How Fast??
#21
09-30-2006, 06:44 PM
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No Mercy Racing! Got NOS?
No Mercy Racing! Got NOS?
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#22
10-01-2006, 02:53 AM
How Fast??
Originally posted by: choosetolose04
Thanks a lot Meaner. Its good to know there are "true" friends out there besides those who are only "true" to your face......[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Originally posted by: MrMeaner
Ill be there and Im sure Choose wont show up unprepared. Im pulling for you Choose. I hope it can be done and with the current technology I think we will see some of these times.
Ill be there and Im sure Choose wont show up unprepared. Im pulling for you Choose. I hope it can be done and with the current technology I think we will see some of these times.
Thanks a lot Meaner. Its good to know there are "true" friends out there besides those who are only "true" to your face......[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
You said it best when you told me you weren't going to do the drama thing anymore. Lets stick to the issues here. Do you think my appraisel of the feasability of a stockbore making enough power to run 3.7's - even if the chassis' get down under 250 lbs - is incorrect?
If so, why?
Ron
#23
10-01-2006, 11:24 PM
How Fast??
Originally posted by: DSNUT
lol, I almost missed this thread![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] So you plan to have a sub 250lb bike with around 130 hp, stock bore & stroke Rotax 650?
That is about what it will take to lay down times in the 3.7's..........assuming you cut a very good light and put every bit of that power into forward motion[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Does that time still sound reasonable? What is even less likely is a 650cc having the torque to pull that kind of trap speed. If anyone does a 3.7 with a stock bore, they are going to have to cut a way better 60 ft time than a 1.34 because a 650 won't have the torque to pull the upper gears that hard on the end of the track[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] This will be low gears, tons of tire and about a 70 or 80 shot of NOS that is dynoing a true 60 hp increase in the lightest rigid DS yet[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
As Mike said................good luck![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
Originally posted by: choosetolose04
I plan on running a 3.77 at 86 mph with a stock bore. Wish me luck.
I plan on running a 3.77 at 86 mph with a stock bore. Wish me luck.
That is about what it will take to lay down times in the 3.7's..........assuming you cut a very good light and put every bit of that power into forward motion[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Does that time still sound reasonable? What is even less likely is a 650cc having the torque to pull that kind of trap speed. If anyone does a 3.7 with a stock bore, they are going to have to cut a way better 60 ft time than a 1.34 because a 650 won't have the torque to pull the upper gears that hard on the end of the track[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] This will be low gears, tons of tire and about a 70 or 80 shot of NOS that is dynoing a true 60 hp increase in the lightest rigid DS yet[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
As Mike said................good luck![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
#24
10-02-2006, 12:41 AM
How Fast??
Originally posted by: crazypainter
I didn't see where Choose stated stock stroke, just stock bore. Did it get more feasible now?
Originally posted by: DSNUT
lol, I almost missed this thread![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] So you plan to have a sub 250lb bike with around 130 hp, stock bore & stroke Rotax 650?
That is about what it will take to lay down times in the 3.7's..........assuming you cut a very good light and put every bit of that power into forward motion[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Does that time still sound reasonable? What is even less likely is a 650cc having the torque to pull that kind of trap speed. If anyone does a 3.7 with a stock bore, they are going to have to cut a way better 60 ft time than a 1.34 because a 650 won't have the torque to pull the upper gears that hard on the end of the track[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] This will be low gears, tons of tire and about a 70 or 80 shot of NOS that is dynoing a true 60 hp increase in the lightest rigid DS yet[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
As Mike said................good luck![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
Originally posted by: choosetolose04
I plan on running a 3.77 at 86 mph with a stock bore. Wish me luck.
I plan on running a 3.77 at 86 mph with a stock bore. Wish me luck.
That is about what it will take to lay down times in the 3.7's..........assuming you cut a very good light and put every bit of that power into forward motion[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Does that time still sound reasonable? What is even less likely is a 650cc having the torque to pull that kind of trap speed. If anyone does a 3.7 with a stock bore, they are going to have to cut a way better 60 ft time than a 1.34 because a 650 won't have the torque to pull the upper gears that hard on the end of the track[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] This will be low gears, tons of tire and about a 70 or 80 shot of NOS that is dynoing a true 60 hp increase in the lightest rigid DS yet[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
As Mike said................good luck![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
If his stockbore and stockstroke motor makes 67 hp, a 10mm stroke will take it up to about 14:1 compression and will add 10% displacement. That will yield about 75 - 76 hp total. He will need a NOS shot that nets about 55hp and about 60 lbs will have to come off the bike..............Then 3.7's are possible.
Stroke will be responsible for increased torque of about 7lbft and hp of about, well, lol, 7 hp[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] Increased compression will add the additional 1 to 2 hp I added in the total............assuming all other variables remain the same.
No.......stroke doesn't do enough by itself. It will be his ability to make huge hp with NOS that will make it happen and he will have to find a way to shave 20% off the weight of his bike or buy a new chassis that is light enough............otherwise the necessary hp to get a 310 lb chassis to a 3.7 will be unbelievably difficult to achieve[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
We ran 4.2's and one 4.16 with a 110 hp 730 on NOS with a 265 lb chassis. It was on a slow track but it was only costing people about 2 tenths. So lets say we had a Bonzai run of a corrected 3.96.........which is acheivable with 110 hp and 265 lbs on a dirt/sand track.
Lets just say on the off chance that i know what I am talking about..........How much hp do you guys think you have to make to take a 310 lb chassis to a 3.7? If you have more torque like an 830, you won't need as much hp to do it. With a stockbore, how much? I am going to say about 210[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]lol
A little more hp and a little less weight will take you from a 4.4 to 4.3. It takes a lot more power and a lot less weight to go from a 3.8 to a 3.7.
#25
10-02-2006, 08:48 AM
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How Fast??
Ron, Can you tell me how you got so educated about what it takes to run any particular numbers in 300ft sand drags? Because it seems that before Dunefest, you were nothing more than a wannabe hill shooter. Can you clarify that for me please.
You tried to go fast by sinking an astronomical amount of money into a bigbore stroker motor but failed to realize that without shedding the weight on your own personal bike, it wasnt even gonna be competitive with my bone stock engine.
You tried to go fast by sinking an astronomical amount of money into a bigbore stroker motor but failed to realize that without shedding the weight on your own personal bike, it wasnt even gonna be competitive with my bone stock engine.
#26
10-02-2006, 11:18 AM
How Fast??
Stick to the numbers Scott[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] If you think my numbers are off..........explain why. You told me you weren't into the drama anymore so prove that by not making this personal.
You claimed you could run a 3.7. I explained based on power to weight ratios what it would take. If you think i am off on my numbers, surely you have reasoning that will back up your position[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
I am all ears[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
You claimed you could run a 3.7. I explained based on power to weight ratios what it would take. If you think i am off on my numbers, surely you have reasoning that will back up your position[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
I am all ears[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
#27
10-02-2006, 11:24 AM
How Fast??
Originally posted by: DSNUT
If his stockbore and stockstroke motor makes 67 hp, a 10mm stroke will take it up to about 14:1 compression and will add 10% displacement. That will yield about 75 - 76 hp total. He will need a NOS shot that nets about 55hp and about 60 lbs will have to come off the bike..............Then 3.7's are possible.
Stroke will be responsible for increased torque of about 7lbft and hp of about, well, lol, 7 hp[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] Increased compression will add the additional 1 to 2 hp I added in the total............assuming all other variables remain the same.
No.......stroke doesn't do enough by itself. It will be his ability to make huge hp with NOS that will make it happen and he will have to find a way to shave 20% off the weight of his bike or buy a new chassis that is light enough............otherwise the necessary hp to get a 310 lb chassis to a 3.7 will be unbelievably difficult to achieve[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
We ran 4.2's and one 4.16 with a 110 hp 730 on NOS with a 265 lb chassis. It was on a slow track but it was only costing people about 2 tenths. So lets say we had a Bonzai run of a corrected 3.96.........which is acheivable with 110 hp and 265 lbs on a dirt/sand track.
Lets just say on the off chance that i know what I am talking about..........How much hp do you guys think you have to make to take a 310 lb chassis to a 3.7? If you have more torque like an 830, you won't need as much hp to do it. With a stockbore, how much? I am going to say about 210[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]lol
A little more hp and a little less weight will take you from a 4.4 to 4.3. It takes a lot more power and a lot less weight to go from a 3.8 to a 3.7.
Originally posted by: crazypainter
I didn't see where Choose stated stock stroke, just stock bore. Did it get more feasible now?
Originally posted by: DSNUT
lol, I almost missed this thread![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] So you plan to have a sub 250lb bike with around 130 hp, stock bore & stroke Rotax 650?
That is about what it will take to lay down times in the 3.7's..........assuming you cut a very good light and put every bit of that power into forward motion[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Does that time still sound reasonable? What is even less likely is a 650cc having the torque to pull that kind of trap speed. If anyone does a 3.7 with a stock bore, they are going to have to cut a way better 60 ft time than a 1.34 because a 650 won't have the torque to pull the upper gears that hard on the end of the track[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] This will be low gears, tons of tire and about a 70 or 80 shot of NOS that is dynoing a true 60 hp increase in the lightest rigid DS yet[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
As Mike said................good luck![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
Originally posted by: choosetolose04
I plan on running a 3.77 at 86 mph with a stock bore. Wish me luck.
I plan on running a 3.77 at 86 mph with a stock bore. Wish me luck.
That is about what it will take to lay down times in the 3.7's..........assuming you cut a very good light and put every bit of that power into forward motion[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Does that time still sound reasonable? What is even less likely is a 650cc having the torque to pull that kind of trap speed. If anyone does a 3.7 with a stock bore, they are going to have to cut a way better 60 ft time than a 1.34 because a 650 won't have the torque to pull the upper gears that hard on the end of the track[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img] This will be low gears, tons of tire and about a 70 or 80 shot of NOS that is dynoing a true 60 hp increase in the lightest rigid DS yet[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
As Mike said................good luck![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
If his stockbore and stockstroke motor makes 67 hp, a 10mm stroke will take it up to about 14:1 compression and will add 10% displacement. That will yield about 75 - 76 hp total. He will need a NOS shot that nets about 55hp and about 60 lbs will have to come off the bike..............Then 3.7's are possible.
Stroke will be responsible for increased torque of about 7lbft and hp of about, well, lol, 7 hp[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] Increased compression will add the additional 1 to 2 hp I added in the total............assuming all other variables remain the same.
No.......stroke doesn't do enough by itself. It will be his ability to make huge hp with NOS that will make it happen and he will have to find a way to shave 20% off the weight of his bike or buy a new chassis that is light enough............otherwise the necessary hp to get a 310 lb chassis to a 3.7 will be unbelievably difficult to achieve[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
We ran 4.2's and one 4.16 with a 110 hp 730 on NOS with a 265 lb chassis. It was on a slow track but it was only costing people about 2 tenths. So lets say we had a Bonzai run of a corrected 3.96.........which is acheivable with 110 hp and 265 lbs on a dirt/sand track.
Lets just say on the off chance that i know what I am talking about..........How much hp do you guys think you have to make to take a 310 lb chassis to a 3.7? If you have more torque like an 830, you won't need as much hp to do it. With a stockbore, how much? I am going to say about 210[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]lol
A little more hp and a little less weight will take you from a 4.4 to 4.3. It takes a lot more power and a lot less weight to go from a 3.8 to a 3.7.
#28
10-02-2006, 11:36 AM
How Fast??
Go read my response on the thread where you asked me that question.
Again, stick to the numbers if you can. If you think I am off with my power to weight requirements to lay down a 3.7..........explain why?..............with facts. Trying to berate my credibility on the subject only makes it look like your argument isn't very strong.
I would love to be wrong, give me some numbers and reasons why.
Again, stick to the numbers if you can. If you think I am off with my power to weight requirements to lay down a 3.7..........explain why?..............with facts. Trying to berate my credibility on the subject only makes it look like your argument isn't very strong.
I would love to be wrong, give me some numbers and reasons why.