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How do you make the AC handle better.

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Old Jul 1, 2007 | 01:20 AM
  #11  
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

I failed to mention but it is interesting to note that with in addition of the obvious benefits that wheel spacers offer they also will increase your ground clearance (GC).
Your axles are set in about a 35-40 degree angle if you increase the distance (which you are doing with wheel spacers) then you basically get the same degree of lift. For example if you increase the distance one inch then at 35-40 degrees you would get about 40 percent of the width of the spacer in height gain (close to 1/2 inch). A spacer on each side will get you close to an inch more GC. It is actually more close to 1/2 - 3/4 inch because I don't want to measure the angle of the axle and do the math tonight for exact figures. I only wanted to introduce the principle and geometrics of it.
Want more GC, more stability, more wheel travel and a host of other benefits just add wheel spacers.
This is how I got about 13 inches of GC from a 12 inch machine. Actually when I am sitting on my machine I have about 13.5 inches on both front and rear. I think from the factory I had over 12 inches to start with. I also have over 11.5 inches of wheel travel as apposed to 10 inches (wheel spacers did that too)...
 
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Old Jul 5, 2007 | 10:00 PM
  #12  
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

I have a 2007 artic cat 700 my opinion the front suspension can't be set stiff enough. I have encounter under heavy braking and turning the weight will still unload to the front end. Recently i have put the front tires up to max air pressure and it feels more stable. All of our riding is rough terrain and serious up and down hills. Can you offer any information.
 
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Old Jul 5, 2007 | 10:07 PM
  #13  
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

Not much more than what is in the very first post.
If you have a specific situation, you need to tell me what is going on and what you want to change. And what you want it do do differently.
 
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Old Jul 6, 2007 | 04:26 PM
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

I love reading this post and have learned a thing or two. Now I have a question .. I am on a 00' AC 400 with no adjustment on the springs .. Do the same principles apply ? Also I have a solid rear axle. Would the same hold true for that as well or does it change a bit because of the setup of the machine?
 
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Old Jul 6, 2007 | 06:34 PM
  #15  
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

Everything is the same regardless of IRS (independent rear suspension) or SRA (single rear axle). It is all about weight transfer, the loading and unloading of weight to the front and rear, left and right.
Unfortunately since you don't have adjustments for preloads, that there is not much that you can do - short of changing springs. You can however, do some adjustments with your tire pressures (tires are like mini springs).
The other thing that you can do is, if you can get a hold of an old truck tire (any thick tire), you can cut pieces so that they fit between the rings of your springs (nascar - spring rubbers). This will give you a way to stiffen the springs a little.
Your body has weight and when on the machine you can use that weight (body english) to assist in the handling. Sometimes sitting more forward or rearward, leaning forward or backward, and also doing this left and right can assist in the handling.
You can also add wheel spacers for a wider stance and that will help tremendously.
The biggest issue with all ATV's is to make sure that there is no 'roll-under' from the front tires. This single condition can make a great difference.
 
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Old Jul 6, 2007 | 07:57 PM
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

So if I just cutup a tire and put pieces between the rings on the spring I can use that as a make shift adjuster to stiffen my springs ? I am guessing I want to do this for the front only correct?

Stupid question ... I do I hold the pieces there ?
 
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Old Jul 6, 2007 | 08:35 PM
  #17  
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

You would have to make sure that the thickness of the old truck tire was thicker than the distance between your spring rings. Then cut a circle out of the tires to be larger than the diameter of your springs. Then cut a center hole in the rubber to accomodate the shock diameter itself then cut the ring so that you can get it in between the springs. It wold look like a big 'C'.
Well you can make them for the front or back depends what you need. If your machine is pushing in a turn (doesn't turn good and wants to go straight - plows) then you want to make the rear more stiff. If it is sliding the back too much (even to the point of counter steering - steering the opposite direction) in a turn then you want to make the front more stiff.
I would start by making sure that my front tires are not rolling under. Start with 5 lbs in all tires then go up 1 lb at a time on just the front tires and see what changes in the handling characteristics. Or you could start with the fronts at 12-14lbs and come down on pressure - this is the way I do it - I only have to add air once then let some out as I go until I feel that it is turning good and the side walls are not rolling under.
Once you have the front end pretty well set then the rest of the work is done with the rear. Either spring stiffness or tire pressures.
A confusing situation is a feeling that when you go into a turn that you seem like you want to do a nose dive over the outside front. You may feel that the front needs to be more stiff, but in fact what is happening is that the front is too stiff and plowing and the front tire is rolling under and when it hooks up (by this time you have loaded way too much weight from the rear to the front - and it dips) it sort of snaps and gives you a feeling like you want to do a handstand on the handle bars or that the machine is going to tuck and roll. The fix is not to increase the front spring rate but to increase the tire pressures and decrease the front springs. This way the front can squat (from a moderate loading of weight) and grip and the side walls on the tire will not tuck under, and the back will just unload enough to follow the front.
The more your machine pushes in a turn the more the rear will keep trying to load the front with more weight until it turns or you slow down enough to cause the back to stop loading the front. This is why a soft front end will load quickly and squat and go into the turn (but you need to have your tire sidewalls stiff enough not to roll under). The rear at this point will stop trying to load the front and will just follow it. If the rear is too stiff it may slide because of the momentum from loading the front and if the front is in the turn the rear just loads it to the outside and thus a slide. Remember, a body in motion tends to stay in motion until an equal or greater apposing force acts on it.
If a moving ball is met with resistance (bat) it reacts violently in the opposite direction (too stiff on the front) but if the ball is met with a soft catchers mitt, it just absorbs the energy and stops (soft front springs).
I hope this has helped.
 
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Old Jul 6, 2007 | 09:11 PM
  #18  
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

Here is something fun you can do.
On dirt - like a dirt road or some such. Start driving in a big circle and keep increasing your speed and note what the front is doing. Are the tires really scuffing hard, are they just tracking good. At some speed they will start to scuff and push. Note that speed.
Then add about 25-50 lbs to your front rack and do the same thing. If you can reach a higher speed before the front starts to scuff and push that means your front springs are too stiff or the rear is too soft.
Then put the added weight on the rear rack and do the same thing. If you reach a higher speed before the front starts to scuff and push that means the front springs are too soft or the rear too stiff.
There is no balance this is only done to give you an idea where to concentrate your efforts. Either it be making the front stiffer or softer, and the same holds true for the rear.
 
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Old Jul 7, 2007 | 03:26 AM
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

Also you must factor in the terrain. I dropped my front to the second lowest setting,increased front pressure to 9 lbs,left the rear setting on the third setting and decreased pressure to 5 psi.I did this on Wed. after reading Buckaroo's post.Went riding in dry and semi wet terrain and handling was greatly improved(thanks Buckaroo!). But today after a hard rain and the ground soaked, I found the front gripped the good ole Mississippi red clay a little to much when attempting donuts.The back started lifting up and wanted to tip as the front dug in during the sharp turn.Just have to learn the limits of the suspension on different surfaces.
 
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Old Jul 7, 2007 | 10:58 AM
  #20  
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Default How do you make the AC handle better.

If the front was gripping too good going into a turn, this means the rear is too stiff. You may want to try setting the rear preload to 2 instead of 3 or you can sit a little further back (body english), Play around with it and you will find a setting that is pretty good for you.

Disregard what I just said I forgot that you said the rear was lifting and the front wanted to tuck - Decrease the front tire pressure and or the front preloads. The front did not take the weight soon enough and the rear kept trying to load more and trying to drive the front into the ground and ended up overloading the front and then attemped to put even more by lifting (this means that the rear had too much traction and did not give up enough weight to the front soon enough to become light and loose). In wet conditions the rear should have simulated or actually been loose going into the turn and slid out very easily - thus you are too stiff in the front.

I get a brain cramp every now and then, maybe I should take reading lessons so I can read more closely as to what you said.... lol...
 
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