Can-Am 450...
#31
10-25-2006, 09:14 PM
#32
10-26-2006, 12:21 PM
#33
10-27-2006, 05:59 PM
Can-Am 450...
its a twin with efi, aprilia engine, hopefully it has huge susp like the ds650, i hope its less than 370lbs, optional reverse would be nice too and 6 gears for really high top speed -basically
DS450
-efi
-twin
-6 speed manual hydraulic clutch
12"travel on front, 11" travel on the back
18" rear tires like the ltr450
48 or 49" wide
31" seat height
good length too, i dont want a limmo, i dont want a smartcar, something like the ltr450 length
dry weight: 369lbs
around low 60s in hp 62 or 63hp?
i knwo i forgot some stuff but o well
DS450
-efi
-twin
-6 speed manual hydraulic clutch
12"travel on front, 11" travel on the back
18" rear tires like the ltr450
48 or 49" wide
31" seat height
good length too, i dont want a limmo, i dont want a smartcar, something like the ltr450 length
dry weight: 369lbs
around low 60s in hp 62 or 63hp?
i knwo i forgot some stuff but o well
#34
10-27-2006, 07:58 PM
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Can-Am 450...
Originally posted by: crazy1291
its a twin with efi, aprilia engine, hopefully it has huge susp like the ds650, i hope its less than 365lbs, optional reverse would be nice too and 6 gears for really high top speed
its a twin with efi, aprilia engine, hopefully it has huge susp like the ds650, i hope its less than 365lbs, optional reverse would be nice too and 6 gears for really high top speed
It will not be a twin....It will be a 450cc tripple cyl...150cc's each!!
TPR
#35
10-27-2006, 08:21 PM
Can-Am 450...
Dealer says it the twin 450 aprilla, the way i understand it is that can-am is the maker or partner in that 450 twin.they showed it to me on the internet, and no i dont know how to find it. it was something like can-am/aprilla.can they give us what we want, darn right they can ? is will they?
#36
10-31-2006, 06:56 PM
#37
10-31-2006, 07:05 PM
Can-Am 450...
Originally posted by: shmee
[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
Originally posted by: BBR650
how about this guys, this is from brp reps. IT IS A 450 300- 350 lbs, injected they are undecided whether for production it will be 5 or 6 speed but is to be the most technologically advanced atv EVER built., and is faster than the renegade.
how about this guys, this is from brp reps. IT IS A 450 300- 350 lbs, injected they are undecided whether for production it will be 5 or 6 speed but is to be the most technologically advanced atv EVER built., and is faster than the renegade.
#38
10-31-2006, 09:46 PM
Can-Am 450...
This is a great question!
I am looking for Can-Am, or whatever, to make a racer. All factory machines seem to need special stuff added depending on your desires. Make it easy to set up either MX or XC. Offer up a machine that is easy to work on and dependable enough to take the beating a Cross-Country race serves up. Strong enough to take jumping. YET light as you can get.
Everyone is different and likes different style of riding. I like XC. This is how I'd build mine.
First and foremost----metric nut and bolt system. All nuts and bolts should be as close to the same size as possible in certain areas. Like removing the plastics. One size N&B. Ease of maintainence is important. BRP was always easy, I thought. So no problem there!
Motor Type? 450cc or close, Single cylinder OHC - liqued cooled
Intake Type? For me, I want something that is easy to work on for cleaning. I like the Kehien FCR, it's ease and wide availability. I like the Mikuni too. Also easy to work on. Don't want fuel injection. No way.
Frame Material? Maybe even something different. If somehow they could gusset with carbon fiber or kevlar using tesil strength. I don't know the desities or strength/weakness of either, just rambling. This is a fantasy, right! The subframe could also be made out of a strong, yet light material. The frame for the most part would have to be steel. For protection, I want a thick and strong material. I have found nothing better than a thick piece of aluminum, however I see some guys copying Polaris design with a chain guard that is merely a thick piece of al that resembles a brake disk. It is just a bit bigger around than the rear chain&sprocket. and a little tiny gutterguard for the rear rotor. I like that design.
Shocks? I do like the Fox system idea. Have never tested them. In XC, the race can be more than 2 hrs. Heat build-up becomes a factor. So I am going with the Fox shocks [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
Suspension? I want an adjustable camber double a-arm front end and a single axle rear. I want to win, and the independent rear has not proven to be any better. So instead of trying to reinvent the wheel, I am going with a straight axle. Adjustable, too! I want a rear link that gives me max travel and proper spring travel that lowers my center of gravity a bit and is for 20"-22" rear tires.
Brakes? I want a dual piston caliper on a drilled and vented rotor w/ coated, steel braided lines.
Dimensions? 48-50" adjustable rear
Tires? Hmmm? That changes, so whatever they can put on them to keep costs down, I'll get my own
[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
I am looking for Can-Am, or whatever, to make a racer. All factory machines seem to need special stuff added depending on your desires. Make it easy to set up either MX or XC. Offer up a machine that is easy to work on and dependable enough to take the beating a Cross-Country race serves up. Strong enough to take jumping. YET light as you can get.
Everyone is different and likes different style of riding. I like XC. This is how I'd build mine.
First and foremost----metric nut and bolt system. All nuts and bolts should be as close to the same size as possible in certain areas. Like removing the plastics. One size N&B. Ease of maintainence is important. BRP was always easy, I thought. So no problem there!
Motor Type? 450cc or close, Single cylinder OHC - liqued cooled
Intake Type? For me, I want something that is easy to work on for cleaning. I like the Kehien FCR, it's ease and wide availability. I like the Mikuni too. Also easy to work on. Don't want fuel injection. No way.
Frame Material? Maybe even something different. If somehow they could gusset with carbon fiber or kevlar using tesil strength. I don't know the desities or strength/weakness of either, just rambling. This is a fantasy, right! The subframe could also be made out of a strong, yet light material. The frame for the most part would have to be steel. For protection, I want a thick and strong material. I have found nothing better than a thick piece of aluminum, however I see some guys copying Polaris design with a chain guard that is merely a thick piece of al that resembles a brake disk. It is just a bit bigger around than the rear chain&sprocket. and a little tiny gutterguard for the rear rotor. I like that design.
Shocks? I do like the Fox system idea. Have never tested them. In XC, the race can be more than 2 hrs. Heat build-up becomes a factor. So I am going with the Fox shocks [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
Suspension? I want an adjustable camber double a-arm front end and a single axle rear. I want to win, and the independent rear has not proven to be any better. So instead of trying to reinvent the wheel, I am going with a straight axle. Adjustable, too! I want a rear link that gives me max travel and proper spring travel that lowers my center of gravity a bit and is for 20"-22" rear tires.
Brakes? I want a dual piston caliper on a drilled and vented rotor w/ coated, steel braided lines.
Dimensions? 48-50" adjustable rear
Tires? Hmmm? That changes, so whatever they can put on them to keep costs down, I'll get my own
[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
#39
10-31-2006, 11:16 PM
Can-Am 450...
Originally posted by: TPR
After reading more about the Aprilla V-Twin 450, I uncovered a couple of things. First, the motor itself cost about 5% more to build than a 450 single. They did not give out specific weight for the motor but the bike's overall weight is 35 lbs heavier than the heaviest of the big 5, (Suz, Kaw, Yam, Hon, KTM) so that could be some added motor weight and structural weight. They did say that the motor had a low cg, which made helped the handling of the motorcycle.
Now the power was estimated at 60 HP in MX trim which is real good, but we know that this get's changed when you apply it to a quad. So figure in the power loss and then potential gain with intake and exhaust work.
What most don't understand is that while compact for a V-twin, the motor/tranny is takes up nearly the same overall space as a DS 650, which may cause packaging concerns.
The other aspect that I read was that the SX and MX series has outlawed multicylinder engines in the 450 class. If this were to spill over to the ATVA and WPSA events, the v-twin would be out of the question.
Remember, Can-Am/BRP has, we assume, been working on a 450 class quad for some time now. (Most estimates are that it takes about 3-4 years to bring one to market, closer to 4 if you are building a motor from the ground up.
Take that for what it's worth, but I think that given the landscape of the 450 market, it will be like their MX cousins...you could nearly interchange plastics from year to year and notice only subtle differences. They may get a little more power here, a little more travel there, and a couple of lbs off on that, but once this and the proposed KTM/Polaris 450 hits, it will then be a game of refinement,
10 years from now, you will probably see a 325lb 450 that easily makes 65hp in stock trim.
Now DS lovers may hate this, but I like this thought....replace the DS, with a lighter DS with the Aprilla 550 version of the same V-Twin...now we are talking!!! It makes 70HP in stock trim, and has a power delivery that would be ideal in the environments most people use the DS in, desert and dunes. You could keep the dimensions of the DS similar....maybe a hair smaller and much lighter....then Can-Am can soak up all those Yamaha guys with the Banshee hangover.
I have heard nothing of the above statement, that is my fanciful speculation, but that 550 then could go head to head with the 525 Outlaw and 700 Rappy and make more power than both!!! Bring it in at 400 lbs....game over!!
TPR
After reading more about the Aprilla V-Twin 450, I uncovered a couple of things. First, the motor itself cost about 5% more to build than a 450 single. They did not give out specific weight for the motor but the bike's overall weight is 35 lbs heavier than the heaviest of the big 5, (Suz, Kaw, Yam, Hon, KTM) so that could be some added motor weight and structural weight. They did say that the motor had a low cg, which made helped the handling of the motorcycle.
Now the power was estimated at 60 HP in MX trim which is real good, but we know that this get's changed when you apply it to a quad. So figure in the power loss and then potential gain with intake and exhaust work.
What most don't understand is that while compact for a V-twin, the motor/tranny is takes up nearly the same overall space as a DS 650, which may cause packaging concerns.
The other aspect that I read was that the SX and MX series has outlawed multicylinder engines in the 450 class. If this were to spill over to the ATVA and WPSA events, the v-twin would be out of the question.
Remember, Can-Am/BRP has, we assume, been working on a 450 class quad for some time now. (Most estimates are that it takes about 3-4 years to bring one to market, closer to 4 if you are building a motor from the ground up.
Take that for what it's worth, but I think that given the landscape of the 450 market, it will be like their MX cousins...you could nearly interchange plastics from year to year and notice only subtle differences. They may get a little more power here, a little more travel there, and a couple of lbs off on that, but once this and the proposed KTM/Polaris 450 hits, it will then be a game of refinement,
10 years from now, you will probably see a 325lb 450 that easily makes 65hp in stock trim.
Now DS lovers may hate this, but I like this thought....replace the DS, with a lighter DS with the Aprilla 550 version of the same V-Twin...now we are talking!!! It makes 70HP in stock trim, and has a power delivery that would be ideal in the environments most people use the DS in, desert and dunes. You could keep the dimensions of the DS similar....maybe a hair smaller and much lighter....then Can-Am can soak up all those Yamaha guys with the Banshee hangover.
I have heard nothing of the above statement, that is my fanciful speculation, but that 550 then could go head to head with the 525 Outlaw and 700 Rappy and make more power than both!!! Bring it in at 400 lbs....game over!!
TPR
i dont think a 385lb quad will be good for mx, srry. i'ld rather have a ds550 at 400lbs
#40
11-01-2006, 08:29 AM
Can-Am 450...
If Can-Am does anything it needs to ba a racer. Duners have the DS and have had it for some years now. It is time to be a competitor in the XC and MX world. Anything over 350 lbs would be a waste of time. I can't see Can-am, with all the advertisment in the racing scene they have done as of late, to make anything less than a race machine. They have PLENTY of trail riding ATV's for pleasure.
LET"S GO RACING!
LET"S GO RACING!