in hopes of not losing any torqe - as big as I am, I needed all the torque I could get. Also, in all the testing that was done, the snorkle has proven itself to be an asset in every area. We'll that went back on with a K&N on the end.
Here is where it gets a little crazzy. When I put the stocker back on with the 180 jet, the bike was on the edge of scary lean. When you get fuzz on your plug from being too hot - you have a problem. Went to the 185 hoping that it would be just enough...... WRONG!!!! the porcelin on the plug was still untouched! Not a hint of fuel on the full throttle run with a throttle chop and shut down. Went to the 190 and things are again PERFECT! You know that feeling when your riding hard and the bike doesn't feel like it's working??? The feeling that your bike isn't anywhere near hot????? that's the feeling that I got. The plug has a slight (very slight) light beige ring around the top of the ceramic, and the heat range on the electrode is indicating a perfect jet in that it's showing heat at the down-turn. AWSOME!
Seat - O - pants meeter???? If I've lost any low end, I'll by you guys each a dinner. I may have lost a 1 - 3 ponies above 7800rpm - but that's it!. I'll have to get over to the dyno to confirm but the old stand by indicator is my neighbors 400EX. We drag all the time, and have dragged alot with each and every carb. This carb pulled out of the whole BIG.... I had to chop the throttle to get the front end down (remember I have a +3 swing arm). My buddies 400 is a 417 with cams and high compression. It's a very fast 400. We both determined that in a 100 yard race, if there was any difference, it was no more than maybe one or two feet difference. It's so close that a video would have been nice before and after going back to the stocker.
Ride characteristics??? Man, you don't know what you were missing until you go back. It was a dream! Idled perfectly, started perfectly, ULTRA easy on the tight rock crawling, and is supper predictable on the long slides through the washes. We time our selves through a certain 1/2 mile section of wash that nothing more than sliding in and out of turns and then full throttle between the turns. Ready for this???? I was almost 6 seconds faster on average over 3 runs. Something to be said about response and comfort level of your sled when things work right.
For those of you that really don't want to move another 6 - 7bills towards a new carb - there is hope, and your gains, while nice on the dyno, don't ALWAYS translate to the real world. For example, I'm sure I lost some ponies at the top end, say 7600 - 7800rpm. But When I race up the dunes, I'm at about 6300rpm. I don't think that I'm losing too much there if any. The dyno will have to confirm this, but my times on our course don't lie. Also of importance is how I felt after the 45 mile all-outer. I was in great shape. Hopped off the bike, called my wife, had to write a couple of emails (all while waiting for the monster to cool), washed it to make it pretty. Never even needed a nap!!!!!!!
Just an FYI - hope it was informational
Remember to keep your powder dry!
BigDaddy - out
This thread is not a Pro/Con Lectron or TM thread. This is simply an informational thread that is meant to relay some of my findings. I'll give you a brief overview of what was done, and where the stocker started at. I hope it helps some of you out.
The original stocker was put on a dyno after I had the RWR CDI, the Big Gun full system, and a carb mount K&N. Dyno session yielded a 180main jet, and it worked well. The TM was an increase, but the thumb pull issue - lets just say that I'm not the tinker' that HighTower is! IN the middle of all this testing, I went to the Lectron, and really enjoyed the top end it gave me. I don't know that it had more bottem end than the TM but the top end sang a different note for me. Very NICE on the DUNES and Drags.
I started to get a little frustrated in the ultra low stuff and decided to go back to the stock. Since the stock was on, I put the high compression RWR piston in and an intake cam. I left the exhaust cam alone in hopes of not losing any torqe - as big as I am, I needed all the torque I could get. Also, in all the testing that was done, the snorkle has proven itself to be an asset in every area. We'll that went back on with a K&N on the end.
Here is where it gets a little crazzy. When I put the stocker back on with the 180 jet, the bike was on the edge of scary lean. When you get fuzz on your plug from being too hot - you have a problem. Went to the 185 hoping that it would be just enough...... WRONG!!!! the porcelin on the plug was still untouched! Not a hint of fuel on the full throttle run with a throttle chop and shut down. Went to the 190 and things are again PERFECT! You know that feeling when your riding hard and the bike doesn't feel like it's working??? The feeling that your bike isn't anywhere near hot????? that's the feeling that I got. The plug has a slight (very slight) light beige ring around the top of the ceramic, and the heat range on the electrode is indicating a perfect jet in that it's showing heat at the down-turn. AWSOME!
Seat - O - pants meeter???? If I've lost any low end, I'll by you guys each a dinner. I may have lost a 1 - 3 ponies above 7800rpm - but that's it!. I'll have to get over to the dyno to confirm but the old stand by indicator is my neighbors 400EX. We drag all the time, and have dragged alot with each and every carb. This carb pulled out of the whole BIG.... I had to chop the throttle to get the front end down (remember I have a +3 swing arm). My buddies 400 is a 417 with cams and high compression. It's a very fast 400. We both determined that in a 100 yard race, if there was any difference, it was no more than maybe one or two feet difference. It's so close that a video would have been nice before and after going back to the stocker.
Ride characteristics??? Man, you don't know what you were missing until you go back. It was a dream! Idled perfectly, started perfectly, ULTRA easy on the tight rock crawling, and is supper predictable on the long slides through the washes. We time our selves through a certain 1/2 mile section of wash that nothing more than sliding in and out of turns and then full throttle between the turns. Ready for this???? I was almost 6 seconds faster on average over 3 runs. Something to be said about response and comfort level of your sled when things work right.
For those of you that really don't want to move another 6 - 7bills towards a new carb - there is hope, and your gains, while nice on the dyno, don't ALWAYS translate to the real world. For example, I'm sure I lost some ponies at the top end, say 7600 - 7800rpm. But When I race up the dunes, I'm at about 6300rpm. I don't think that I'm losing too much there if any. The dyno will have to confirm this, but my times on our course don't lie. Also of importance is how I felt after the 45 mile all-outer. I was in great shape. Hopped off the bike, called my wife, had to write a couple of emails (all while waiting for the monster to cool), washed it to make it pretty. Never even needed a nap!!!!!!!
Just an FYI - hope it was informational
Remember to keep your powder dry!
BigDaddy - out
Aug 23, 2004 | 09:32 PM
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Update: Stocker Carb on a Stage 2 sled
Only one bummer here Mike.......... the couple of bills lost in your findings. But in reality you lost little and gaind alot and found a very bright light at the end of the carb tunnel. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
all's good keep us posted on the dyno!!!!
Sam
all's good keep us posted on the dyno!!!!
Sam
Aug 23, 2004 | 11:35 PM
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Update: Stocker Carb on a Stage 2 sled
I have to agree with Big Daddy the stock carbs can run really hard. I saw a baja with stage three internals and a stock carb and modded end cap out run lots of stage ones twos and even a few threes . All the while it looks stockas anything but it runs hard. Stock isnt always bad[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] John
Aug 24, 2004 | 06:33 PM
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Update: Stocker Carb on a Stage 2 sled
crazypainter is so right! i have also seen the same thing. he would stay right with me and i mean right there. if i was sleeping on the line he would beat me!![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img] i never did get the guys name.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img]
Aug 25, 2004 | 04:18 PM
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Update: Stocker Carb on a Stage 2 sled
Originally posted by: BigDaddy331
Since the stock was on, I put the high compression RWR piston in and an intake cam. I left the exhaust cam alone in hopes of not losing any torqe - as big as I am, I needed all the torque I could get.
If I've lost any low end, I'll by you guys each a dinner. I may have lost a 1 - 3 ponies above 7800rpm - but that's it!.
Since the stock was on, I put the high compression RWR piston in and an intake cam. I left the exhaust cam alone in hopes of not losing any torqe - as big as I am, I needed all the torque I could get.
If I've lost any low end, I'll by you guys each a dinner. I may have lost a 1 - 3 ponies above 7800rpm - but that's it!.
Quote: Ride characteristics??? Man, you don't know what you were missing until you go back. It was a dream! Idled perfectly, started perfectly, ULTRA easy on the tight rock crawling, and is supper predictable on the long slides through the washes. We time our selves through a certain 1/2 mile section of wash that nothing more than sliding in and out of turns and then full throttle between the turns. Ready for this???? I was almost 6 seconds faster on average over 3 runs. Something to be said about response and comfort level of your sled when things work right.
I agree! The first time I bolted the Lectron onto my DS was at a small indoor tt race (in a horse arena). I went out and practiced with it, and came back off the track with real BIG eyes and put the stock carb back on. I simply could not control the power in the tight stuff - front tires off the ground, accelerating to the jump quicker than I could get back up on the seat, etc..... This carb is NOT for that kind of rider. Now, on medium and big tt tracks, drag racing, open trail riding, I wouldn't trade it for anything.
It is good to hear you found what works best for your DS. I know it's been a long, expensive road. Ya'll listen to BigDaddy on this - it will save you money, time and frustration.
222
Aug 25, 2004 | 08:56 PM
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Update: Stocker Carb on a Stage 2 sled
Let me ECHO 222. It's not that my carb is making more power, it's exactly as he stated. It's more controllable on the super tight stuff. And again, I'm not making more, I just don't THINK that I lost as much as I thought I would.
As to the timing of adding the piston and cam. No, I added the piston and cam before the my Lectron purchase. Going back to the stocker in the exact same combo as the Lectron pushed around.
You know me guys, I am honest (sometimes to a fault), I have NEVER had ANYTHING make the power up Comp hill at DUMONT like the 46HV. NOTHING! My need to have overall trail, dune, rock and race abilities made the stocker the right choice for me. And yes, it's been VERY expensive. I hope, if nothing else, you have learned from my experience. Moving to Kentucky would of definitely improved my Lectron experience. I would of had my sled over at Eric's all the time until it was perfect - guess what, my guess is that it would have been perfect.
That said, ANY OF YOU PUNKS WITH LECTRONS WANNA LINE UP - BRING YOUR WALLET!!!!!!! (got to give me some time to find a 120lb pilot! )
[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
As to the timing of adding the piston and cam. No, I added the piston and cam before the my Lectron purchase. Going back to the stocker in the exact same combo as the Lectron pushed around.
You know me guys, I am honest (sometimes to a fault), I have NEVER had ANYTHING make the power up Comp hill at DUMONT like the 46HV. NOTHING! My need to have overall trail, dune, rock and race abilities made the stocker the right choice for me. And yes, it's been VERY expensive. I hope, if nothing else, you have learned from my experience. Moving to Kentucky would of definitely improved my Lectron experience. I would of had my sled over at Eric's all the time until it was perfect - guess what, my guess is that it would have been perfect.
That said, ANY OF YOU PUNKS WITH LECTRONS WANNA LINE UP - BRING YOUR WALLET!!!!!!! (got to give me some time to find a 120lb pilot! )
[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
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Aug 26, 2004 | 12:04 AM
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Update: Stocker Carb on a Stage 2 sled
PERFECT! But it's a 70/30 split. I get the 70 cause I've done $2,000 worth of carb testing over the last 12 months! I gotta beat a lot of 400's to make my money back.
Problem is...... my luck, I'll go up against the baddest 400 known to man being riden by an annorexic 20yr old woman that hates men and would rather shoot anything red!
[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]
Problem is...... my luck, I'll go up against the baddest 400 known to man being riden by an annorexic 20yr old woman that hates men and would rather shoot anything red!
[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]