I certainly hate to hear of your circumstances there w1ngnut. Hopefully, as already mentioned, counciling can help. If things are past that point, hopefully you and the wife can get along enough to be proper parents for the kids. So many times the kids are the true losers in divorce. Good luck bro.
Gary

 

Separation does not mean the marriage is over !! Asking for a divorce does not necessarily mean that's what she wants. It only means that she can not see any other way to resolve the issues you both may be having and is at her wits end.



I've sent you a PM. Call me if you want to talk.

 

Sorry to hear this man. Bigdaady and I are in Vegas if you need anything. If you need it, I have a lawyer who is the best in Vegas for men getting child custody. I will PM you with her name. If you want to get out one day let us know. We'll say a prayer for ya man.

 

Dang man! Unfortunatly I never have had the chance to meet you but look forward to it. As many on here well know, I went through the same thing 6 years ago on the 14 of Sept. I was devistated and completly blindsided by it. Me and Marky have discussed this quite a bit and he can attest that both of us have been through heII and back. Everything I have seen on here has been good advice so far.

I know you feel as if your world has ended, that your future now has no direction, and a huge part of your life is now empty. Your gunna hear alot of advice and take it as that, advice. So here goes my advice.

Remember that your children are not their mother, look deep into there eyes and you will see that they love you to the bottom of their hearts. Put your efforts into them, their love will give you the comfort you will need. If at all possible, work the divorce out between the two of you. DONT get 2 lawyers involved if you dont absalutly have to. Lawyers are there for one reason and that is to make money. They pin you against eachother so it drags out so they make more money. THAT IS A FACT! Be reasonable in your dealings with her, this will pay off ten fold down the road. The more civil you can be the better it is for the children. It is hard not to be rash, but being the bigger man and doing what is fair and right instead of being spiteful will reward you leaps and bounds. I did this and I have a very good relationship with my ex now and because of that, I have the most awesome relationship with my daughter that a Dad can ever ask for.

Time heels all wounds so be patient. You have a long road infront of you and it is ever painful, I wont lie to you. Try not to rush into making everything right, it is hard to do but making decisions in your state of mind can really hurt you later. Dig deep into your manhood and gather strength wherever you can find it. Dont throw away relationships with freinds and family if it can be helped, they want to be there for you so let them be there for you.

One promise I will make you is life will go on and you will again be very happy. Dont deny to yourself what is happening, doing so only prolongs the pain. Take the time you need to heel. Alot will say it is time to move on and quit being down ect ect ect. Only you can determin that. If your feeling down and low, you have the right to do so and it is part of the heeling process. It is ok to cry when you need to, dont hold back, let the pain out. The more you hold it in the more it hurts. Stay strong though, very much so in front of the children. They will be hurting to and they need to see your strength and feel your love. Remember they are the true victims in this and the best thing you can do is focus your efforts around them. You all will heel as a family that way and that is what is truelly important. It is not the house, the truck, the cars, the quads, anything, it is your family. The physical items can always be replaced.

I want to share a thread with you from way back. I will say, it is good to find something to put efforts into, a ascape for you. For me it was my DS, it was known as Demon. You will see that the guys here are truelly family. Notice the date of the post, talk about a hard time to be going through that and even though long ago and still no DS, I am here with my other family. You will see one of the saddest days in my life. Funny thing is alot of what I said has come true with patience and I kept fighting. Never give up!

http://forums.atvconnection.com/mess...TARTPAGE/1.cfm

Sorry i dont know how to make a live link, never have figured that one out.

In July I got remarried, She is a beautiful woman inside and out, I could never have asked for anything more. Gained a son that is 8 and he loves to ride. We have put together a plan to get me back into what I love to do (see my bruteforce thread). It has been a long time coming and several times I thought it was going to happen but alass it never did. I never gave up though and never will. I say these things in hope to inspire you to see that there is light at the end of the dark tunnel, for some it comes fast and for others it doesnt, but like I said, time heels all wounds.

I would also like to share a poem with you. This poem has a powerful message. There were many days that no matter what i did I couldnt dig deep enough to even get out of bed. Sleep didnt hurt like my life did so thats all i wanted to do. I taped this peom to the wall by my bed and when i got like that, i would read it and even now going back to read it. It reminded me of just how much it helped me and tears were falling just now, I will tell ya that. I hope my words have helped you, even if it is just a little bit. Enjoy:

The Race
anonymous
Whenever I start to hang my head in front of failure’s face,
my downward fall is broken by the memory of a race.
A children’s race, young boys, young men; how I remember well,
excitement sure, but also fear, it wasn’t hard to tell.
They all lined up so full of hope, each thought to win that race
or tie for first, or if not that, at least take second place.
Their parents watched from off the side, each cheering for their son,
and each boy hoped to show his folks that he would be the one.

The whistle blew and off they flew, like chariots of fire,
to win, to be the hero there, was each young boy’s desire.
One boy in particular, whose dad was in the crowd,
was running in the lead and thought “My dad will be so proud.”
But as he speeded down the field and crossed a shallow dip,
the little boy who thought he’d win, lost his step and slipped.
Trying hard to catch himself, his arms flew everyplace,
and midst the laughter of the crowd he fell flat on his face.
As he fell, his hope fell too; he couldn’t win it now.
Humiliated, he just wished to disappear somehow.

But as he fell his dad stood up and showed his anxious face,
which to the boy so clearly said, “Get up and win that race!”
He quickly rose, no damage done, behind a bit that’s all,
and ran with all his mind and might to make up for his fall.
So anxious to restore himself, to catch up and to win,
his mind went faster than his legs. He slipped and fell again.
He wished that he had quit before with only one disgrace.
“I’m hopeless as a runner now, I shouldn’t try to race.”

But through the laughing crowd he searched and found his father’s face
with a steady look that said again, “Get up and win that race!”
So he jumped up to try again, ten yards behind the last.
“If I’m to gain those yards,” he thought, “I’ve got to run real fast!”
Exceeding everything he had, he regained eight, then ten...
but trying hard to catch the lead, he slipped and fell again.
Defeat! He lay there silently. A tear dropped from his eye.
“There’s no sense running anymore! Three strikes I’m out! Why try?
I’ve lost, so what’s the use?” he thought. “I’ll live with my disgrace.”
But then he thought about his dad, who soon he’d have to face.

“Get up,” an echo sounded low, “you haven’t lost at all,
for all you have to do to win is rise each time you fall.
Get up!” the echo urged him on, “Get up and take your place!
You were not meant for failure here! Get up and win that race!”
So, up he rose to run once more, refusing to forfeit,
and he resolved that win or lose, at least he wouldn’t quit.
So far behind the others now, the most he’d ever been,
still he gave it all he had and ran like he could win.
Three times he’d fallen stumbling, three times he rose again.
Too far behind to hope to win, he still ran to the end.

They cheered another boy who crossed the line and won first place,
head high and proud and happy -- no falling, no disgrace.
But, when the fallen youngster crossed the line, in last place,
the crowd gave him a greater cheer for finishing the race.
And even though he came in last with head bowed low, unproud,
you would have thought he’d won the race, to listen to the crowd.
And to his dad he sadly said, “I didn’t do so well.”
“To me, you won,” his father said. “You rose each time you fell.”

And now when things seem dark and bleak and difficult to face,
the memory of that little boy helps me in my own race.
For all of life is like that race, with ups and downs and all.
And all you have to do to win is rise each time you fall.
And when depression and despair shout loudly in my face,
another voice within me says, “Get up and win that race!”

..................

If you need someone to talk to, even though we havent met, I am always here for my freinds.

 

Duneme,

Just a few comments to yours ....

1) Get a lawyer. Do it when she does first, but not before - Get a female one. The first one to get one is pretty much calling the marriage over. Once the lawyers start into it, its very rare the marriage can be saved.

2) Don't move out of the house or let your wife move out without talking to the lawyer first. Probably good advice. If you get stuck with the big house, you'll probably end up selling it. Half the money from the sale will go to her. Believe me, this is the least of your worries.

3) As far as the kids go, I can tell you with 100% confidence in the State of Oregon and the State of Washington, there is no such thing as true 50% custody. Thats also true with most states. The women get the kids - PERIOD. She can take them away and you can do nothing about it. You'll get visitation rights, which will include weekends, and weekdays, BUT THIS WILL NOT AFFECT YOUR CHILD SUPPORT. Some States do lower your payments based on how many hours you visit your kids - its pretty minor. The only time you can fight to keep the kids is if she is a bad mom - then you'll have to prove it. Expect her to use the kids as bargaining chips. She'll want somthing in return everytime you see them. She'll move farther away unless you pay more. And she will keep doing it until you are drained dry. She will lie about things that shes paid for, like day care, extra medical expenses to keep the money flowing. The more you see your kids, expect your love for them to be used against you. When you do see her, never dress up, appear to be poorer than poor. After the big lawyer battle, cut those guys loose. Show up in court personally when she asks the state to revisit compensation. The judge will see right through her crap, and unlike a lawyer, will not charge you a dime. Once she is caught lying, it will be a matter of court record - She will never be trusted by the court system again.

4) Don't agree to anything in writing unless your lawyer says it's O.K. Expect your lawyer to work everything so its NOT amicable. Expect your lawyer to stir things up so that you mistrust her more than anything else and the only way out is to pay your atty to "fix" it. Second guess every step your lawyer makes, then cut them loose as soon as the paper work is done.

5) "Get over-it" - I think its fair to say that you will never actually get over it. It will become a part of who you are - which is why God put us here to begin with. Things will get better, but they tend to get worse before that. In all fairness, people that tell you to simply "Get Over It", probably have good intentions, but dont have any idea what you are going through. To be honest, you are going to have to greive a little with the loss of what you tried to make, a family, before things get better. However, in the end, you will be a better man for it. You will think of your kids all the time. As the kids get older, as mine have, they get smart and they will see the circumstances for what they are - and judge her and you based on that. So, I will tell you to make every decision based on the happiness of everyone involved - including your ex, your kids, and yourself. That way, when they look back, they will understand. This is the tough part - This will be harder than dealing with the death of a loved one. Because they are not dead, there is no closure, they are simply missing from your much of your life. Everyone, including relatives, family members, and idiots on the street will have a solution for your problem. Experts will crawl out from the woodwork and give free advice to fix this problem. The biggest thing I have learned is that there is no fix, there is simply work cut out. Its a long term project that will probably never end in your lifetime. In the begining, dont talk to people about your issues that have never been through divorce. Thier advice is useless. The problem is so complex, that they cant even comprehend the most basic elements - so dont even waste your breath with them. They do mean well, but they are simply illequipted.

6) My last advice. When things get worse, before they get better, you will look for an escape. Find a healthy hobby when you arent going to battle. Work on your quad, make some new friends that actually listen, without giving too much advice. Be carefull of people wanting to take advantage of your situation, never talk about this at work - your status is officially single, not divorced. When tragedy strikes, the blame game is too tempting for most people to avoid playing. Cut the number of your friends in half, and make sure the ones you do have are top quality, good listeners, and non-judgemental. Make sure they have no connection with your ex-wife. Never never tell those friends your wifes first name, or the city she lives in. Remember that married friends tell thier wives everything and that women stick together no matter what. You'll find your friends wives calling up your ex and giving them ammo without you knowing.


Ok - so now you have a reason to make it work. Fix it if you can. If you ever need to talk, you know how to contact me day or night.

 

Demon - Darn good advice, man. Sometimes it's hard to find the words, but you said it all.

 

[quote]
Originally posted by: OregonDunePatrol
Here on the east coast, thats how things work....the father never gets anything but visitation rights. That is unless he provides an overwhelming amount of evidence proving the mother is unfit. I have never been through divorce, but have seen this happen with friends.....IMO, it appears that ODP hit the nail on the head with this bit of advise....unfortunately [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img].

 

Sorry to hear about your "suprize" and hope you get thru it best you can, or even salvage it if possible.

I have to admit I was impressed with all of the good, well intended advice you got here so far.

I hope that the following makes things easier, and not causes you any more worry etc.

What I find most times when people I know directly come across this type of situation (one of them shocks the other with their request for seperating etc) the one being told is intially shocked, but later realizes that they had several signs of a problem or just should not have been so suprized except for the shock of actually hearing it.

We know our partners best, and they us etc so I can understand why we would know, but its really weird to think about why we didnt put it together or as some say just ignored all the signs of something being off.

Some had found it little more than an issue with time spent together and one of them feeling unwanted or second fiddle etc, but many more that I know were a combination of many little things that just built up over time. There was even a few that were related to mental health, and a couple of various types of substance abuse by one of them.

One thing that I notice all had in common was that one partner had reached their boiling point and needed change while the other was fully content with the situation. Not that both didnt realize, but just that the negative aspects of the relationship effected one more than the other.

A situation I hate to bring up because it does seriously upset some people is that dont discount that when a partner (married or not) wants to move on there is a very good chance that they are in another relationship. Dont allow this to effect your decisions on getting back together if that seems to be agreeable as many times people cant make such a large change without someone in their lives, and they dont always start these relationships for normal reasons and they can be easilly broken if they were truely just a "crutch" to help them thru the change etc.

Also dont misread that to mean that all cheating partners are that way, and be preparred for the possibility that they have found someone they may not be willing to let go.

Know I dont know you or your situation so please dont take offense to this, but its very possible that you may find this a blessing in disguise. An example is a friend who recently finalized his divorce who went out of his way to find me to appoligize for not being able to take my congratulations properly when I first heard of his now X moving out. To be honest neither was a "prize" in the first place, but you need in a relationship than a common undersireableness, and this woman was beyond describeable and doing nothing for their relationship except the negative things.

Though he was as heartbroken and suprized as anyone (most cant believe he was either, as it was that bad) after a year of being alone he more than realizes how much better off he is.

Now that can work both ways too.

Anyhow best advice is to stay calm, realize its deffinately not the end of your world (why do so many think this?), try and look at the whole situation from the outside and see what you can gain, do what you believe to be right and dont jump to any emotional conclusions or decisions, and basically just know you are your own person and pull from your strength as you go thru this new experience.

Best wishes and hopefully you work your way to something your comfortable with.

PS> you got all the legal advice already, but dont let some damn shark attorney push you into a divorce, and leave you both with half of what you started with.

 

Sorry to hear it. My parents are separated so I have an Idea whats happening. I wish you luck but make sure you get to see you'r kids when you want, I know I was limited to what time I saw my dad and my mum ended up turnin me against her and I walk out to live with my dad, now i hate my mum. But thats just my case, just make it easy on the kids and keep on goin. (i know in family courts here they don't care about dads).

Keep that chin up!

 

DemonDS and I have been through similar things, it is true. Todd was there for me when things were at thier worst. Look im strong old rooster now, but when things were bad, they were really really bad. Below is a poem that I wrote when things were at thier worst. Things are not like that now, but its something you and your wife should read before you jump into this. My ex read it just a few years ago - I saw the look in her eye - she actually started to understand. Most of my very close friends read this, and they too have understanding to what the worst times feel like.

<i>
Divorced Dad
By Marky
March 25, 2000


Life is better now and is more tolerable.
But the part that’s missing makes my life empty, not whole.
The absence of my kids is nearly unbearable.

The visit with them is now nearly complete,
only hours & minutes before they go.
The moment of joy then sorrow is at my feet.

They said that a man is built to conquer his emotions,
It’s like climbing mountain peak, with absolute control.
But my love for them is bigger than all the mountains and all the oceans.

I wonder, “will they love me”, as the years go by?
Will it be something they’ll believe and know?
Will my love be as big to them, or seem like a lie?

This challenge has no paths and no roads.
There is no way to build one here, and no way to leave.
My feelings of love never sleep, a trap set by someone whom I don’t know.

So here I am, with love inside that never ceases,
it’s like a warm breezy day, without a kite.
It’s the kind that hopelessly tries, but never pleases.

Oh God! I’m now a divorced father, it seems I have no honor.
Surely this is hell, or worse, not quite.
If it were hell, my love for them wouldn’t matter.

But the kind of father I am makes it matter,
How much longer must I wait?
Will it ever end? Will it ever get better?

If it does or if it doesn’t, it’s a sacrifice that wasn’t chosen.
A sacrifice made by many, the kind that keeps me awake.
The mountain seems too big, and certainly, much less the ocean.

</i>

A year later I wrote this poem ...

<i>
Crusade of Life
January 2001


In a day, a moment, the evil world crashed into my life.
Crashing and crashing, like a tide that never ebbs.
When it did, I had nothing, except the reason why.

I was rejected by my own congregation.
The reason why I crashed meant nothing to them.
There are people all around, but no one to help my situation.

I am an outcast with none of my own kind.
I am in a world where Buddha, Allah and Christ are dead.
Their truths, love, and kinship, I cannot find.

I am trapped by the reality of the world.
My progress is stopped by the pain.
There is no good here, their purpose is revealed.

I search for things so that I can forget.
I drive my car without the seatbelt on, maybe it will end?
I live from moment to moment, minute to minute.


I have become nothing except the dust of the earth.


This is my reality; it’s why I stay close to my family.
Even when they shouldn’t, they are there.
Everything else outside is just worldly.

My trust is healed and hope is found.
With more experience comes more knowledge.
Now I have hope to rebuild and rebound.

Knowledge begets the wisdom to start again.
The congregation’s cries are now only slight sounds.
I am full of hope. I wish this life would never end.

The cause of God is in me, and all around.
Everything I am, is from everything I was, and experienced.
I am truly not lost. To me, I am found.

If I had a choice, to relive it all over again,
I would, because living life is part of the plan.
I can fall down and get up. This is how joy eclipses pain.

</i>

I can tell you now, after 5 years, I dont even write poetry! Things are truely good. Thats not to say that lifes challenges are gone - Hardly! They just seem more simple now. I mean, if I got through this, I can do anything. Again I say, try with all of your might to make it work. If you cant, realize that your life is hardly over. There is more good to discover than you could possibly imagine. You'll have a keen eye for finding it after you've seen the bad. And let me tell you brother, I have seen a lot of bad in my day.

Like the line from the move Twister ... "Jo, sometimes bad things happen, there is nothing you can do about it" . Do what you can, but realize that you can only control 1/2 of it in the end. If she wants to crash it, you are only the co-pilot - You may find she's cut your controls on the way down.

Like Duneme has in his signature, BROTHERHOOD ABOVE ALL ELSE! EXCEPT HONOR!!. God I love that.