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  #21  
Old 02-04-2013, 05:15 PM
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Originally Posted by jumbofrank
Small amounts of alcohol are safe and even beneficial. But what is a safe amount of cocaine or heroin, etc.? Is any amount good for you?
valid point!

I was also thinking.... they'd (the gov't) would have to outlaw potatoes, fruit, grains & sugar from every household to keep people from making booze

whereas- you can't make heroine & cocaine & lsd from supermarket produce (well, maybe cocaine- but not without a lab and extensive knowledge in chemistry )
 
  #22  
Old 02-04-2013, 05:19 PM
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Perhaps heroin and cocaine aren't "good" for you. But Psilocybin is the best medication on Earth for Cluster headaches (The worst pain a human being can tolerate), and they have been proven to increase Hippocampal Neurogenesis, as well as a long term depression treatment. In a study commissioned by John Hopkins University, it was found found that of the 18 adults involved in the study, who were given five doses of the active ingredient in "Magic Mushrooms" (Psilocybin), fourteen months after completing the study, 94% of the participants called the experience one of the top five most meaningful experiences of their lives. 39% called it the most meaningful experience of their entire lives. The average age of participants was 46 years old, 78% percent of them participated regularly in Religious activities, and none of them had prior drug history.

All those positive effects, and yet Psilocybin is still a schedule 1 drug, meaning it has no legitimate medical use, and has a high potential for abuse. LSD is being studied for similar benefits.

Though, to me, it doesn't really matter if there are health benefits to using a drug. It still isn't a choice I'd make for someone else. But yes, a lot of Schedule 1 drugs do have health benefits.

Beergut, I too think that it's a cultural thing, it would be impossible to take away everyone's alcohol. I just wish we'd grant people more control over their bodies.
 
  #23  
Old 02-04-2013, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Lolumad273
Perhaps heroin and cocaine aren't "good" for you. But Psilocybin is the best medication on Earth for Cluster headaches (The worst pain a human being can tolerate), and they have been proven to increase Hippocampal Neurogenesis, as well as a long term depression treatment. In a study commissioned by John Hopkins University, it was found found that of the 18 adults involved in the study, who were given five doses of the active ingredient in "Magic Mushrooms" (Psilocybin), fourteen months after completing the study, 94% of the participants called the experience one of the top five most meaningful experiences of their lives. 39% called it the most meaningful experience of their entire lives. The average age of participants was 46 years old, 78% percent of them participated regularly in Religious activities, and none of them had prior drug history.

All those positive effects, and yet Psilocybin is still a schedule 1 drug, meaning it has no legitimate medical use, and has a high potential for abuse. LSD is being studied for similar benefits.

Though, to me, it doesn't really matter if there are health benefits to using a drug. It still isn't a choice I'd make for someone else. But yes, a lot of Schedule 1 drugs do have health benefits.

Beergut, I too think that it's a cultural thing, it would be impossible to take away everyone's alcohol. I just wish we'd grant people more control over their bodies.

When I started working at Abbott Biopharmaceutical, one of our classes discussed how most "hard-core" drugs were invented to alleviate / cure side effect symptoms and ailments caused by other medications / disease. Drugs like Cocaine, heroin and morphine were widely used in medicines by Bayer in the 17th, 18th & 19th centuries- was a very informative and interesting class.
 
  #24  
Old 02-04-2013, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Lolumad273
Well I don't believe making any of those drugs illegal will really curb their use. Most drugs aren't nearly as dangerous as Krokodil. Most people who take Heroin, and similar opiates are not really concerned with what the law says, they're going to take the drug anyway. Most people wouldn't take heroin though, due to its addictive nature. So really the law serves no purpose.

I think that making drugs illegal alienates people with real drug problems, and makes it difficult for those responsible users to enjoy their drugs. Yes, I do believe that when hallucinogens are concerned, there is such a thing as responsible drug use.

I know a lot more people who have ended up in the hospital from Alcohol consumption than have from LSD, MDMA, Cocaine, or Psilocybin... and obviously Marijuana. I'm glad we can agree on Marijuana.
I beg to differ. Around here herion is just as easy to get as pot and many times cheaper. When the ignorant take drugs to party most of the time they dont care what it is as long as no needles are involved. Because they are not hardcore users and dont intend to be. The problem is the addictive nature of so many of the drugs out there.
Not quite sure where to go from here because there are so many angles to this discussion....
The legalize drugs issue has to be looked at in 2 different way. Theory and reality.
Theory- should the feds be able to tell you what you can put in your body? I dont think so.
Reality- What would happen if 25+% of the 300+ million people in this country tried to to go about their daily business high or (temp insane)?
If you feel drugs should be legal I think you should go to a methadone clinic or a rehab facility and talk to some of the people there.
Have you ever been to any of those places?
 
  #25  
Old 02-04-2013, 05:49 PM
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remember.... if you ban potatoes, fruit, grains & sugar- then only criminals will own potatoes, fruit, grains & sugar
 
  #26  
Old 02-04-2013, 05:54 PM
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Most people wouldn't take heroin though, due to its addictive nature. So really the law serves no purpose.
having an addictive substance that's know to harm you doesn't stop people from buying cigarettes or keep alcoholics from drinking...... I think people are more afraid of the illness than they are of the "addiction."
 
  #27  
Old 02-04-2013, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by jgar
If you feel drugs should be legal I think you should go to a methadone clinic or a rehab facility and talk to some of the people there.
Have you ever been to any of those places?
I've been involved in dealing with addicts first hand, from 12 year old's to 23 year old's- not fun, in fact, it's down right scary and sad.
 
  #28  
Old 02-04-2013, 05:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Lolumad273
Perhaps heroin and cocaine aren't "good" for you. But Psilocybin is the best medication on Earth for Cluster headaches (The worst pain a human being can tolerate), and they have been proven to increase Hippocampal Neurogenesis, as well as a long term depression treatment.
Remember Oxycontin is one of the best pain killers out there.
I feel there should be some considerations for drugs that are 100% natural.
 
  #29  
Old 02-04-2013, 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by beergut
I've been involved in dealing with addicts first hand, from 12 year old's to 23 year old's- not fun, in fact, it's down right scary and sad.
I have been to a methadone clinic many times. Thank god not for myself.
My best friend through school had his father die in his arms in a alley behind a bar from a heroin OD. 2 yrs later my friend died from a heroin OD.
I had 1 buddy who started smoking crack . 1 month later he kidnapped his 2 yr old daughter. I helped his GF search for her. 10 hours later we found her in a abandon house (crack house) a few towns over surrounded by strung out junkies drooling on themselves.
There were many more.
All of them I tried to help in every way shape and form. But when you get hooked, its game over.
On a side note I dont even smoke pot anymore. But back in the day I did do drugs. When you see someone turn into a addict it changes things.
 
  #30  
Old 02-04-2013, 06:25 PM
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I don't think I went through a single week in high school 100% sober or grounded
The USMC saved my *** more than my parents realize I owe my drill instructors my life- not a single day passes that I'm not grateful for what my recruiter did for me (he pulled some strings with my high school )
hehehe-

me on graduation day...........

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