AC 650 Multi-Rider
Mar 16, 2005 | 12:16 AM
#21
Pro Rider
Joined: Mar 2001
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AC 650 Multi-Rider
Originally posted by: Theshonk
Sir I am self-insured and carry a million deductible. I really appreciate your concern for my financial ability to cover my expenses.
"That seat puts the rider way to far rearward".
If I move the CG forward do you think it will be safer than skydiving or aerobatics’?
"I’m not sure who you are trying to fool - but it must be yourself and your pax".
Interesting, I’m not trying to fool anyone. I’m seeking to understand before being understood. My I suggest you give it a try it surly will help you better interact with your students. Do you find your style effective in flight? Who are you fooling when you take the big leap?
"But I have the medical bills, broken bones, scars and nerve damage to make me an expert".
There no way I would argue with a self-proclaimed expert on breaking their bones, scaring themselves and of course the nerve damage. (Between your ears) LOL.
By looking at a photo of yours that cooler hanging on the back better be empty if not your aft CG is much greater.
Text
Sir I am self-insured and carry a million deductible. I really appreciate your concern for my financial ability to cover my expenses.
"That seat puts the rider way to far rearward".
If I move the CG forward do you think it will be safer than skydiving or aerobatics’?
"I’m not sure who you are trying to fool - but it must be yourself and your pax".
Interesting, I’m not trying to fool anyone. I’m seeking to understand before being understood. My I suggest you give it a try it surly will help you better interact with your students. Do you find your style effective in flight? Who are you fooling when you take the big leap?
"But I have the medical bills, broken bones, scars and nerve damage to make me an expert".
There no way I would argue with a self-proclaimed expert on breaking their bones, scaring themselves and of course the nerve damage. (Between your ears) LOL.
By looking at a photo of yours that cooler hanging on the back better be empty if not your aft CG is much greater.
Text
million dollar deductable....right... and I just had lunch with Elvis. To arbbetrary for a debate
Skydiving and aerobatics puts only one person at risk... if you had the metal for it - you can discover that yourself.
I never hold myself out as a expert in aerobatics... A novice compared to so many great pilots before me actually.
Yes, experience counts - just like charactor and history. I've many many miles of 2up riding on a single rider quad and I know many others that do also. You appear to be the novice in this arena and should listen attentively. You could learn from my mistakes - or not. Many have attempted the 2up conversion but so many have ended in injury incident. I get the state stats so I am familiar.
Empty? no - but never more than lunch and a rain suit . I do practice what I preach. The front box weighs 83 pounds. Do the math.
Nice try though - better than some...
Mar 16, 2005 | 01:48 AM
#22
Extreme Pro Rider
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 4,054
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AC 650 Multi-Rider
Originally posted by: Theshonk
I order the foot pegs (#59654 Fender Protector) from JR Graham took about 15 min. to install
Check out pics. @ 2005 V2 650 AC
I order the foot pegs (#59654 Fender Protector) from JR Graham took about 15 min. to install
Check out pics. @ 2005 V2 650 AC
Mar 16, 2005 | 10:18 AM
#23
Pro Rider
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 238
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AC 650 Multi-Rider
Bear
Try this address http://photos.yahoo.com/theshonk
Did you get the same protectors? And from whom please advise.
Also I am going to move the seat forward to improve CG.
Shonk
Try this address http://photos.yahoo.com/theshonk
Did you get the same protectors? And from whom please advise.
Also I am going to move the seat forward to improve CG.
Shonk
Mar 16, 2005 | 11:17 AM
#24
Pro Rider
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 238
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AC 650 Multi-Rider
Mr., MudHole
“million dollar deductible....right... and I just had lunch with Elvis”
Let me assure you Professor (do you have tenure?…….right) the possibilities of my claim is much more plausible than yours. Unless of course your have even greater powers.
“Skydiving and aerobatics puts only one person at risk... if you had the metal for it - you can discover that yourself”.
Who are you fooling? The noted activities can and do endanger others. I think what you are trying to rationalize is risk. My SS and DFC speaks for me. Elucidate. me what type of “metal” is required to do aerobatics or jump?
“I never hold myself out as a expert in aerobatics... A novice compared to so many great pilots before me actually”
Did I hit a nerve I never question your expertise as a flyer (you can teach a monkey to wipe). I do question your effeteness of making a point without bring out all you ego baggage.
“Empty? No - but never more than lunch and a rain suit The front box weighs 83 pounds. Do the math”.
Lunch and a rain suit that’s perfect .So could you do the math for me?
. “I do practice what I preach.”
When did you start doing that before or after you almost killed your wife and broke yourself up.
“Nice try though - better than some”
Here’s my try;
Dear Shonk welcome to ATVing nice rig. Hey would it be possible to move your 2-up seat forward? I am concern that aft CG exceeds the envelop of the machine.
Shonk
“million dollar deductible....right... and I just had lunch with Elvis”
Let me assure you Professor (do you have tenure?…….right) the possibilities of my claim is much more plausible than yours. Unless of course your have even greater powers.
“Skydiving and aerobatics puts only one person at risk... if you had the metal for it - you can discover that yourself”.
Who are you fooling? The noted activities can and do endanger others. I think what you are trying to rationalize is risk. My SS and DFC speaks for me. Elucidate. me what type of “metal” is required to do aerobatics or jump?
“I never hold myself out as a expert in aerobatics... A novice compared to so many great pilots before me actually”
Did I hit a nerve I never question your expertise as a flyer (you can teach a monkey to wipe). I do question your effeteness of making a point without bring out all you ego baggage.
“Empty? No - but never more than lunch and a rain suit The front box weighs 83 pounds. Do the math”.
Lunch and a rain suit that’s perfect .So could you do the math for me?
. “I do practice what I preach.”
When did you start doing that before or after you almost killed your wife and broke yourself up.
“Nice try though - better than some”
Here’s my try;
Dear Shonk welcome to ATVing nice rig. Hey would it be possible to move your 2-up seat forward? I am concern that aft CG exceeds the envelop of the machine.
Shonk
Mar 16, 2005 | 01:21 PM
#25
Pro Rider
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,091
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AC 650 Multi-Rider
...Here’s my try; Dear Shonk welcome to ATVing nice rig. Hey would it be possible to move your 2-up seat forward? I am concern that aft CG exceeds the envelop of the machine. Shonk
It doesnt express the depth of concern I have but I see your point.
Sometimes I fail to recognize the possibility that not everyone deserves my sometimes blunt demeanor.
I owe you an appology. Please accept it.
Mar 16, 2005 | 05:34 PM
#26
Pro Rider
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 204
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AC 650 Multi-Rider
Shonk,
Got the new link to open. Rig looks great. I really like the changes they made to the 05 vs my 04 but guess I need to live with it a while. I can see your 2-up mods and can also now understand "Muds" concerns.
When we were shopping for an ATV, one of the criteria was that it have a large enough seat that I could ride in my usual seat position and still have sufficient room left for my wife. Not that we ride double that much but that still was something we needed to consider. The AC650 has a long seat and still allowed my wife to be sitting ahead of the rear axle. That seemed rather important since it wasn't a two rider vehicle to start.
Luckily my wife is thin with long legs so she can sit on the back portion of the seat and still share the floorboard with me for her feet. So she is on the same level I am and can lean as I do.
My concern with your modification is the height and rearward location of the added seat. I have seen these cargo seats and know they are not made for sitting in while riding. You did address moving the seat forward some and I think that is a smart move.
The AC650, at least mine, is rather light in the front. I have gotten air (very unintentionally I assure you) with mine and it does require a gentle touch on the trottle. My concern is the higher rearward weight that your unit will experience with a passenger. Not that conservative riding and care can't cut some of the risks involved. But we are still riding trails with unforseen obstacles and challenges. ATVs in general create a risk at any level.
I use a hitch hauler on the back of mine during deer season. To check stability, I stood on the hauler and bounced up and down. THe front end lifted on the suspension but I didn't get the front off the ground. I weigh a bit over 200 lbs for your info. Now granted I get a bit more leverage as the weight is about 2 feet off the rear of the AC. But it is also only about 18 inches off the ground, not over 3 feet like your passenger will be. That high center of gravity that far back could cause some stability and handling issues.
Anyway, it is your decision with what mods you do or how you ride your unit. With care and responsible riding, no doubt you can enjoy many hours of 2-up riding. Take care and safe riding.
Craig
Got the new link to open. Rig looks great. I really like the changes they made to the 05 vs my 04 but guess I need to live with it a while. I can see your 2-up mods and can also now understand "Muds" concerns.
When we were shopping for an ATV, one of the criteria was that it have a large enough seat that I could ride in my usual seat position and still have sufficient room left for my wife. Not that we ride double that much but that still was something we needed to consider. The AC650 has a long seat and still allowed my wife to be sitting ahead of the rear axle. That seemed rather important since it wasn't a two rider vehicle to start.
Luckily my wife is thin with long legs so she can sit on the back portion of the seat and still share the floorboard with me for her feet. So she is on the same level I am and can lean as I do.
My concern with your modification is the height and rearward location of the added seat. I have seen these cargo seats and know they are not made for sitting in while riding. You did address moving the seat forward some and I think that is a smart move.
The AC650, at least mine, is rather light in the front. I have gotten air (very unintentionally I assure you) with mine and it does require a gentle touch on the trottle. My concern is the higher rearward weight that your unit will experience with a passenger. Not that conservative riding and care can't cut some of the risks involved. But we are still riding trails with unforseen obstacles and challenges. ATVs in general create a risk at any level.
I use a hitch hauler on the back of mine during deer season. To check stability, I stood on the hauler and bounced up and down. THe front end lifted on the suspension but I didn't get the front off the ground. I weigh a bit over 200 lbs for your info. Now granted I get a bit more leverage as the weight is about 2 feet off the rear of the AC. But it is also only about 18 inches off the ground, not over 3 feet like your passenger will be. That high center of gravity that far back could cause some stability and handling issues.
Anyway, it is your decision with what mods you do or how you ride your unit. With care and responsible riding, no doubt you can enjoy many hours of 2-up riding. Take care and safe riding.
Craig
Mar 17, 2005 | 04:33 PM
#29
Pro Rider
Joined: Mar 2001
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AC 650 Multi-Rider
Lunch and a rain suit that’s perfect .So could you do the math for me?
So the reverse would also be true. A person weighing 349 pounds and seated centered 14 inches behind the axle would take 83 pounds on the front axle to balance. So 7 inches would be 41.4 pounds and 3.5 inches would take 20 pounds.
Mar 18, 2005 | 10:59 PM
#30
Trailblazer
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 79
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AC 650 Multi-Rider
Originally posted by: WhoDatInDaMud
Lunch and a rain suit that’s perfect .So could you do the math for me?
Sure - based on some loose measurements with a tape ruler and a geometry program it was determined that the balance between the front box at or about the front axle and the rear box - centered 14 inches behind the rear axle has a 4.21 to 1 leverage ratio. Using that formula I could put 349 pounds in the rear box with having 83 pounds in the front box and not be in a aft CG situation as compared to both being empty.
So the reverse would also be true. A person weighing 349 pounds and seated centered 14 inches behind the axle would take 83 pounds on the front axle to balance. So 7 inches would be 41.4 pounds and 3.5 inches would take 20 pounds.
Lunch and a rain suit that’s perfect .So could you do the math for me?
So the reverse would also be true. A person weighing 349 pounds and seated centered 14 inches behind the axle would take 83 pounds on the front axle to balance. So 7 inches would be 41.4 pounds and 3.5 inches would take 20 pounds.
Anyway if you put the HSRDATVFMS system in your 4.21\1 ratio is quadrupled. That means your CG is at your winch
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