New LTE Racing Exhaust - Dual Exhaust
#21
09-05-2003, 11:10 AM
New LTE Racing Exhaust - Dual Exhaust
if i rode in dunes only then this would be a great system but for my conditions i just don't want to take the risk, i'd b willing to cut off my batter box and remount it somewhere else,but i won't go to a carb mount filter, carb mount+wet winter conditions=bad for motor [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img]
#22
09-05-2003, 03:40 PM
New LTE Racing Exhaust - Dual Exhaust
Originally posted by: ironrod
For the dune guys just think about this for a second, for the first time you have the choice of getting a truly performance pipe that’s LEGAL. Which would mod would you rather do to get it? Hacksaw the subframe to remove the battery box, or cut some plastic out of the bottom underside of your seat?
For the dune guys just think about this for a second, for the first time you have the choice of getting a truly performance pipe that’s LEGAL. Which would mod would you rather do to get it? Hacksaw the subframe to remove the battery box, or cut some plastic out of the bottom underside of your seat?
I am also concerned about the clearance to run a six pack rack with a through the center routing of the LTE system. If a battery relocate would allow an under the rear of the seat location while maintaining clearance for the air box users and a six pack rack I would be very interested in quiet power.
#23
09-05-2003, 04:35 PM
New LTE Racing Exhaust - Dual Exhaust
Originally posted by: KenDS
Well as a dune only rider I would answer with moving the battery. I have had my fill with the carb mount pain in the butt. If K&N ever comes out with a filter that is 25% smaller on the head end and 10% smaller on the tail end it might get my interest.
I am also concerned about the clearance to run a six pack rack with a through the center routing of the LTE system. If a battery relocate would allow an under the rear of the seat location while maintaining clearance for the air box users and a six pack rack I would be very interested in quiet power.
Originally posted by: ironrod
For the dune guys just think about this for a second, for the first time you have the choice of getting a truly performance pipe that’s LEGAL. Which would mod would you rather do to get it? Hacksaw the subframe to remove the battery box, or cut some plastic out of the bottom underside of your seat?
For the dune guys just think about this for a second, for the first time you have the choice of getting a truly performance pipe that’s LEGAL. Which would mod would you rather do to get it? Hacksaw the subframe to remove the battery box, or cut some plastic out of the bottom underside of your seat?
I am also concerned about the clearance to run a six pack rack with a through the center routing of the LTE system. If a battery relocate would allow an under the rear of the seat location while maintaining clearance for the air box users and a six pack rack I would be very interested in quiet power.
For a $149.00 you can get a cargo rack from PRM that has room for a six pack cooler in the middle and two 1 gallon gas cans on the side that's situated well above where the center exhaust will be.
As far your preference to cut metal rather than plastic, thats your choice. However, I'd be happy to give you a template of my seat cutout if you ever change your mind. It took me about 3 attempts to get the right size cutout. I haven't touched it for over a year.
If the mufflers were placed under the airbox, they would come in contact with the swingarm and/or shock when compressed. That wouldn't work either.
Marky
#24
09-05-2003, 05:05 PM
New LTE Racing Exhaust - Dual Exhaust
like it is nice that they're are takin interest in the ds, but just for my application i wouldn't go without and airbox, i'd be willing to relocate my batter n shock resivoir,and i'd have to move my license plate(ya i have one) somewhere too, cuz its mounted rite behind the airbox, also if the air box is removed where does the rectifier go?
#25
09-05-2003, 10:11 PM
#26
09-06-2003, 03:50 AM
New LTE Racing Exhaust - Dual Exhaust
Polarized is hardly the right description marky, not everything is that cut and dry simple.
Basically what we are saying is that any tiny little added hp increase that a carb mount might have to offer is not worth any amount of bother is some people's eyes. A very small percentage of ds owners bought their bike strictly for drags, and drags is the only place where a carb mount might be of any gain. its also the only place that this new dual pipe will be of any significance, and that's cool because dune guys deserve a pipe made specifically for them 'cause there are plenty of trail pipes out there already.
I say hats off to LTE too, for making a dune/drag pipe for those that are only dedicated to that area of riding, you guys deserve it!
but FYI, I never had to cut the seat to accomidate the throttle on the TM, I merely cut off the chunk of aluminum on the throttle that caught on the seat with a dremmel, and since I run the airbox with the stock snorkel tube routing the crankvent into it is much easier and more practical than a catch can/oil collector, and burning the emmisions is a plus as well. As for the seat cutting to clear the filter, I've done that, its easy enough, but you also gotta cut the frame under the filter where it rubs to prevent wearing a hole thru an outerwear evey other ride.
Oh, and be aware that there are two sources for baterry boxes that mount under the seat and also house the air filter and all the electronics, regulator, starter solenoid, etc., that plenty of people already have so yes there would be room for an airbox if the battery box and airbox are one in the same. just like you've seen for EX's, Z's, and all the others made by PPD.
And hell, to top it all off, I've seen nothing to show any performance improvements over any other system. its 100dB without the quiet cores, and how much hp will the quiet cores cost? all we really KNOW right now is that it weighs a whole lot more.
Basically what we are saying is that any tiny little added hp increase that a carb mount might have to offer is not worth any amount of bother is some people's eyes. A very small percentage of ds owners bought their bike strictly for drags, and drags is the only place where a carb mount might be of any gain. its also the only place that this new dual pipe will be of any significance, and that's cool because dune guys deserve a pipe made specifically for them 'cause there are plenty of trail pipes out there already.
I say hats off to LTE too, for making a dune/drag pipe for those that are only dedicated to that area of riding, you guys deserve it!
but FYI, I never had to cut the seat to accomidate the throttle on the TM, I merely cut off the chunk of aluminum on the throttle that caught on the seat with a dremmel, and since I run the airbox with the stock snorkel tube routing the crankvent into it is much easier and more practical than a catch can/oil collector, and burning the emmisions is a plus as well. As for the seat cutting to clear the filter, I've done that, its easy enough, but you also gotta cut the frame under the filter where it rubs to prevent wearing a hole thru an outerwear evey other ride.
Oh, and be aware that there are two sources for baterry boxes that mount under the seat and also house the air filter and all the electronics, regulator, starter solenoid, etc., that plenty of people already have so yes there would be room for an airbox if the battery box and airbox are one in the same. just like you've seen for EX's, Z's, and all the others made by PPD.
And hell, to top it all off, I've seen nothing to show any performance improvements over any other system. its 100dB without the quiet cores, and how much hp will the quiet cores cost? all we really KNOW right now is that it weighs a whole lot more.
#27
09-06-2003, 10:44 AM
New LTE Racing Exhaust - Dual Exhaust
[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] Ok!
Look man, that's cool you got your reasons not to want to go with the Direct Mount filter. I just disagree with some of the points you made, not all of them - and I don't think that disagreeing is always a bad thing. I think you got a lot of good insight on a lot of things. This sort of debate is a great thing for people trying to make a decision on which way to go.
---
1) Your wrote "drags is the only place where a carb mount might be of any gain. its also the only place that this new dual pipe will be of any significance" .
I know of no aftermarket pipe that is legal in decibel levels (for Oregon or California) - that give more than a 2-3 horsepower gain over the stock exhaust. So really, whether you drag or not it wouldn't seem to change that fact.
---
2) Your wrote "any tiny little added hp increase that a carb mount might have to offer is not worth any amount of bother is some people's eyes"
I agree that the 3-5 horsepower gain is attained above 8000 RPM. What terrain you use that horsepower in is up to you.
---
3) Your wrote "is not worth any amount of bother is some people's eyes."
I do have to change my outerwear about every 6 months - and there are some that would like to just 'set it and forget it!'. However, I attribute that wear to my seat moving 1/2" off its mount. If I were to fix that problem, I woudn't even have to worry about the outerwear problem at all.
---
4) Your wrote "and be aware that there are two sources for battery boxes that mount under the seat "
I am aware that there are ways to relocate the battery and airbox under the seat. The problem is not with that, but rather if most people that would buy a dual exhaust, would like to cut thier battery box off thier subframe to do it. LTE has a system for the 400EX that does just that, relocate the battery box to the inside of the frame with an airbox. This was feasible because the 400EX battery box was not welded onto the subframe, mearly bolted.
----
5) Your wrote "And hell, to top it all off, I've seen nothing to show any performance improvements over any other system. its 100dB without the quiet cores, and how much hp will the quiet cores cost? all we really KNOW right now is that it weighs a whole lot more."
You are right, we do not know the facts on the DS pipe from LTE yet. But it is exciting when you consider the pipes they have already produced and the numbers that are coming out of them.
LTE Raptor Facts: 13.5 HP gain in the mid range and 10.5 HP at peak over stock. 5 lbs lighter than stock. 96 DB.
LTE 400EX Facts: 2.5 - 3 HP gain over stock. 92-93 DB
LTE Z400/ KFX400 Facts: 3 HP gain over stock. 1 lb lighter than stock, 93 DB.
---
6) You wrote "all we really KNOW right now is that it (LTE) weighs a whole lot more"
We really don't know what the LTE DS pipe will wiegh, because it is still in testing. However, there are dual systems that they have produced that wiegh less than stock - some up to 5lbs lighter!.
---
I think for those people that ride in extremely wet conditions, this system will not work for them. And you are right, there are plenty of high performance pipes out there where noise isn't a factor. Perhaps, for those that ride in those conditions, there aren't the noise restrictions that the duners have. I know that when I trail ride my 400EX in the forests, I don't have the same problem with law enforcement checking for DB levels as I do on the dunes. I think the primary reason for this is the fact that sound carries so much further on the sand rather than in the forest - And carries that noise right up to taxpayers doors! I occationally do get caught in a rain storm (Lets face it, I live in Oregon!) and I wouldn't consider this an eliminating factor on the Direct Mount filter. However, if people are crossing streams or rivers, then there is no way that I would ever recommend a system without an air box.
Marky
Look man, that's cool you got your reasons not to want to go with the Direct Mount filter. I just disagree with some of the points you made, not all of them - and I don't think that disagreeing is always a bad thing. I think you got a lot of good insight on a lot of things. This sort of debate is a great thing for people trying to make a decision on which way to go.
---
1) Your wrote "drags is the only place where a carb mount might be of any gain. its also the only place that this new dual pipe will be of any significance" .
I know of no aftermarket pipe that is legal in decibel levels (for Oregon or California) - that give more than a 2-3 horsepower gain over the stock exhaust. So really, whether you drag or not it wouldn't seem to change that fact.
---
2) Your wrote "any tiny little added hp increase that a carb mount might have to offer is not worth any amount of bother is some people's eyes"
I agree that the 3-5 horsepower gain is attained above 8000 RPM. What terrain you use that horsepower in is up to you.
---
3) Your wrote "is not worth any amount of bother is some people's eyes."
I do have to change my outerwear about every 6 months - and there are some that would like to just 'set it and forget it!'. However, I attribute that wear to my seat moving 1/2" off its mount. If I were to fix that problem, I woudn't even have to worry about the outerwear problem at all.
---
4) Your wrote "and be aware that there are two sources for battery boxes that mount under the seat "
I am aware that there are ways to relocate the battery and airbox under the seat. The problem is not with that, but rather if most people that would buy a dual exhaust, would like to cut thier battery box off thier subframe to do it. LTE has a system for the 400EX that does just that, relocate the battery box to the inside of the frame with an airbox. This was feasible because the 400EX battery box was not welded onto the subframe, mearly bolted.
----
5) Your wrote "And hell, to top it all off, I've seen nothing to show any performance improvements over any other system. its 100dB without the quiet cores, and how much hp will the quiet cores cost? all we really KNOW right now is that it weighs a whole lot more."
You are right, we do not know the facts on the DS pipe from LTE yet. But it is exciting when you consider the pipes they have already produced and the numbers that are coming out of them.
LTE Raptor Facts: 13.5 HP gain in the mid range and 10.5 HP at peak over stock. 5 lbs lighter than stock. 96 DB.
LTE 400EX Facts: 2.5 - 3 HP gain over stock. 92-93 DB
LTE Z400/ KFX400 Facts: 3 HP gain over stock. 1 lb lighter than stock, 93 DB.
---
6) You wrote "all we really KNOW right now is that it (LTE) weighs a whole lot more"
We really don't know what the LTE DS pipe will wiegh, because it is still in testing. However, there are dual systems that they have produced that wiegh less than stock - some up to 5lbs lighter!.
---
I think for those people that ride in extremely wet conditions, this system will not work for them. And you are right, there are plenty of high performance pipes out there where noise isn't a factor. Perhaps, for those that ride in those conditions, there aren't the noise restrictions that the duners have. I know that when I trail ride my 400EX in the forests, I don't have the same problem with law enforcement checking for DB levels as I do on the dunes. I think the primary reason for this is the fact that sound carries so much further on the sand rather than in the forest - And carries that noise right up to taxpayers doors! I occationally do get caught in a rain storm (Lets face it, I live in Oregon!) and I wouldn't consider this an eliminating factor on the Direct Mount filter. However, if people are crossing streams or rivers, then there is no way that I would ever recommend a system without an air box.
Marky
#29
09-06-2003, 12:17 PM
New LTE Racing Exhaust - Dual Exhaust
well all the points of what is good and bad is all talk right now. what i can tell you is i was there the weekend when ironrod and bigslim and i saw the lte in action. it for one looked pretty cool but that doesn't really matter. it does seem to really help the performance of the raptor, but to be honest most any pipe seems to help that machine. the noise thing is where us west coast guys will be happy it may not be right at 93 but if you have guys running 100 plus and your at 96 it is easy to figure out who they are going to go after. the weight thing may be something we have to get over, since most of us have been saying if they made a quite performance pipe we would buy it. airraptor seemed happy with his after his tuning in ride.
#30
09-06-2003, 01:38 PM