Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
Feb 9, 2004 | 02:56 PM
#1
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
OK, all you EX owners please help me understand this if it's really an issue. I don't believe it is....
Whenever someone recommends a Z/KFX/DVX 400 over a 400EX the argument usually goes something like this... "You should get the Z/KFX/DVX 400 because its got reverse and LIQUID COOLING."
I'm not knocking the Z400 and it's clones, they certainly seem to be a nice bike and if I were buying a new quad today I would probably consider one strongly. I understand the reverse argument, but I don't get where liquid cooling is that big of an advantage..... I consider it possibly a liability even.
Has anyone ever had overheating problems with their EX???
Whenever someone recommends a Z/KFX/DVX 400 over a 400EX the argument usually goes something like this... "You should get the Z/KFX/DVX 400 because its got reverse and LIQUID COOLING."
I'm not knocking the Z400 and it's clones, they certainly seem to be a nice bike and if I were buying a new quad today I would probably consider one strongly. I understand the reverse argument, but I don't get where liquid cooling is that big of an advantage..... I consider it possibly a liability even.
Has anyone ever had overheating problems with their EX???
Feb 9, 2004 | 03:30 PM
#2
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
I can see where people may go with a water cooled machine just because it is the new thing to do. I have also asked this question before. Nobody has been able to give me any facts to why water cooled is better. To be honest I don't think that people understand that all quads water cooled or not will overheat without air. Therfore, technically all quads are actually air cooled. However I would guess that a water cooled quad would be able to maintain cooler temps at slower speeds.
I personally have never experienced an overheating problem. To answer your question, No it is not an issue.
I personally have never experienced an overheating problem. To answer your question, No it is not an issue.
Feb 9, 2004 | 04:03 PM
#3
Weekend Warrior
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
In general, an air cooled engine runs hotter than a water cooled angine. No biggie, as the air cooled engine is designed to run hotter. Because metals expand and contract based on heat differentials, the air cooled engine must allow looser tolerances between parts. This translates to a little less efficiency and a little less HP per CC (all other things being equal). What can be debated however is if the added weight and complexity of a water cooling system is really worth that extra couple HP!
Feb 9, 2004 | 04:04 PM
#4
Red Rider
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Honda, accept nothing less!
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
If I ride the 400EX up a long dune on a warm day, I can feel the power fading right out from under me. Ride the Z400 up the same dune, and no problem. This is the real deal!
Feb 9, 2004 | 04:49 PM
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
Originally posted by: QuadShot
What can be debated however is if the added weight and complexity of a water cooling system is really worth that extra couple HP!
What can be debated however is if the added weight and complexity of a water cooling system is really worth that extra couple HP!
This is one of those debates that could run forever, I think the point might be that the "average" rider would never note a difference while those putting the machine under extreme stress would benefit from water cooling.
Thanks folks!
Feb 9, 2004 | 05:04 PM
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
I personally have never felt the power fading, hot day or not. I would agree that you should change your oil frequently, but that's true for all quads that are ridden hard. I change my oil after about 5-6 tanks of gas.
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Feb 9, 2004 | 05:21 PM
#8
Shed Knocker Rider
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
Originally posted by: QuadShot
In general, an air cooled engine runs hotter than a water cooled angine. No biggie, as the air cooled engine is designed to run hotter. Because metals expand and contract based on heat differentials, the air cooled engine must allow looser tolerances between parts. This translates to a little less efficiency and a little less HP per CC (all other things being equal). What can be debated however is if the added weight and complexity of a water cooling system is really worth that extra couple HP!
In general, an air cooled engine runs hotter than a water cooled angine. No biggie, as the air cooled engine is designed to run hotter. Because metals expand and contract based on heat differentials, the air cooled engine must allow looser tolerances between parts. This translates to a little less efficiency and a little less HP per CC (all other things being equal). What can be debated however is if the added weight and complexity of a water cooling system is really worth that extra couple HP!
And my 440 has never overheated before, I run it a little rich just to be safe.
Feb 9, 2004 | 09:25 PM
#9
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
Quadshot said it pretty well, and I would like to add that I've never noticed heat related issues with my 400EX, and I beat the (@&$#($_@&!^&# out of it every time I ride. Sand dunes, hills, whatever I throw at it never seems to be a problem.
I chose my new Foreman 450 because it was air cooled, and I liked the simplicity and reliability the 400EX proved to me. No radiators, water pumps, or coolant lines.
Also think of this - you're in the middle of the woods, and you run a stick through your radiator. Now what are you going to do with that 400 pound water cooled beast? Get towed home by your air cooled friend ! ! !
Bottom line - unless you are going to race this machine, you most likely don't need or want water cooling.
I chose my new Foreman 450 because it was air cooled, and I liked the simplicity and reliability the 400EX proved to me. No radiators, water pumps, or coolant lines.
Also think of this - you're in the middle of the woods, and you run a stick through your radiator. Now what are you going to do with that 400 pound water cooled beast? Get towed home by your air cooled friend ! ! !
Bottom line - unless you are going to race this machine, you most likely don't need or want water cooling.
Feb 9, 2004 | 09:39 PM
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Someone please explain the liquid cooling argument...
The biggest advantage of liquid cooling is consistent engine temperature.
Yes they do run cooler, but more important, they stay the same temp under
all running and load conditions, assuming the cooling system is working properly.
An air cooled engine under light loading in cold weather will run cooler than it should
for maximum efficiency. Conversely, in warm weather under heavy load it will run
hotter than it should, both for efficiency and oil life, and engine life.
Liquid cooled engines control the temps, and therefore run at maximum effficiency
all the time, the oil holds up better, and the engine parts are less subject to wear.
Even knowing all this to be true, I still prefer air cooled, because they are less
complicated with less to fail.
Yes they do run cooler, but more important, they stay the same temp under
all running and load conditions, assuming the cooling system is working properly.
An air cooled engine under light loading in cold weather will run cooler than it should
for maximum efficiency. Conversely, in warm weather under heavy load it will run
hotter than it should, both for efficiency and oil life, and engine life.
Liquid cooled engines control the temps, and therefore run at maximum effficiency
all the time, the oil holds up better, and the engine parts are less subject to wear.
Even knowing all this to be true, I still prefer air cooled, because they are less
complicated with less to fail.