ok how hard is it to pull the clutch and put in the motor clutch spring and what do you guys recommend to tighten the belt up the red or i believe i heard the pink one and also i remember hearing about an aftermarket belt that is better then the kawi one i gotta get my belt tightened up it is so shot that i crack it down in low range and when the front end starts coming in the air i can feel my belt slipping and the front end comes down any sights you can refer me to about a clutch puller and belt would be greatly appreciated [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] thanx guys i know i can count on you

 

You don't need to pull the primary clutch to change the spring......you don't even have to take off the belt.....just take off the bolt, then remove the cover bolts.

 

EPI

This is where I got my pink primary spring, black secondary spring, and clutch puller.

 

Weez-
With 27's, you may need heavier weights for the clutch. (higher midrange HP and higher load) EPI makes a complete kit for wheelers with CDI and oversize tires. Mine should be here tomorrow.
Clutching is somewhat of a "Black Art". Every change made, will effect the balance of the system. Some examples:

The heavier cam arms (weights) add "bite" to the belt to reduce the slipping in the primary. It also lowers the engagement and lowers the top end RPMs. Too much primary bite, MAY result in secondary slippage.

The reason they use the black (heavier) driven spring is that it slows down the upshifts, and speeds up backshifting. (basically keeps in in lower range longer). The black driven used by itself will also reduce top end by a few mph even though the top end rpms will raise.

The heavier primary spring is used to raise the engagement with the heavier weights. Used by itself ,it lowers topend rpm as well.


The components HAVE to work in harmony to get BEST results for INTENDED purpose. (Re-read that!) You can set up the clutching do do ONE thing VERY well, or Everything somewhat well. If you want Mud perfomance, you want the heavy secondary. Acceration would be stock driven spring, but heavier cam arms. Drive spring would be adjusted for higher engagement to get more horse at engagement. It will all depend on WHAT arena you want the quad to excell in.



I'm new to wheelers , but I have been using the typical belt drives since 1970. Exact same principals. So why did I buy the kit instead of making my own? Economics. They did most of the R/D work. By the time I buy 3 or 4 sets of cam arms, 3-4 drive springs, 3-4 driven springs, to come up with close to what they had, I lost big time! Just be thankful that they don't use changeable helixs!!! Those run $50/each for sleds. I just sold ALL my sleds & parts. I had over 5 grand in sled clutching alone. I got a grand for it. :-( After racing them on asphalt for 3 years, I got burned out. Did a 9.72 @ 135mph. That was COOL, but waiting all day to make 6-7 passes got old in a hurry.

How are the 589's on the hardpack? Do they rattle your teeth loose like the Mudzillas when your doing 40mph? How are they in the turns? Do they roll over like the Rawhides? I want a set of tires for the hardpack & log bumping with a little mud mixed in.

 

I'm a mountain sledder myself, Doc. The clutch tuning on these quads is much more basic than the sleds and sometimes doesn't respond in the way we think it should. A few guys have tried heavier weights and took them out again. Going to just a slightly stiffer primary spring is all that is really needed for big tires. As for losing top end when changing primary and secondary springs: never happened to me. I ran mine on the GPS after every combo. I have both stock springs, Red and Black EPI secondary springs, pink EPI primary spring, and a P700 primary spring. I have run every combo of thse springs. The Red secondary spring is a big jump in secondary side-loading and I fully expected it to kill the top end, but it never. Took a while to get there, but it got there.

 

HMMM!!
That tells me that they aren't even in the ballpark for clutching for the helix angle. I suspected something, they way the motor unloads on top end. It just flattens out and stops pulling. Granted, the only place I can run it is down a twisty road, I still get 66, before having to hit the binders. Darn Rawhides roll over so bad, that you can steer at speed. The Mudzillas vibrate (over 38) that the front end feels like its coming apart! Gotta balance them!
My EPI kit comes in tonight (hopefully), so I can play ! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

thanx for the great replies guys i was always told to stick with the stock weights for i heard the same thing everyone took them out and i got the black secondary spring so if i get the pink primary and got a new belt i should be set up? if this is it i will be set then gotta get it ready before deer season so i can pull out that big buck [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] and the 589's are very good on hard pack just a good all purpose tire and no they are 6-ply they don't roll at all the handling with these tires is 10 times better then the rawhides but at the same sense they aren't half as aggressive as the mudzilla's for just continuously digging which i love how the mudzilla's perform in the mud well not owning but watching them it is amazing but just having them on an atv you can see is hard on the whole drivetrain cause like you said it just vibrates everything you can see it by riding next to someone with them on and they throw huge rocks all the time where my 589's don't unless you are behind but that is any tire and well i was still able to go through more mud with my 650 with my 589's compared to that sportsman 500 with 28 inch mudzilla's but that was because i had the power when i cracked it down there was 4 roosts in the air and i was jumping over mud holes [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] but as soon as i get this taken care of then i will have the best machine out there in my eyes

 

Just make sure you check your deflection, Weezy. Generally, most guys have been having good luck with removing the thinner of the two shims in the secondary and running it. With a broke-in belt (read:100 miles plus) it should juuuuust start to squeal when left in gear at idle. Live with it and slip it into neutral if it bugs ya. I just put a new belt in mine (although I don't think it needed it) and it sqeals somthing aweful at idle.......gonna live with it....it'll be broke in this weekend.

 

Dave,what did you get for a belt?

Kenny

 

hey dave i already removed the smaller shim a long long time ago and my belt never squealed even with the brand new belt and does a person need a compressing tool of some sort to put in the spring in the primary clutch? would it be better after installing this spring that i put in the small shim and take out the big one? the reason for all these questions is cause i only wanna take the darn thing apart just one more time and thats it