They'll use anything they can for ammo. Well, I guess this one does say trail damage not enviromental though. They believe that ohrv trails should be for walking and biking too. When was the last time you saw a walker registering his shoes or a bicycler registering their bicycle? It's our money that goes to building and maintaining these trails. As far as damage I don't think the ute guys would see their ruts as damage as they can still pass fine. Just as we wouldn't see our ruts as damage. Our ruts aren't as deep, maybe a couple inches on the highly traveled or wet sections.

 

It is hard to say which has the POTENTIAL of doing more damage. I think the real place you need to look is the person on the seat... Any rider can cause damage if they refuse to act responsibly while operating their quads. Being aware of the potential damage, and knowledgeble in techniques designed to minimize the impact their machine can do is the key to keeping the damage to the minimum.

Also, I have to point a finger to some of the tire manufacturers out there. I think in some respect, they are too good...

 

While this is true to a degree, the trail was being churned up more by the 4x's at 5 mph than I had been doing while cruising around at a speed that averaged more like 25 or 30mph. Personally I would love to have an IRS utility to play around on, so I am not really looking to knock them. I just found it sad that this particular facility has a decent set of trails and a lot of potential for the landowner, but he has had to basically shut down in part due to big 4x4's rutting the place out. No solid rear axle quad can make ruts as deep these without running rediculously huge tires.

 

I think a lot of people go for the most aggressive tire they can find. Personally, I have hloeshots. They work great for most situations and barely leave any evidence you were there. You can ride accross a lawn and not leave a mark, yet they can pull you right through a mud hole.

 

With holeshots, I assume you are talking a sport machine then. You are half the weight of the normal 4x4 Ute. I also think the actual 4 wheel drive is causing some issues. Most are locked diffs with their solid rear axles.. and the technology used in the fronts is only now starting to deal with the uneven rate of spin that occurs when turning. All this adds to the tearing up of grass etc.

I still think however it is the person pulling on the bars that may contribute the most to the situation. Let's face it, every guy with a sport Ute has on occasion taken their machine out to see just how deep they can get it stuck in the mud and still pull through. It doesn't take too long or too many folks running through a mud hole or on soft ground, and you have the ruts.

I have to point a finger at your local area owner though as well. There is a lot to be said about proper trail design, that eliminates the potential problem areas.. and most importantly, there is the subject of trail maintenence that should be addressed. Some of us have ridden large trail systems, and we can say from experience that maintaining trails is a full time job. Proper building technique is important because it keeps that effort to manageble levels.

I know there will be a lot of howling over the lame trails when grooming is introduced.. but it is a far side better to have a well groomed albiet lamer trail, then no trail at all. The real reason we ride is to get off the couch and away from all the hassles of our 'Normal" life... I can deal with Lame trails...

 

Well, there are some grooming issues definately. I am just a third party out of the loop and am not out to sully anyone (or any organizations') name. From what I have gathered though, there are certain entities that had promised monies and labor for trail maintenance to this particular trail owner in return for the use of his land. What was offered and what has, in actuality been given are significantly different amounts. Kind of upsetting as I am a member of this organization, at least until my current membership runs out[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-mad.gif[/img]

 

Yup.. that is the normal deal with clubs taking on these kinds of responsibilities, then nobody stepping up to the plate. It is a tough deal, since we all have other things to do for the most part.... I don't know what the answer is.. it is a shame.. since the land owner is just going to be left with a very bad taste in his mouth, and the club riders will be without another in a long list of trails that could have been saved...

 

Here's my experience.

There is a public park out by me they open to sleds and quads in the winter. (Scoot86, Chestnut Ridge outside Buffalo if you're interested). It's like 95% sleds there. Well they pack the snow down pretty good. I come out in my 350# sport quads and ride on top of the snow pack. I've seen some people with sport ute's weighing twice that much, aftermarket tires, and they dig right through the pack down to gravel/grass.

The ute's definitely tear up a trail more just because of their weight, and make it worse if they have the mudder tires

 

Let me guess................NYTRO?

 

I am not a NYTRO member, no. I really don't want to publicly slam this particular entity yet, as I think they COULD offer a good product with some work. Unfortunately, I have had and heard more negatives than positives this past year.

BTW, I would love to ride Chestnut Ridge with you. Hit me up with a PM if you have a date in mind.