Fatholly,

Thanks. I think its great that you are studying the different systems. As more and more people get them, there will be more acceptance. As I have mentioned in other posts, the 'acceptance' has already happened in the snowmobile sport. They have a lot of 2 stroke EFI systems there. Boondocker and BOSS both cut thier teeth on that market and truley have a lot of experience in that field. The two companies did take different paths - BOSS with the nitrous regulator and separate fuel system, and Boondocker with it's 'carb bowl' pressure system. When they both started marketing to the ATV industry, the differences really start to show themselves. You may want to contact Kelly at KMS who is a dealer with both, and has dynoed both. He has some very interesting data.

 

im not a rich guy so everytime i push that magic button im worried about if its tuned rite and all that other stuf. the thing that holds alot of people back from installing nitrous i believe is the tuning part. im open to other ideas but rite now im running boondockers. someone needs to design a 100% self tuning system to take that second guessinf yourself equation out of it. thats what im looking for.

 

Talk to SLC650 how easy it is - I will be showing him this afternoon how to tune his. Tune once, and then your done.

 

Since we're on the subject... I had a few more questions. Does a nitrous system need to be dyno tuned or can it be done seat of the pants? Does a professional need to do this or can a rookie do it? How risky is it before it is tuned correctly? Thanks

 

I've installed quite a few of both the Boondockers system and the Boss system. Tuning - The method of tuning on the BOSS system is simple. The only variable is the fuel since the nitrous is regulated. The 'Valve' that controls the extra fuel is called the Micro Fuel Manager. You start by turning the valve out 6 turns. Then you run the nitrous like you would normally. At 6 turns out, it is flowing the max fuel - and will be rich - the motor will BOG. Go back, turn your MFM in another turn to 5 turns out. repeat this process just until there is no BOG.

This is the 'Seat of the Pants' method. Its very safe, but you wont get all the horsepower out because you will probably be a little rich - but safe. If you dynoed it with a sniffer, then you could dial that MFM in a tad more and get some more horsepower out of it.

The boondocker system uses a small valve on thier nitrous manifold to do 'mini' adjustments. The primary adjustment take a bit more time. They use air pressure generated from the nitrous manifold to add fuel to the carb. The air pressure gets hosed back to the vent tube on the carb thus pumping up the float bowl. To tune it, you hook up a water manometer by a use of a 'T' in that line. Push the nitrous button at idle and look at the water manometer. If its showing too much air pressure (too rich) then you have to 'bleed off' more air so that the pressure is not as great. To do this, you can place a vent 'T' in that line with an orifice cap with a small jet hole in that. Then you drill larger holes into the cap until the pressure is correct. Large temperature swings cause the bottle to reduce pressure, or increase pressure - thus throwing off your original settings - thats when the manometer can get a little goofy to tune.

 

If you are looking for a little 'bang' with a lot of reliability, you may want to just ask how many people have had motor issues with a 'wet system' (Boss Nos, NOS etc.) or with a dry system (Boondockers). If you are after heads up racing, a wet system is probalby best. Just my $.02 worth.

 

I was under the impression the new Boss Noss is kind of a hybrid of the BD dry system and the traditional wet systems.

Have I misunderstood?[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

The defintion has been blurred.

1) Wet System - The traditional definition of a wet system is when those systems push Nitrous and Fuel together in a fogger. Extra fuel and nitrous are combined and placed in the intake manifold.

2) Dry System - The traditional definition of a dry system is when those systems push nitrous only into the head. There is NO additional fuel. These systems rely on the very cold condition of liquid nitrous to cool the burn.

3) Hybrid system - They are like wet systems because they find a way to add additional fuel. However they dont mix them together but rather place them in separate locations.

 

I have put all types of systems together. I've done wet systems until my eyes bled and only recently (last year and a half) have I worked on and installed/tuned BoonDocker systems. The wet systems were a beast of sorts, and you tuned more than raced with these systems. I've used wet systems racing boats, cars, superbikes etc. etc. In EVERY type of racing with wet systems, the story was always the same. When I tried my first Boondocker (on my DS), I didn't know what to expect. My thought was that I would have the same amount of tuning with more consistant results. Boy was I wrong!!!!

This system that I have on my bike is the big two jet system. It's capable of an advertised 50hp. I run a 5 hole jet which yields me 21 - 22hp at the rear wheel on the dyno. Once installed the system takes VERY little to adjust or understand. Much safer than the wet systems are, the no-fuel-pump system works every time I hit the button. Having so many less parts is a plus. The idea of not hiding a lot of parts is great and naturally, less parts means less chance of failure. A simple check of the Manometer before I go to the hill (2 minutes....) and I'm on my way. I get the same shot every race, each and every day. Bottle pressure is always something that needs to be controlled, but if you mount your bottle smartly, even that portion of the equation is easy.

I know that Marky sold BD and now sells BN. I have no issue with Marky or what he is doing. I'm happy to see him give BD credit. As far as the BOSS being the ticket, I think it's going to have to be proven before I could recommend it. This weekend sounds like it should yield some answers. I've talked to some that I would consider at the top of thier games in the DS world. And they are not sure that the Boss is where it needs to be... That said, I hope that it becomes the wave of the future. Anytime we can get a system that is more consistant, safer and easier to tune - we all win.

For those who are testing the system this weekend.... REPORT BACK and give us the skinny.

Marky, any info you have (I'm talking about specifics..) Fill us in and let's have a good discussion.

Bigdaddy OUT!

 

Bigdaddy,

That was an excellent post. ... and thank you for giving me credit. I would love to sit here and tell you why the BOSS system is better - instead I will simply point out facts on how each system works. I would prefer the people running them to say what they will say. Like most technology, it boils down to how it works. The biggest problem with nitrous is not the fuel delivery, its the nitrous delivery. How each system copes with that, is truley how successfull they will be.

This is gonna be a great weekend!