That new Honda unicam motor is only 65 lbs! What does a DS motor weigh? I am itching to build a frame... I didn't get that wrecked Raptor, somebody local scooped it up...I really like the DS motor better anyway....So, to build an under 400 lb DS or a full IRS DS?
Maybe both, maybe a lightweight conventional swing arm for starts anyway...I have a new TIG welder picked out, a Miller Synchrowave 180 SD, $1,509, Delivered, from Ram Welding Supplies I've dealt with them for years, I bought my MIG from them, they are out of, like, Fresno, Ca. Great source for discount welding supplies.
Anyway, I think an under 400 lb. DS is possible, I know at least half of that weight savings could come from frame and suspension. I am talking 4130 chrome-moly frame TIG welded with Aluminum swing arm,
and eventual IRS. Drive train components for the IRS is much more difficult than the suspension.
Weight study. Take a DS apart and weigh each component. Then do the same with a Raptor, a 250R,whatever. Figure out where the "FAT" is on the DS...get rid of it.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img]

 

Motor-102LBS.

Swing arm-35LBS.

These are actual weights. If your basing the 65 LBS. for the Honda engine on advertized weight, I think you might want to check it for your self. I'm sure it's lighter than the Rotax, but I doubt the difference is 35LBS.

 

Ouch, 35 lb Swingarm? Well there's a bunch of weight just in the A-arms and swing arm. An aftermarket aluminum swingarm, maybe in a minus one inch and stock lengths could be a decent selling item. Imagine an A-arm/swing arm package well under a grand that saved 35 lbs, fixed the steering geometry, and lightened the front end. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img]

 

With the weight of the DS, and the way alot of people ride it, I'm more concerned about the strength of suspension componenent than there weight. If I had them built light weight, and they broke, I could open myself up to liability issues. The arms I have are slightly lighter than stock, chomoly, and fully adjustable. The swing arm [in stock length or possibly minus 1"] will be a hybrid of chomoly and mild steel. It will be lighter than stock, but how much lighter I don't know yet. My extended swing arms will be completely chomoly, patterend after the stock arm, and slightly lighter[not bad considering it's extended]. The prototype should be done today so I will be able to tell you the weight savings next week.

 

Well hey, a swingarm from you is gonna cost me a lot less money than a new welder! Hah! An Aluminum swingarm would be a bunch more dough to get right, probably need a pulse TIG or MIG welder. Have you seen Miller's new Pulser Millermatic? pretty sweet, single phase, all in one package, affordable. Pulse TIG machines are up there. Chrome-moly is a sweet way to go.
.....Now that you've got this covered, I'll have to go back to the drawing board...or first the "thinking throne". I'm finishing up a garbage trailer right now. A job I want to finish and never repeat.
.....A full frame would save some weight, but bang for the buck, probably not much bang for a lot of bucks. I think you are right on working with the appendages. Plus one A-arms (wheelbase) along with a minus one swingarm would make an interesting DS for MX. It would certainly jump better. No big motor mods or it would stand right up.
.....Keep up the good work, I feel a need to go to the "thinking throne"....Damn, I need a good project to buy that new welder!![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img]

 

hey fourlix, I have plus 1 forward and plus 1 wider a-arms from knutz concepts, they are incredible, I ride mostly mx and whoa what a differance. get yourself a set, as far as a minus 1 swingarm goes, well I now have a 17t sprocket which moved the rear wheels a little forward, and if I get a 760 kit the minus 1 swingarm might be pushing it, don't wanna wheelie like a raptor.

 

This is getting interesting... I have the TimmyBoy upper A-arms, which fixes the caster problem but makes no change to the width or wheelbase. Do Knutz's A-arms lower the front end any? The opportunity exists here to lower an inch as well as widen and lengthen. I'm sure I could sell my TimmyBoys, not on here of course, but if someone were to e-mail ME or send me a private message I could tell them how to get a really good deal...Then while I'm up in Vegas for my birthday, around Oct. 12, I could pick up the new A-arms and a CDI box from Knutz. Or,, build a set of lowers to go with the TimmyBoys. But I am intrigued by Knutz's A-Arms,,, Do they lower it any?[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

i have no objection of you selling your **** here lol, no they didn't lower it they put the shock mounts in the proper place, you get more wheel travel though so your shocks have to work slightly harder(obviously), i made no adjustments to my stock shocks and theres almost no differance in feeling, but insane Ryan exploded $1000 elkas in 30 minutes, jumping 110 ft at 25ft high is hard on shocks, anyway they revalved them and will be here today, the a-arms held up to him punishing them even after he blew the shock seals, oh and i sold that set of a-arms right away, now i get tons of emails from people wanting them, hmmmmm.....well i guess i wont say i have a set of lowers for sale for $100.00

 

Now you're getting the hang of it...SO what is the price of the full set of Knutz's A-arms? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

he reads this, ask him. probably 650.00 but with the new changes the price may have changed to, and like BOOM the lower a-arms are sold, guess the things i post for sale aren't **** huh fourlix, the things you said nobody wants are wanted by somebody. and i just don't understand why i can't offer a lending hand to guys in need of parts they are having problems getting, a guy called me saying he ordered a lower a-arm over a month ago, he'll get them from me in a couple days for half the price, so i ask whats the harm in that? and if anyone has parts they want to get rid of for a ds let me know, maybe i need a garage orniment or something lol.