i meant i tried howstuffworks.com but didnt find that info [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

Oh. Ok. I had just found the site a little while before I posted it. I think I did a search with the words torque-sensing.

 

thats where i screwed up, i was looking for Differential

 

Well after just buying an 02 Rancher 4x4 recently and having a 99 Suzuki King Quad I think I can comment on both. Even though I love the KQ because I'm strictly a utility type user I understand it's biggest shortcomings....under powered and overweight. With that out of the way this quad has basically been unchanged for over 10 years. During this time it has had a selectable locking front diff. The original design was where you could only lock the front diff while in Super Low range(safety). Of course someone figured how to bypass that and I can lock the diff in any range. However locking the diff is NOT something I do while going down the road. Mostly hill climbing and while in the mud.

So if Suzuki can put in a locking dif in the late 80's ATV, then why Honda hasn't chosen to do so on the newer quads surprises me. Not just the 04's but the 2000, 2001, etc models.

I believe the Rincon is also the first Honda with 4 wheel independent suspension. Another KQ first. Why so long for that? If it's good now why wasn't it good 5 years ago? After riding both quads this weekend I can actually tell some difference in the two suspensions. I could see where the independent suspension would be nicer in something like rock crawling.

 

I see this is still a topic that is being beaten to death and then some. I'll add to it what I've encountered over the years. I will also comment on Andy's trick of jacking the quad up and holding a front tire as I've tried it already on our 450ES and Rubicon. We've also owned many Polaris' in the past and I will comment on them.

There are many occasions where limited slips do not cut it. They will eventually be the cause of you not making it out of a mudhole, up a hill, through the snow, etc. Compared to true four wheel drives (which brings up another debate as to whether Polaris can be called a true 4 wheel drive as when going downhill and not being in 4 necessarily when the button is hit), limited slips can accomplish most jobs. For most people it will be all they need. But with all the gizmos today's ATV's have they should have lockers on the front. And I would imagine the answer to why Honda does not is they're probably trying to figure out a way to have a locker AND last for many many years AND to get around the patents of the other machines.

Andy's test to jack the machine up and grab a front tire reveals a huge difference between an older Honda and a newer one with the torque sensing front diff. I did this test on a 450ES and it was easy to stop a front tire when giving it gas. Then I tried it on the Rubicon and although it was easy to stop it at just over an idle, hitting the gas would rip it out of my arms. It could not be held when the gas was pushed quickly.

Polaris' on demand system is a good system when the machine is new. And I'm saying this from experience as at one time we were an all Polaris family. In time the plates in the front hubs wear and when they do this they either stop engaging, engage when you don't want them to, or won't disengage. On the Sportsman 500 we had, there were a few times when only one front wheel would engage and the other one wouldn't. Talk about a hard machine to steer! My Uncle's Xplorer 500 did all the snow plowing of this last winter without using 4wd-because it didn't work!

Ok, enough with the rambling. This is my experiences with what we've had in the past. You have to give Polaris credit though as it's hard telling if there would be a Kaw 700, Grizz 660, Rincon, etc. if it wasn't for them. If there were, non would probably have a locker and non would probably have IRS or automatics. rooster

 

Limited slip is most certainly true 4 wheel drive ! It just has some disadvantages in difference situations. A limited slip diff will apply power to both wheels as long as both wheels have close to equal traction as in mud or deep snow. It will put more power to the wheel with the least traction and that is why if one wheel is in the air or one wheel is on ice only one will spin. For most situations you would probably never know the difference. Climbing rocks and stumps and such are better accompised with a locker. In street cars most have a limited slip because both tires will have equal traction, But with trucks they are most often lockeing differentials. A locking diff is a great feature, But for most people not a necessaty. Just my two cents.

 

I am in the process of reading that Popular Mechanics article that i accessed from the above link...i've only read a page so far....who wrote that....am i missing something...Rubicon 400?.....Rancher 250?

 

Nothing stopped me from going to Highlifter and buying a locker. You can choose from the cheap $35 one (hard steering) or the more expensive detroit locker one (easy steering, bullit proof, just ask Nascar). Now I have a reliable set up that is still part of the simplistic design of Honda.

 

Correct! Excellent post! Limited slip differentials do, in fact, send power to both wheels. As long as there is EQUAL (or close to equal) traction to both wheels. Where as an "open" differential only powers one wheel. To demonstrate an open differential, I can take my vehicle and put the rear end on a jack and put it in gear. Only ONE tire will spin! If it has a limited slip differential, both will spin! I know this topic has been beaten to death, but some people still think that Hondas are ALWAYS "3wd" and that's not true at all.

 

OK so you buy a locker, so then it would be nice to ride in 2WD only, so you buy the Warn 424. So you've spent $300 on something that should be there in the first place. As far as I'm concerned, honda is at the bottom of the inovation scale. But because it's Honda nobody questions "why did it take so long to come out" when they FINALLY DO come out with something that everyone else has had.

Oh when you jack up a car with an open diff I believe the RR will turn forward and the LR will turn backwards. This is because of the spiders inside. An a LS gets weaker and weaker over time. The clutches will and do wear out. One way to prevent this is to ride in a straight line...all the time. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]