Pudjumper,
Did you make a type-oh? If so, that's cool. But if not, then I'd like to know who on God's green earth can make a 70-80hp raptor and keep it reliable. The DS650 at 70-80hp is not <u>AS</u> rediculous (although still pretty far out there), but with a raptor-- come on man!! I would also like to know who builds these "50hp range" 400ex's. And they are reliable too, that must be one heck of a mechanic with <u>VERY</u> deep pockets. When you say "reliable", do you mean; "It'll finish a race" ? Or maybe you mean, "Hey, I got two trips to the dunes before something went wrong!" If so, that's cool. Or do you mean that with any of the machines that you have listed that you can stomp through the woods, ride the dunes, or drag race your buddies over and over again, put it up for the week, come back on the weekends and do it all again without any problems? Because this is reliability to me and nearly everyone else, and if you expect to get that in any way from the thoroughly worked engines that you have listed-- then pass it along and lets all kick back and enjoy the trip.

I don't mean to be so rude, but let's try not to exaggerate too much.


JP

P.S.-- If it is true, then really, who's your mechanic. Oh, and I can see a 400ex being in the high 40's and MAYBE low 50's and still be pretty reliable.

 

boogerbub, craycraft makes many reliable big bore raptors. They have a 730 raptor that runs 4.281 in 300' @ Texas Sand Drags in Fort Worth, Texas. I beleive that it makes 70+ HP without the bottle.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

Thanks for the info, but last I herd over in the Yammy forum, the craycraft motors were just starting to approach 70hp while still on gas. Actually it was 68hp that I read about and this was craycraft's premier machine. To gain even 6 more hp to get it into the 70-80hp range is a huge step and will take alot from the engine life; but then again, advances with the raptor engine are deffinately being made. So, I am not fool enough to say that it can't be done. However, I will need to see one of these machines in action and actually deal with them a few times before I will be able to accept them as "reliable."

Again, Thanks for the info.

JP

 

its a possibility that it could lose some of its reliability depending on if you put good parts on and you have bored out rite, also taking care of it will help too. the raptor isnt as fast as they say it is, if i were you i would also have the modded honda than the modded raptor. from guys i know with raptors they say that its really not as powerfull as its supposed to be for a 660cc , not bashing it that would have ben my choice besides my z400.




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2003 z400-renthal bars, dg nerfs

 

Get a WhiteBrothers stage1 cam it is the best a little spendier than hotcams but doesn't have the clicking noise and WhiteBrothers is race winning proven.

 

RELIABLE = Something you can depend on, or a action that happens over and again etc.

Think about that for a moment (yes before you think WTF am I up to this time LOL)

This could be how we expect our machines to start when we hit that button and run without problem till we turn them off. To some this could mean that this happens forever without any special care or some with no maintenence at all. To another it could mean only getting to the finish line or not needing to rebuild every race.

Reliability to a working mom driving her Honda to work is a different thing than it is to a Top Fuel dragster crew chief. Ever think of rebuilding your engine every 1/4 -1/2 mile?

I hope we all can agree on this and the earlier expanation of the BB v SB chevy engine was an interesting one that I know about very well. What we need to explain to the readers with out experience with these two engine configurations is that the SB is an excelent HP producing engine that can rev fairly high without major investment while the BB with its advantage of size and stroke can make some crazy torque without getting to expensive. While were not comparing 350's to 454's here I think we all can see where there would be an advantage to the larger size and longer stroke, but we also have to remember that HP dont mean didly as its torque that moves you. Guess this is part of the lewer reving BB making more power.

Back to reliability. No matter which engine you decide to mod once you create more compression and allow the engine to produce more power it will also create more heat as heat and power go together and heat is the result of the additional energy created by the engine. There are many tricks and special coatings that reduce the amount of heat transfered to the engine but it will still produce it and its the heat that reduces engine life. Now combine this additional heat with a few thousand more rev's and your engines life will be reduced considerably. No not like the Top Fueler mentioned above but not like moms honda either.

"If you want to play you got to play" applies here for sure. How much you want to increase the power will directly affect how often or fast things will wear and need refreshing etc. so dont get in over your head.

If you just bump up the cc's and the comp it will create so much additional heat now do these and add the rpm's and its so much more plus the extra internal speeds put more stress on the bearings and cams.

I dont want to scare anyone away from modding their machine as I am more than happy I did and will not jinx myself with any claims of how long without problems etc but you can build an extremely reliable EX engine that will stay with or out run most any (not every) modded 660.

Now b4 all the raptor guys go nuts (dont get mad at me I didnt deny your warranty claims lol) I want to add that I done a couple of these raptor engines and they have great potential and perform very well when done right. Hey even with just a pipe and intake it makes plenty of power but the problem I have had with all the ones I have rode is what to do beyond ripping thru the gears in a straight line and the handling in general. Not the ride they ride pretty nice for a stk machine and can get better with the right mods but like I have said to all the friends and family who had to go out and buy the biggest or newest etc is that Yami stuck it to you and produced the new yfz after they allready had your $$$ and now want the rest.

So pick your level of maintence you want to do and match the mods anf future reliability around that. I dont mind and maybe even enjoy tearing down the engine once a year and seeing that it doesnt even need any attention just be sure how the recent mods affected it etc. so what I consider reliable or acceptable engine life may be different than others. Many riders I know ride quads in a condition that I wouldnt drive it out of the garage and they do it every weekend, and when it stops running or crashes from loose front ends and neglected oil changes will then blame themselves or the reliability of the machine????????

 

your choice of cam or any other parts will depend greatly on each other and the amount of $$$ and skills you have etc.

If your building a 500cc stroker you wont be happy with a WB stage1 or anyone elses with a similar grind. But if your boring to 416cc it could work fine.

If your looking for an all around good cam that is a true value than look at HotCams as they just slightly changed specs from the popular grinds and are selling them at more realistic prices. These also have their limits and I know the Stage2 in mine though excelent for most is not 100% in this set up. Cams are hard to explain but you really need to make some decisions on bore, valves, porting, compression, exhaust, carb, how much you want to invest etc and how you want the power to come on before you setup the engine and decide on a cam.

 

boogerbub...this is pudjumper and yes there are reliable 50 hp EX running around week after week. Reliable as piped only EX...no way. Some of the builders that build them are Sparks, TC, FDO and I'm sure there are many more. I would question the shade tree machanic ability to build such a motor and maybe thats what your talking about. There are parts that must be bought to make them reliable such as Carillo rod, heavy duty cam chains, hardened rockers, ceramic coating, ect...which are expensive and do not add to hp but keeps them going. 70-80 hp Raptor and DS's are being seen more and more around the country that are reliable in the sense of being at the drag strip week after week. Higher maintenance...you bet! Maintenance is where alot of people slack and then blames the builder for building junk. Most of these machines that I'm talking about don't run on gas, they're running fuels such as alky, nitro methane, NOS and mixtures of other exotic fuels that make massive power by themselves. The trick is all about finding the right combination and sometimes that takes lots of $$/RD. Visit the Trailer Park Nationals in Texas in early June and you will see quite a few 70-80+ hp Raptor/DS's and a couple of 95 hp DS's going at it. There is no exageration in what I'm saying, and it's ok that you don't know...thats what these forums are for....sharing info. See you in June.

JMiller

 

Well said sandragggen, I mean pudjumper![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img] Are you going to make it down for ATPT Nationals?

 

I'm going to Aledo for sure this year COUNTRYJOEGLASS. I gotta see a fellow Missourian (TheBom) defend his title. TheBom also works on my DS so hopefully I might have a chance at some modded Raptors. I heard that 14mins put on a hella show last year and word has it that this year will be even better...with a new track and all. Are you going?

JMiller