much like the wolverine 450 and the polaris 500. but those are the only two four wheelers like that. its sad i mean if you want to go fast they go fast if you want to go through the mud you can go through the mud. its awsome.

 

I have been saying this for years. Where you been????

Most folks would be best served by a sport trail quad (instead of a farm work tractor utility), but with 4X4 just in case they get into trouble out there on the trail. Everything so far falls short of the mark.......all still to big and way to heavy, and with foo foo automatic transmissions, but it's a step in the right direction. Hopefully, we will see some great designs in the near future!

 

ha. ya steps. but we need leaps.

 

Simple. Because they arn't popular and therefor don't sell well. For whatever reason most of the quad riders don't like them.
If they don't sell well they arn't going to make them.

 

If a yfz/trx/ltr 450 is 6500-7300 in 2wd form, imagine what a 4wd version would cost.

The outlaw would need even more power, but IMO is the best candidate for a sport 4x4.

The z400 and other similar dohc engines dont really have the torque or charachteristic power delivery useful for this type of setup. You'd need a 400ex type powerplant and it probably wouldnt be any faster than the wolverine 450 that's out there, just lighter and more maneuverable.

Sport quad engines are more expensive and less reliable, which helps push back this idea more.

 

I'll use a basic example here. A Honda 250EX weights ~350 pounds. Now, what would it take to add front wheel drive to this machine??? A Rancher 4wd only weighs ~30 pounds more than the 2wd. So, taking that difference in weight for a front differential, axles, and drive shaft, you could add 4wd to the 250EX, and it still comes in under the weight of a 2wd Recon on which it is based. So, I figure you could produce a 4X4 in this class that is under 400 pounds (but unfortunately it would probably be underpowered).

So, why doesn't Honda apply this to the next step up???? Take a Rancher, strip it down as light as possible, and improve the suspension, and you should be able to come in at ~450 pounds. Still 60 pounds lighter than a Wolverine, the lightest there is right now.

Then next, we go to the Foreman........

And, COST MEANS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! People will buy anything. Dealers in my area, can sell anything they put out on the floor. Rhino's for example are $10,000 msrp, and there are tons of them being sold.

 

Because there are more potential buyers looking for an overly heavy, larger, and big bore machine that produces an excitement that comes with having the biggest and badest whatever, and who are also willing to fork over insane amounts of $$$$ for that privilige [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

And if you want to be really the technical the wolverine isnt a sport 4x4 anymore except for the plastics or the look etc.

I remember all the diehards freaking out when yami went and ignored the need that how ever many of their loyal buyers had for a true sport 4x4 that could handle similar to a 4x2 sport machine, with the added convenience of having the 4x4 etc.

To be fair 4x4 atv's have come a long way, but there still way too heavy, and handle nothing like a true sport machine (ok a couple are better than others etc) If your not sure what I mean bring a couple models to a tight technical woods course or even an mx track and then do the same run on a yfz or 450r, and report on the difference you find.

Before anyone jumps on me etc consider how when the wolverine350, and polaris400 or 500 were first around they were considerably more in line with the current sport machines of that time (300ex, warrior350, etc etc) and instead of using new technology to close the gap the mfg's have allowed profitability (look at the prices of the larger new util 4x4's and all the quirky stuff on them) to sway their R&D to design models that have caused the gap to increase.

 

Just add some mods. My 650V2 does about 70, and goes through anything i point it at! Yeah its 700 lbs, but that just means stay out of my way!!! lol Also, with the mods, i can take alot of sport bikes out of the hole, and top end. They just corner better, and you can jump higher without wrecking anything.

 

Before I get into things more I want to say that I have seen and heard about very skilled (and brave) riders who have done some really crazy things on a heavy util machine. Just the thought of the guy at Rausch Creek PA a few years back doing large step ups and clearing them on a sportsman700 still brings a smile and thoughts of nuts he was, but this is absolutely the exception and not the rule.

Honestly 70mph is a good speed on any small machine like an atv, and getting to the speed quickly is even more fun, but getting out of the way of a 700lb machine when you misjudged the turn or elevation change is something you have to do in order to keep out of the obituaries.

Still as fast and as good a top speed as that machine may have (and others too) there not in any way "sport" models, and dont handle like them either as you pointed out.

For me its a tough subject because I have liked the big 4x4 util I have rode (grizz, prarrie etc) until the speeds get up there in the tight or rough stuff, and the real benefits of the 4x4 are not utilized enough around here.

The 2wd vforce was another good util type that sort of gets into the sport ranking, but good as that engine is, and as much effort that was put into the suspension you still know that extra weight is around.

I travel some for work, and meet people all around the area etc. On a recent call I had been discussing my favorite subject (atvs and dirt bikes) with a few mechanics. Two of them were in the market for a new purchase, and after about ten minutes of talking about what they intended to do with their atv's it was obvious that all the hype of the larger big bore 4x4 utils had them very confused, and afterward one of them was going to check out real sport machines, and the other had a more diffilcult task since he figured out just by a couple small questions he asked himslef that he really was more interested in a sport 4x4.

I think we all know from this thread that the second guy is gonna have a much tougher time finding what he really wants due to the limited availablilty of models out there.

Is any of this making sense lol [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

it makes sense. 4x4 sport are the future, personaly i dont like big machines there bulky it takes away from why i ride. why not drive a car? but 4x4 is a nice exsessory.