Moto,
sounds like you dont know a damn thing about Michigans ORV trail system?

Do you have ANY idea WHY you pay 16.25 for a ORV sticker?Did'nt think so?

With over 165 thousand registered ORV users in Mich,ORV insurance is a good idea for all.What happens if you get one of your four ATVs stolen or run into a tree and injure yourself or someone else,lets hear about how expensive insurance is than?Do you enjoy not being able to ride county roads and forest roads in lower Mich?

Sounds like I just want to make some money with me being an instructor?I invite YOU to a FREE [YES,for YOU,,NO CHARGE]ATV safety/education class.Come on in and show the money hungry ''instructor''all you know about Michigans ORV system and how to become a safe and more responsable ATVer.With the vast amount of user knowledge you displaced in your above post,im sure you'll impress the hell out of me??

A wise man once said,
it is better to leave your mouth shut and pretend you know nothing,than to open it and remove all doubt?

Bill

 

MUDDY4LIFE, TOPFLOP, or whatever,

Yea, I know about the trails here, that's why I ride out of state. They're not worth the $16.25 or the drive to get there. They're also about as challenging as walking to the mailbox but that's probably all you can handle.

Thanks for your concern but my homeowners ins. covers my quads from theft and my health ins. covers me if I get hurt. I haven't needed any ins. in the nearly 20 years I've been riding and don't see a need for any in the future.

As for being able to ride on the roads, what's the fun in that?

I'll pass on your offer, thanks. If I doubt there's anything YOU can teach me that's worth knowing.

I think you need to take your own advice.

SMC

 

MR know it all[moto],
Its funny that you have no issue's spending thousands of dollars on your four ATVs,but wont get off your tight a$$ wallet to spend 16.25 a yr to support your own States trail system.

The truth of the matter is I'd rather see attitudes like yours ride outside of out State anyway!Folks like YOU are usually the ones that know very little about Michigans ORV trail systems or the laws regarding them and that screws it up for the safe and responsable riders like myself and MANY others.

Go screw up in Ohio,I hear them calling you.

 

You can say what you want about how our present training system is operating; but have we reached the point where there are 'more' instructors than there are kids to train? In other words, is this part-time (what I certainly would describe as 'noble') business venture; staying somewhat profitable enough for all those who at least want to break even at it?(including any 'non-profit' related tax breaks that such a designation legally entitles?).

You can ask any state or club official in this state........Do they believe that all the kids are getting trained that should be trained?
Don't quote me on these figures; but I believe the agregate % of youths pulled over by law enforcement lately, WITHOUT TRAINING. is up around 84% or higher.
The Department of Education can't properly fund the best program (that Richard Rondeau/MATVA started) we currently have; which is more reasonably teaching our kids to ride what they've got; instead of working within the age/size restrictions we have previously been slave to. There is no doubt that this has been a huge step in this state's training evolution and ALL parties involved in this(the club and the trainers themselves)should certainly be commended for working WITH state officials(more kudos) to get this done.

To get to my point; wether you agree with teaching adults in the future or not; let's at least focus on training 'kids' to the point where there are 'too many' instructors(which drives down median training prices outside the DOE grant) and will hopefully allow any future adult-oriented training programs to be administered through many entities, instead of just one (which would hopefully help keep an expanded "trainer's" market: still viable and somewhat competitive).

Right now, with the state budget having no record of ever being able to truly 'keep up' (financially) with kids getting properly trained in even (primarily) S.E. MI. ................................................I would think that our main focus would be in continually setting up trainers in rural areas until our vast state was at least 'covered'. If this outreach program could 'only' be administered through the MATVA and they were exclusively benefitting from it (monitored, as now, by the D.O.E); 'so be it'; they must be the only ones interested enough to administer it. If it could be administered more easily; without having these potential trainers going through the hoops of establishing their own 'non-profits' (which we certainly have enough of 'everywhere')to do the exact same thing..........all the better.

But until all these kids have at least a few different trainers to pick from in their general areas and the market for the youth training program STATEWIDE, somewhat 'saturates' through pure numbers and (hopefully) increased funding from the state itself .............................I think it would be a mistake to jump 'right into' mandatory training of adults(which I don't think Bill implied) until we get a good handle on this potential (and ongoing) problem of kids 'with' or 'without' training; getting hurt/killed and/or being irresponsible in their behavior.

Let's first make sure that most of these kids truly 'desire' their training/certificates at least as much as their future driver's licenses. Since there is no way we could possibly ever run a probation system; as is the case with their temporary licenses..................maybe the word (and accompanying legislation) needs to get out; that future penalties for non-compliance with this program are more than probably the average teenager can financially afford to handle?

You want to see kids 'volunteering' to go get training?......................................... .....I truly hate to do this that way; but until we start even having a 'shot' at identifying these outlaw riders (whatever age they are)through larger registered numbers (at even 'more' administrative cost) we desperately need to start giving law enforcement these specific fine-based funds; in order to deal with those who 'just don't care' and are now only being handled through the traditional interdiction methods that law enforcement have had at their disposal.

As much as I'd like to see all our trails get in better shape; I almost think that basic 'fear of god' enforcement, might just be right up there with basic trail maintenance(and behind safety training); in stopping the bleeding that our sport is somewhat silently suffering in the eyes of those who ( state officials, corporations, legislators and other clubs) posess most of the future potential for our support.

If our primary focus isn't on keeping (especially young) riders 'trained' and 'on the trail'.............not one of these four groups mentioned above, will be even remotely interested in any of the next steps that we may propose to take forward with them.
And if somebody can't figure out that issues such as the 'zero tolerance' drinking program spearheaded by 'sledders'; aren't actually multi-organizational efforts aimed at, basically, saving the sport itself................. they probably won't pay much attention to issues like 'these' that threaten to sink ours.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

Wopflop,

Why would I want to spend $16.25 (X4) on an ORV sticker to ride trails I never use? And how can I screw up your precious trails if I never use them? It's the 'safe and responsable riders' like you that use the trails that should pay for them. Maybe ATV's need to be treated the same as snowmobiles with a low priced, multi year, registration sticker and a special yearly trail permit?

The first time I met you I thought you were an arrogant, big mouthed, Jackass and my opinion hasn't changed.

Adios,

 

Moto,
at least this big mouthed arrogant jackass does,'nt SIT around his PC and bitch about how poor Michigans ORV system is and do NOTHING about it but COMPLAIN and insult others that try and help out the sport.

This big mouthed arrogant jackass INVOLVES himself in training others in the safe and responsable use of ATVs to a variety of ages.I make suggestions and show my support to my sport by attending ORV Board meetings on a regular basis.I support the DNR by giving a voluntary wk end ATV safety class in conjuntion with boater safety,hunting saftey,and gun safety.I assist in trail maintenance and clean ups.

Whenever a person deals with the public,he/she CANT make EVERYONE happy.Im sorry you feel the way you do about me,but trust me,for every person that dislikes me,theres a thousand that support me.

So far,
I have a 1000 that support me!

 

Yea, I'm sure your MATVA buddies think you're great, all 265 of them. Problem is that you're all going nowhere fast.

Good-bye Wop4life!

 

Im not claiming that MATVA is the greatest thing since the string bikini,however,the mere fact that Mi riders NOW have a common place to converse about rides and discuss ATV related issues,is a start in the right direction.Prior to MATVA,it would be very difficult to muster up a wk end ride with just a few buddies.Now with the MATVA Forum,we post rides WKs in advance and allways have 15 plus riders for most every outing?We just did Leota over the past wk end and had 40 plus riders.Most any wk end,you can find folks that ride,before the MATVA Forum,this was IMPOSSIBLE.

You claim MATVA is going nowhere fast with 265 MATVA Forum members?Your stupidity and arrogance does not suprize me.Why just about a yr ago when we first formed the new MATVA Forum,we started with 1 member.Today,that SAME membership has rose to 265 users and is GROWING weekly.MATVA was formed a few yrs back and also started with 1 member.Today,membership has grow to around 800 members and is growing daily.

Where was Michigan riders going BEFORE MATVA?The same place YOU currently are headed!

Out of State and riding by yourself.You must lead one BORING life!!!!

 

I do the majority of my riding in state, most every weekend, as I have been for nearly 20 years now thank you very much. I didn't need MATVA then and I sure don't need them/you now. I also have many friends/family to ride with. What's BORING is going on a ride with you MATVA clowns, something that could easily be done on a golf cart.

 

MOTO,
QUOTES,

''I know about the trails here,thats why I ride out of State,there not worth the 16.25 or the drive to get there''

''Why would I want to spend 16.25 [x4]on an ORV sticker to ride trails that I never use''

''And how can I screw up your precious little trails if I never use them''

HE THAN ''CONTRADICTS'' HIMSELF WITH HIS LAST POST BY QUOTING,

''I do the majority of my riding in State,most every wk end,I have been for nearly 20yrs now''

I know-I know?You have 10 acres of private land in your back yard and been riding that CONSTANTLY for 20yrs?And you talk about the golf carts we MATVA members ride?

Your a jerk,PERIOD!