'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
Apr 7, 2008 | 05:29 PM
#21
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
Well said!
Hey Drew (can I call you Drew?), what do you think of Motoman? http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm He seems to turn all the conventional thinking about engines on its head. Stuff that everybody just kinda accepted as truth because a bunch of guys and books said so, seemingly turned into falseness instantly when subjected to real-world experimentation. You have to sign up to read another 24 articles about porting n whatnot. Its free though.
Oh, here's another one of those charts. http://www.iwt.com.au/mikunicarb.htm This one has the pilot drawn correctly. Fig 7. I know there is an even better chart out there somewhere.... I've seen it before. I'll find it as soon as this thread is buried n forgot about I'm sure, lol.
Hey Drew (can I call you Drew?), what do you think of Motoman? http://www.mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm He seems to turn all the conventional thinking about engines on its head. Stuff that everybody just kinda accepted as truth because a bunch of guys and books said so, seemingly turned into falseness instantly when subjected to real-world experimentation. You have to sign up to read another 24 articles about porting n whatnot. Its free though.
Oh, here's another one of those charts. http://www.iwt.com.au/mikunicarb.htm This one has the pilot drawn correctly. Fig 7. I know there is an even better chart out there somewhere.... I've seen it before. I'll find it as soon as this thread is buried n forgot about I'm sure, lol.
Apr 8, 2008 | 04:56 AM
#22
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
Well , my opinion is based on being in manufacturing for over 35 years. The last 12 as a manufacturing engineer, and machinist. Every engineer I know, is well aquainted with Honda, as being the premium place for engineers to work. Its well know as hiring only the best engineers, and they can aford to be picky, because the line is a mile long, of people waiting to enter. That being said, I have great respect for their products and the experts who work there, and the advice they give. The prinicipal idea, is to have a product which is reliable, and dependable, over all else. Its well known that Yamaha motors are in a higher state of tune, and adding pipes and jetting to most yamaha motors, doesnt gain much. But its easy to make more power on a honda motor. big reason being, the focus is on dependability, and not extracting the last drop of horsepower. That likewise is my thinking.
I go with the experts, who use science, and have a known track record for being correct.
If the motor belongs to me, I follow the advice presented by the experts, and not anecdotal evidence, or heresay. Opinions dont carry the same weight as facts with me. But if you pay for the motor, and youre gonna pay for the repairs..by all means do as you wish, ( and come to me for the repairs when it wears out, as I make the most from those which have that mentality, than I do from guys who run conservative).
my 2 cents
I go with the experts, who use science, and have a known track record for being correct.
If the motor belongs to me, I follow the advice presented by the experts, and not anecdotal evidence, or heresay. Opinions dont carry the same weight as facts with me. But if you pay for the motor, and youre gonna pay for the repairs..by all means do as you wish, ( and come to me for the repairs when it wears out, as I make the most from those which have that mentality, than I do from guys who run conservative).
my 2 cents
Apr 8, 2008 | 06:43 AM
#23
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
Wow! You're a pretty interesting fellow! Thanks for your 2 cents. That's all I wanted was your opinion on it. If you have time someday and you're bored or whatever, the other 24 articles are kinda interesting (I don't know the guy and, actually, he won't even answer my email so...). He mentions Harley redlines their engines a few times before they leave the factory and then prints in their manual not to do that for something like 500 miles or so. Kinda the "do as I say and not as I do" thing. He speculates that the reason manufacturers recommmend an easy break in is due to liability issues with a new vehicle. They don't want you riding a new bike too fast too soon. Not that the engineers are stupid or anything... I don't know... I've never done the experiments and I'm no expert. Btw, what does it take to be an expert?
Oh, and yes, I think everybody knows that Honda means quality. But judging from the array of engines I've stuck a wrench to, I don't really have a problem with any of the major manufacturers. It also makes sense you can make more power from an engine that was designed to be bulletproof from the get-go (so long as its not too heavy and that sorta thing).
Oh, and yes, I think everybody knows that Honda means quality. But judging from the array of engines I've stuck a wrench to, I don't really have a problem with any of the major manufacturers. It also makes sense you can make more power from an engine that was designed to be bulletproof from the get-go (so long as its not too heavy and that sorta thing).
Apr 8, 2008 | 02:05 PM
#24
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
Now that the thread has been officailly hijacked...
I gotta believe if his theories had evidence and merit, the big manufacturers(KTM, Yamaha, Porcsh, Ferarri, Aston Martin, and so on) would jump on it. The fact that they dont is telling. Just like why dont the big manufacturers jump on fuel line magnets, and 'tornados' for the intake tract. They are after every single bit of fuel economy they can,spending hundreds of millions, and yet they dont add a fuel line magnet for pennies?
....he would have a lot more credibility, if he used scientific evidence, rather than anecdotal, testimonials or bro in law stories. Its always a good sign, that there is no scientific proof, if someone has to resort to that. Also I have to believe (because this is, after all America, that there is a conflict of interest somewhere...in other words hes making money from his theory)
He could quite easily have dyno run proof of his theories, showing results, of whether or not there really is an increase, and how much.Then to be honest, he would also have to offer up the negitive as well, like shortened life of components due to the procedure he uses, and the increased cost related to that..Then people could do a comparison, and decide for themselves, once there are facts and full disclosure, which is what separates the scammers from the truth tellers.
I gotta believe if his theories had evidence and merit, the big manufacturers(KTM, Yamaha, Porcsh, Ferarri, Aston Martin, and so on) would jump on it. The fact that they dont is telling. Just like why dont the big manufacturers jump on fuel line magnets, and 'tornados' for the intake tract. They are after every single bit of fuel economy they can,spending hundreds of millions, and yet they dont add a fuel line magnet for pennies?
....he would have a lot more credibility, if he used scientific evidence, rather than anecdotal, testimonials or bro in law stories. Its always a good sign, that there is no scientific proof, if someone has to resort to that. Also I have to believe (because this is, after all America, that there is a conflict of interest somewhere...in other words hes making money from his theory)
He could quite easily have dyno run proof of his theories, showing results, of whether or not there really is an increase, and how much.Then to be honest, he would also have to offer up the negitive as well, like shortened life of components due to the procedure he uses, and the increased cost related to that..Then people could do a comparison, and decide for themselves, once there are facts and full disclosure, which is what separates the scammers from the truth tellers.
Apr 8, 2008 | 05:08 PM
#25
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
Sorry, didn't mean to "hijack" your thread. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img] I thought we were having an educational conversation. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img] Oh well, see ya around I guess....
Apr 8, 2008 | 10:48 PM
#27
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
Well, I took the lack of a [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] or [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img] or [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] or whatever next to the "Now that the thread has been officailly hijacked... " and interpretted it as me butting in, lol. Guess that's the bad part of text-only communication. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/img]
Plus I suspect you think I'm trying to change your mind on the motoman thing and its rubbing you the wrong way. I'm not. Just trying to sort everything out and gather info. I remember reading many of your other posts and you seemed like a good candidate for an opinion. But you're right, I probably should have started a new thread. I'm just being condidtioned by the fact that not many people do a search for anything, they just ask the same question I put good time into answering just the day before! So, lots of threads run off topic with me lately. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
Btw, now we're REALLY off topic! LOL [img]i/expressions/beer.gif[/img]
Plus I suspect you think I'm trying to change your mind on the motoman thing and its rubbing you the wrong way. I'm not. Just trying to sort everything out and gather info. I remember reading many of your other posts and you seemed like a good candidate for an opinion. But you're right, I probably should have started a new thread. I'm just being condidtioned by the fact that not many people do a search for anything, they just ask the same question I put good time into answering just the day before! So, lots of threads run off topic with me lately. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
Btw, now we're REALLY off topic! LOL [img]i/expressions/beer.gif[/img]
Apr 8, 2008 | 11:12 PM
#28
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
Wow... Hondabuster and Randy (of course) I could watch you fellas type all night!!
Though I have yet to translate logic, reasoning, common sense, science and real world experience to my limited experience with working on the combustion engine... And my only expertieezzze is hyjacking threads, you boys would would be a blast to talk to around a campfire, on probably most subjects!!
It is a pleasure to read your posts! Thanks!
Though I have yet to translate logic, reasoning, common sense, science and real world experience to my limited experience with working on the combustion engine... And my only expertieezzze is hyjacking threads, you boys would would be a blast to talk to around a campfire, on probably most subjects!!
It is a pleasure to read your posts! Thanks!
Apr 8, 2008 | 11:21 PM
#29
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
So, how does motoman's break in seem to be working out for you PG?
I was going to try it on that wolverine I replaced the rings in, but it was smoking from first start up. Not nearly as bad as it was when it first got here, but from a distance you can see the puffs coming out on any throttle. With a rod that loose, the fact that it runs is all should be taken with thanks though.
I was going to try it on that wolverine I replaced the rings in, but it was smoking from first start up. Not nearly as bad as it was when it first got here, but from a distance you can see the puffs coming out on any throttle. With a rod that loose, the fact that it runs is all should be taken with thanks though.
Apr 8, 2008 | 11:31 PM
#30
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'03 LT400Z running perfect when parked, now won't run unless choked
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: JustRandy
So, how does motoman's break in seem to be working out for you PG?
I was going to try it on that wolverine I replaced the rings in, but it was smoking from first start up. Not nearly as bad as it was when it first got here, but from a distance you can see the puffs coming out on any throttle. With a rod that loose, the fact that it runs is all should be taken with thanks though.</end quote></div>
Like my Dad said ride it like you stole it!! Worked before I even knew motoman existed... Probably 20-30 two wheelers, a dozen 3 wheelers, countless cars and trucks, and 2 quads... It has worked for me, so I'll stick with it.
So, how does motoman's break in seem to be working out for you PG?
I was going to try it on that wolverine I replaced the rings in, but it was smoking from first start up. Not nearly as bad as it was when it first got here, but from a distance you can see the puffs coming out on any throttle. With a rod that loose, the fact that it runs is all should be taken with thanks though.</end quote></div>
Like my Dad said ride it like you stole it!! Worked before I even knew motoman existed... Probably 20-30 two wheelers, a dozen 3 wheelers, countless cars and trucks, and 2 quads... It has worked for me, so I'll stick with it.