the new 650 is an awesome machine and in most parts of the country,
this would not be a problem.

i got mine july 21, this year and just got back from my second
ride on it. i ride in eastern kentucky where the trails are
probably a lot like the Mccoy/hatfield trails in w.va without
the helmets. i've been riding there on a king quad since 96.

the problem, while this machine has went up everything that
i have nerve to go up with no problems, coming down is a different
story.
on a king quad or any 4wd machine with a normal tranny, you can take
a break(no pun) when coming down the almost straight downs, but
on the 650 the engine braking(without any adjustments)(60 miles)
depends largely on the top notch brakes which will wear your hands
and arms out quickly. in low range on this stuff, the machine tends
to lurch and doesn't provide constant engine braking.
the engine braking is excellent except when coming down the
really steep stuff. i've heard that all you have to do is give it
a little gas. well on these trails, only a fool would do that although i have tried it(no that's not the answer).
i've also heard that kawasaki is putting out info that the
eb only works between 12 and 2 miles an hour. well that's not
what they were saying when i bought it.

any info or riding experiences is appreciated.

please don't get me wrong, it's an awesome machine, but under these
conditions if you let your speed get the least little bit too much,
you will slide out of control.

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img]

 

I may be wrong, but by what you're describing there may be something wrong with your machine. Can you describe a specific experience? Does the machine start slow then speed up because of inadequate engine braking? Thanks.

 

hi jeff,
yes it does start slow and then get faster.
the most dangerous thing is the lurching.
i'm having it serviced this thursday the 30th at
my local kawa dealer. i'm trying to give them as much info
as possible.

thanks for the input.

later
russell

 

I know what you are talking about when decending steep grades. I miss the sprag clutching action of the old Grizzly, but thats all I miss. There are two ways to handle the decents: If you want to use engine breaking without the engagement lurching which may happen suddenly at the wrong time, you must keep your speed below 2MPH. Above that, it will engage. If you stay above 2MPH and below 12MPH it will stay engaged. One problem that can happen is if you start rolling faster than 12MPH it will disengage and you will really start to gain speed. I use occasional brake application to stay within the speed range I want. The "add a little gas" thing will help the system to remain engaged when traveling at the 2MPH range. If I decend something really tricky, I put it in 2WD Low, and drag a heavy rear brake, and gently apply the front only as needed to remain below 2MPH. When it becomes so steep in spots, or when clearing an overhang and the rear end comes off the ground, I can gently ease off the front brake to settle the rear end back down and then re-apply them quickly, but gradually, all the while maintaining some braking action on the rears when they are on the ground. In 4WD, any brake application will brake hard on the front wheels which is not always a good thing. It takes some getting use to but I don't even notice it now. You can test the braking system on a medium grade by allowing the Quad to coast at the 2MPH speed. The system will engage just above 2MPH and then the braking action will slow you just below 2MPH, then it will release and you will coast downhill up to 2MPH and it will engage again and will repeat this cycle about 3 or so times a second. I always try to stay out of this "zone". There is actually some hysteresis to the actuator control, but it is too small. The bottom line to being safe on steep decents is to pre-determine on every slope what speed to use; Less than 2MPH or over 2MPH...........

 

Paririe633 nailed right on the head. Follow his instructions and in no time it will become second nature.

 

thanks for the input prairie633,

i don't think we're talking about the same conditions.
i'm talking about the really steep, wet, slick stuff that may
be over a hundred yards straight down.

there's no way you can give it a little throttle.

there's no way you can go 2 miles an hour and above. you have to creep or
get ready to jump.

under these conditions, i'm left with nothing but great brakes.

i read that engine braking works under 10 mph. btw, have you read
anything about the 12mph/2mph braking.

now if i had read in my research(which was very intensive) that
there was no engine braking under 2 miles an hour, i would be riding
a rubicon.

thanks again for the input
i'll keep you posted,
russell

 

The braking speed specs come from the service manual and is expressed in Km/h. I am not at home at this time to check, but I think the upper limit was 20Km/h which is around 12.4MPH. Then they stated two speeds for the lower limit. One speed was when the system would engage and the other for when it would disengage. The engagement speed was slightly higher to provide a small amount of hysteresis. This is suppose to prevent the servo from chattering, in the same way that a house thermostat set at 72F will turn the air conditioning on at 73F and off at 71F. If you have to go slower than 2MPH, than you will have to use just the brakes. I don't know how many Quads have effective engine braking below that speed anyway. At such slow speeds you could not slave the engine to the drivetrain because you are traveling too slow. The limit would be when you are going slower than the engine's idle speed would be based on the Quads lowest gearing. In other words, if you engaged the engine in a low gear with a manual clutch, at some point you would slow down below the engines idle speed and stall the engine. I think all engine breaking designs have to disengage at some point near the engine idle speed to prevent this? For the slick, steep stuff you are talking about, I think I would only want to use the brakes anyway to have the maximum amount of control. The more control you have and the less that the machine has is usually works the safest way on the technical stuff.......

 

Now I know what you guys are talking about. I always go down this steep hill (~150ft) in high gear. Today I tried it in low gear, and the e.b. servo was constantly go on/off the whole way down and and causing the quad to surge. The speedo stayed right at 2 mph, but the quad still would surge. From now on, I'll go down the hill in high range, and it keeps me around 3-4 mph, no surging.