Read this, it sure suprised me
Oct 19, 1999 | 10:36 PM
#1
Thread Starter
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Trailblazer
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 56
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It was on a flawless spring morning, May 5, 1985, that Larry McAfee, a 29-year-old mechanical engineer, decided, on an
impulse, to take his motorcycle for a ride with friends on the mountain roads north of his suburban Atlanta home. Hours later,
traveling no more than 10 m.p.h., he hit a curve, fell, and as his head snapped back, the base of his helmet crushed his top two
vertebrae (as in Figure #2).
"There was not another mark on him," says Larry's mother, Amelia.
Yet in that split second, the 6'6", 240-lb. McAfee, an avid outdoorsman, hunter and fledgling parachutist, had sustained what
the medical profession calls a "complete injury," one that would leave him permanently paralyzed from the neck down -- unable
to walk, eat or even breathe again unaided.
This introduction was taken from a People Magazine article describing the court victory of McAfee to obtain the legal right to
terminate the application of the respirator which he relies on for every breath. As far as we know, McAfee is still not exercised
that right; however, that is not the point of this particular article.
The point of this writing is to establish the need for a long hard look at the opinion expressed by the National Highway Traffic
Safety Administration (NHTSA) indicating that the use of so-called motorcycle safety helmets -- built to pass their safety
standard criteria, Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard #218 (FMVSS 218) -- notably protects a motorcyclist involved in a
collision from death or other major injury.
Mike Holt, President of American Eagle Engineering, Ltd., and President of Riders for Justice, or Loveland, Colorado, has
been at odds with NHTSA over this contention, and with their so-called safety standard, for well over a decade now. It is
Holt's expert testimony on the subject of the dangers of helmet use which has been instrumental in either removing, or preventing
passage of, helmet laws in Colorado (28 times), Wyoming, Utah, and other states.
Holt has reported on virtually every aspect of these dangers in a report entitled "Ineffectiveness of Helmets and Detrimental
Effects of Helmet Use" which, to our knowledge, is the most comprehensive objective study on the subject in existence today.
http://usff.com/hldl/report/3rdEditiona.html#R302
Go to that website and you can read more.
The key issue here is that although a helmet may sound promising, people have spend a lot of their lives lobbying against them for a reason. You can't tell me that man would be dead without a helmet, that's just not true. Although you may think that I'm a complete idiot, you have to agree that I have a point.
Since this is my opinion, and the definition of an opinion is a statement that is up for dispute, without an arguement, I'd like to hear what everyone else has to say, in a respectful manner please. Thank you
here's another interesting website:
http://usff.com/hldl/helmethoax.html
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Want a Magnum or Sportsman 500!!!
impulse, to take his motorcycle for a ride with friends on the mountain roads north of his suburban Atlanta home. Hours later,
traveling no more than 10 m.p.h., he hit a curve, fell, and as his head snapped back, the base of his helmet crushed his top two
vertebrae (as in Figure #2).
"There was not another mark on him," says Larry's mother, Amelia.
Yet in that split second, the 6'6", 240-lb. McAfee, an avid outdoorsman, hunter and fledgling parachutist, had sustained what
the medical profession calls a "complete injury," one that would leave him permanently paralyzed from the neck down -- unable
to walk, eat or even breathe again unaided.
This introduction was taken from a People Magazine article describing the court victory of McAfee to obtain the legal right to
terminate the application of the respirator which he relies on for every breath. As far as we know, McAfee is still not exercised
that right; however, that is not the point of this particular article.
The point of this writing is to establish the need for a long hard look at the opinion expressed by the National Highway Traffic
Safety Administration (NHTSA) indicating that the use of so-called motorcycle safety helmets -- built to pass their safety
standard criteria, Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard #218 (FMVSS 218) -- notably protects a motorcyclist involved in a
collision from death or other major injury.
Mike Holt, President of American Eagle Engineering, Ltd., and President of Riders for Justice, or Loveland, Colorado, has
been at odds with NHTSA over this contention, and with their so-called safety standard, for well over a decade now. It is
Holt's expert testimony on the subject of the dangers of helmet use which has been instrumental in either removing, or preventing
passage of, helmet laws in Colorado (28 times), Wyoming, Utah, and other states.
Holt has reported on virtually every aspect of these dangers in a report entitled "Ineffectiveness of Helmets and Detrimental
Effects of Helmet Use" which, to our knowledge, is the most comprehensive objective study on the subject in existence today.
http://usff.com/hldl/report/3rdEditiona.html#R302
Go to that website and you can read more.
The key issue here is that although a helmet may sound promising, people have spend a lot of their lives lobbying against them for a reason. You can't tell me that man would be dead without a helmet, that's just not true. Although you may think that I'm a complete idiot, you have to agree that I have a point.
Since this is my opinion, and the definition of an opinion is a statement that is up for dispute, without an arguement, I'd like to hear what everyone else has to say, in a respectful manner please. Thank you
here's another interesting website:
http://usff.com/hldl/helmethoax.html
------------------
Want a Magnum or Sportsman 500!!!
Oct 20, 1999 | 03:13 AM
#2
Range Rover
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
My oppinion is that Helmets may not save lives, but they keep the main organ of your body intact (BRAIN). Without this you have nothing left. It is the basis for all intelligent life. The accident you spoke of is definetly an awful thing to have happen and at the same time the odds are in our favor for this not to happen. I'm sure there have been accidents associated with wearing a helmet and the possible neck injuries that follow, but let's admit that the HELMET does keep our head intact as long as it is a high quality helmet. I don't even use a helmet most of the time on my Banshee, but whenever I ride my 155 horse fully race ready 92 CBR 600 F2 I always certainly do even if VA didn't have helmet laws I wouldn't ride that suicide machine without one going 210 mph+. If you didn't like what I said earlier then just think would you want an open casket(HELMET) or a closed casket(NO HELMET). Nuff said.
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Jeremiah Lucas
1989 Yamaha Banshee
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Jeremiah Lucas
1989 Yamaha Banshee
Oct 20, 1999 | 04:55 AM
#3
Pro Rider
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 1,667
Likes: 1
Conventional wisdom holds the majority of fatalaties from motorcycle and ATV accidents result from head injuries, many survivable with proper headgear.
The "People" magazine story in this topic describes a freak accident; the Hurt Report explicitly deals with and discounts the probability of helmet-induced neck injuries.
The millions of dollars spent on research by the Snell Foundation (founded by the family of and named for a motorcycle accident victim, by the way), the National Transportation Safety Board, and other institutions on helmet safety carry more weight than a "People" magazine article, in my opinion.
Each individual must choose whether to wear a helmet or not. Fine. However, publishing nonsense about helmets being hazardous to one's health, approaches the irresponsible.
I think the bikers who object to helmet laws don't like the government telling them what to do, rather than disputing the protective potential of a helmet.
Bottom line: I can respect someone's choice not to wear a helmet; however, the choice of others TO wear a helmet deserves respect also.
Refuse a helmet if you choose; however, suggesting others do the same may get someone else hurt or killed.
Tree Farmer
The "People" magazine story in this topic describes a freak accident; the Hurt Report explicitly deals with and discounts the probability of helmet-induced neck injuries.
The millions of dollars spent on research by the Snell Foundation (founded by the family of and named for a motorcycle accident victim, by the way), the National Transportation Safety Board, and other institutions on helmet safety carry more weight than a "People" magazine article, in my opinion.
Each individual must choose whether to wear a helmet or not. Fine. However, publishing nonsense about helmets being hazardous to one's health, approaches the irresponsible.
I think the bikers who object to helmet laws don't like the government telling them what to do, rather than disputing the protective potential of a helmet.
Bottom line: I can respect someone's choice not to wear a helmet; however, the choice of others TO wear a helmet deserves respect also.
Refuse a helmet if you choose; however, suggesting others do the same may get someone else hurt or killed.
Tree Farmer
Oct 20, 1999 | 12:41 PM
#4
Pro Rider
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 419
Likes: 0
It is unfortunate that the person you reference in the article had such a horrible accident. However, one bad case does not make a helmet 'unsafe' generally.
This is kind of like the Air Bag issue or ABS brakes.
Air Bags have killed or injured children sitting in the front seat. However, the MAJORITY or the time, the Air Bags lessen the injuries to the passengers or a car in an accident.
ABS Brakes are no good on ICE. However, most people may not have the concious thought to use their brakes properly to improve their steering/braking abilities. I would choose ABS.
How does this nonsense relate to wearing a helmet?
I see a helmet as a protector of my head. It is not the savior. It will not save me in all cases. However, as a friend/family member of people who have been in accidents all involving helmets, their head was the least injured. (Head on with a car, snowmobile into a tree, street bike laying down, etc.)
As a rider of ATV's I appreciate a helmet to keep the branches, roost, rain, sun, bugs, and any other obstacles from hitting my head/face. I haven't had a major wipe out yet so I don't have a comment on that. I will say that when I do have a wipe out, it won't be because I planned it, but my helmet will be on becuase it keeps my head safe in other situations.
I don't feel fearless with my helmet on.
However, no one touches my machines without one.
RM
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99 400EX 95 Scrambler 400 85 LT250R
This is kind of like the Air Bag issue or ABS brakes.
Air Bags have killed or injured children sitting in the front seat. However, the MAJORITY or the time, the Air Bags lessen the injuries to the passengers or a car in an accident.
ABS Brakes are no good on ICE. However, most people may not have the concious thought to use their brakes properly to improve their steering/braking abilities. I would choose ABS.
How does this nonsense relate to wearing a helmet?
I see a helmet as a protector of my head. It is not the savior. It will not save me in all cases. However, as a friend/family member of people who have been in accidents all involving helmets, their head was the least injured. (Head on with a car, snowmobile into a tree, street bike laying down, etc.)
As a rider of ATV's I appreciate a helmet to keep the branches, roost, rain, sun, bugs, and any other obstacles from hitting my head/face. I haven't had a major wipe out yet so I don't have a comment on that. I will say that when I do have a wipe out, it won't be because I planned it, but my helmet will be on becuase it keeps my head safe in other situations.
I don't feel fearless with my helmet on.
However, no one touches my machines without one.
RM
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99 400EX 95 Scrambler 400 85 LT250R
Oct 20, 1999 | 04:11 PM
#5
Extreme Pro Rider
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 2,858
Likes: 0
DreamOfPolaris
What is it you are trying to achieve? Yes, in that instance a helmet may have caused a loss of life, but how many sad stories like that are out there? I challenge you to find me 35 stories that state, without question, that helmets were the sole reason for death. I in turn will share my own story about a wreck that i had that changed my thinking forever, I hope that other readers will share a story about either an experience they had or saw FIRST HAND.
Here goes. I used to ride without a helmet at all times of the day and night when we make our trips to the sand dunes. it became so common place that IT began to be wierd to even wear a helmet. Then I got a membership to the local track, which required the use of a helmet as a condition of membership (thank you for that!). So Im riding along, not very fast as I was breaking in my new rebuild and getting used to the twist throttle. Unfortunately as I was rounding a turn, I caught a edge and started going onto my 2 right wheels. In an effort to hang on, I pulled the throttle and started to accelerate, which in turn caused me to pull the throttle harder. At this point I either have to bail or get pile driven into the track at 40 MPH. I bailed landing on my shoulder,collabone, and HEAD! After laying there for a moment to check all extremities for use (I had no broken bones) I get up and realized I have this pounding headache. Oh yea, my helmet was cracked near the temple area on my head. Sheild is history, helmet history, but my brain was intact (argueably!). Im not going to say it saved my life, but if I was not wearing a helmet, but I may not have been able to mentally or physically relay this post today. No matter what you are doing, whether you are riding the trails or racing the track anything can happen. Look at me, I went from 15 mph to 40 in the blink of an eye, totally unexpected. So you see, I do believe in wearing helmts at all times and hope you choose to wear a helmet instead of wasting your time trying to find 35 stories.Ok now You relay your story. RoostKing
[This message has been edited by RoostKing (edited 10-20-1999).]
What is it you are trying to achieve? Yes, in that instance a helmet may have caused a loss of life, but how many sad stories like that are out there? I challenge you to find me 35 stories that state, without question, that helmets were the sole reason for death. I in turn will share my own story about a wreck that i had that changed my thinking forever, I hope that other readers will share a story about either an experience they had or saw FIRST HAND.
Here goes. I used to ride without a helmet at all times of the day and night when we make our trips to the sand dunes. it became so common place that IT began to be wierd to even wear a helmet. Then I got a membership to the local track, which required the use of a helmet as a condition of membership (thank you for that!). So Im riding along, not very fast as I was breaking in my new rebuild and getting used to the twist throttle. Unfortunately as I was rounding a turn, I caught a edge and started going onto my 2 right wheels. In an effort to hang on, I pulled the throttle and started to accelerate, which in turn caused me to pull the throttle harder. At this point I either have to bail or get pile driven into the track at 40 MPH. I bailed landing on my shoulder,collabone, and HEAD! After laying there for a moment to check all extremities for use (I had no broken bones) I get up and realized I have this pounding headache. Oh yea, my helmet was cracked near the temple area on my head. Sheild is history, helmet history, but my brain was intact (argueably!). Im not going to say it saved my life, but if I was not wearing a helmet, but I may not have been able to mentally or physically relay this post today. No matter what you are doing, whether you are riding the trails or racing the track anything can happen. Look at me, I went from 15 mph to 40 in the blink of an eye, totally unexpected. So you see, I do believe in wearing helmts at all times and hope you choose to wear a helmet instead of wasting your time trying to find 35 stories.Ok now You relay your story. RoostKing
[This message has been edited by RoostKing (edited 10-20-1999).]
Oct 20, 1999 | 04:22 PM
#6
Extreme Pro Rider
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 2,858
Likes: 0
DOP,
One more thing. The article stated that he had no other marks on his body. Ok then, if he hit his helmet on the pavement, then surely had he not been wearing a helmet he would have hit his skull on the pavement. Do you disagree with this? If he had not been wearing helmet the article may have read differently. "Larry Mcafee died due to severe head trauma from impacting the pavement at 10 mph". (Im no reporter!) Do yo think he would have had a mark on his head from hitting the pavement? I think that chances are much greater that a person can be seriously injured or killed without a helmet, than from a freak accident caused by a helmet that you posted.
RoostKing
One more thing. The article stated that he had no other marks on his body. Ok then, if he hit his helmet on the pavement, then surely had he not been wearing a helmet he would have hit his skull on the pavement. Do you disagree with this? If he had not been wearing helmet the article may have read differently. "Larry Mcafee died due to severe head trauma from impacting the pavement at 10 mph". (Im no reporter!) Do yo think he would have had a mark on his head from hitting the pavement? I think that chances are much greater that a person can be seriously injured or killed without a helmet, than from a freak accident caused by a helmet that you posted.
RoostKing
Oct 20, 1999 | 04:58 PM
#7
Pro Rider
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 328
Likes: 1
Food for thought -
A helmet won't save you if you hit a brick wall head on at 100 mph.
Neither will seat belts or air bags, although divine intervention might.
A helmet WILL allow you to either survive and recognize you are not a vegetable, or recognize that you broke your neck and can never walk again. If you die anyway, who cares?
Most importantly, when the blue haired kamikaze driving the wandering Delta 88 just happens to forget about the light being red, a helmet might be the only weapon you can use to drive the point right into their mentally deficient head that they just made their last mistake. Who knows, you might even survive by using their head as a pillow.
We don't ride because it's safe. We ride because it isn't.
SandmanBlue
A helmet won't save you if you hit a brick wall head on at 100 mph.
Neither will seat belts or air bags, although divine intervention might.
A helmet WILL allow you to either survive and recognize you are not a vegetable, or recognize that you broke your neck and can never walk again. If you die anyway, who cares?
Most importantly, when the blue haired kamikaze driving the wandering Delta 88 just happens to forget about the light being red, a helmet might be the only weapon you can use to drive the point right into their mentally deficient head that they just made their last mistake. Who knows, you might even survive by using their head as a pillow.
We don't ride because it's safe. We ride because it isn't.
SandmanBlue
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Oct 20, 1999 | 05:32 PM
#8
Trailblazer
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
The choice of wearing a helmet is definitely with person riding the bike. But I have seen first hand more times that they saved a life rather than taking it. I had a friend that wrecked his brother's CBR 600. He hit a 1968 Chevy truck head on(truck's fault) and his head hit the hood hard....and the helmet saved his life.The helmet was ruined inside with only a few scratches on the inside, but he totaled that truck with his bike !
My cousin was flying down a trail an wrecked hitting a tree. He cracked his helmet but not his head.
I know I'll be wearing one. I guess maybe after you get an atv you may change your mind.
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Stump '99 Foreman S
My cousin was flying down a trail an wrecked hitting a tree. He cracked his helmet but not his head.
I know I'll be wearing one. I guess maybe after you get an atv you may change your mind.
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Stump '99 Foreman S
Oct 20, 1999 | 09:18 PM
#9
Pro Rider
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 257
Likes: 0
I just can't belive what i'm reading!!!If you read my post after labor day you would know that I watched two guys,father &son get killed in a jeep.Guess they were lucky that they weren't wearing helmets,As they aren't here in a wheel chair.You should have been there and seen the mess on the rocks where the jeep landed on his dad,try scraping one of your buddies off the rocks like that.The boy I'm sure would have made it,as he was straped in,which his dad wasn't.But the tree that hit him in the head was the winner,had he of been wearing a helmet I'm sure he would have made it.Saving me the grosome job of crawling into that jeep and cutting him loose.All the the time looking at the mess that was his head.You just go ahead and preach your anti-helmet sermon.But you better belive you'll not catch me without mine!!!!!
COB
COB