Yes Pete my rubicon is a CTE. and yes the Rincon is smoother and also when you play in the sand pits ,mud and deep the water there is a very much so more power with the Rincon.

 

my 04 was full time.
05 is the first year for 2 and 4 wheel drive on the rubicon.

 

The CTE's are way smoother....the ride will rival any IRS, I guarentee it. The CTE's also do have more speed than the 04's and older. Honda has remapped the tranny for better performance and it shows. I just raced my pals 04 Ruby on the weekend, and in a short 150 yard sprint I had 4-5 lengths on him easy and was still pulling when we let off on it. That's giving him a half length head start and in 2wd I spun the tires a fair bit (on grass) before I really got going.

 

Nope they were not! The Foreman has had traxlock since 02. The Ruby just got traxlock in 05.

 

Come on? "very much so more power with the Rincon" Smoother too? by how much? what setting are your shocks adjusted to on the CTE? I've ridden with many Rincon's, 04 Ruby's, and Grizzly's and I'd say the Rincon falls short in many comparisons. All of the guys I ride with say that the CTE outperforms the Rincon in many ways even though it's 150cc smaller. We take turns riding each others quads, and everyone agrees that when it comes to the CTE'S..... It's all in the tranny. Honda needs to do more with the Rincon to separate it from the CTE and bring it up to par with other big bores.

 

if it shows, its only in D1 or D2. It makes no difference in ESP. It's really no big deal.

Your racing difference may have been because of the 2wd only (yes, the front drive siphons power, even a minute difference in front to rear tire size also saps power). Pavement too, to wipe out any advantage new tires or loose ground may have had?


I have no doubt that the CTE is a little quicker than the 04, but seeing I ride in ESP 90+% of the time, and NOBODY can ride over 40 with an ATV in the trails I ride, it wouldn't even be noticed that much by me or most others that buy a ute. Drag racing utes.....

 

Propnut, It shows in ESP too. I don't really care about speed in a ute either! I'm just saying that Honda has remapped the computer for the Hondamatic in an effort to improve response and Honda claims that, and I quote directly from the 05 pamphlet "you'll swear the engine has more power". Now I know that the engine does not have any more horsepower but, the bike does seem to feel stronger and definately accelerates a bit harder and crisper....end of story. Even in 4wd! Whatever Honda has done it is noticeable even for the average rider, and yes it is noticeable in ESP too. Your right though....it is no big deal, and the only reason we drag raced is because he wanted to see if the actual difference confirmed what he felt by the seat of the pants when he rode mine!

 

I think a good example of what "remapping" can do, look at the difference between D1 and D2. D1 is a lot more responsive than D2, and the only difference is the "mapping" of the tranny operation.

In ESP, if Honda changed the angle of the swash plate and orifice size, that too whoud change how the ATV would respond. It would be like putting in a whole new set of gears.

I think an 06 Rincon would be a better high speed trail machine than a Rubicon. I love climbing through rough terrain in the mountains in low-ESP, and I can't do that on a Rincon. Thats the way I like to ride, thats why I like the Rubicons transmission over the Rincons, not to mention the engine braking.

I have a real hard time believing a Rubicon, even a CTE, is as fast or faster than a Rincon.

I hope when we are ready for a new ATV the CTE will be available in the US.

 

Excellent insight Specta and I agree with your comparison of D1 vs. D2. Honda has remmapped the entire transmission though and an overall difference can be noticed in all modes. I am not saying for a second that a CTE is as fast as a Rincon...I haven't actually seen a race per say. I think people would be surprised though that a Rincon would not be as far ahead as 150cc might indicate it should. As I've said it's in the tranny, and I personally beleive that the Hondamatic is the best power delivery system on any quad and that really helps a 500cc machine perform at a higher level then expected. I believe it is superior to the tranny in the Rincon by quite a bit, and I think Honda can probably continue to enhance the Hondamatic for even more performance etc. I am going running with my buddies 04 Grizz this weekend and he says he can spank Rincons easy, so maybe I'll see how close I can stay with him. I have ridden his and it does feel stronger than mine but again, not as much as you would think from an extra 160cc.

 

Specta, please don't think I'm being difficult here, just trying to understand something I may not.

ESP uses preset angles of the swashplate. Even if these angles were changed, the only way you would see an improvement in acceleration was if the angles were closer together. But this would hurt either low end or top end, unless they added a 6th angle. You could not have both. Even with a change, it is still driver dependant.

D1 and D2 are mapped using the various inputs (TPS, Speed sensor, etc), so remapping how the swashplate reacts to the various input positions would result in a performance change, but ESP is manually controlled swashplate angle and not 'mapped' by the ECM as the D modes are - as I understand it.

I still don't know what you mean by orifice? Let's say the motor portion of the tranny starts of at zero leakage at 1 to 1. Pump output is bled off by moving the swashplate 'out', allowing lower ratios (1st, 2nd, etc.). I fail to see how an 'orifice' comes into play.

And Pete, I am guilty of drag racing my ute (red Hondas are faster than yellow ones!!), just didn't think it was a big deal because these things are ALL slow!!! So much depends on the holeshot with these things that drag racing on anything by pavement with traps is questionable. My KTM500 would disappear from these things by the time I was on wheelie in 4th trying not to flip it over, that thing wasn't even fast, it was quick though!