Sometimes less is more!

 

You'll grow very old and grey before this happens... I'm still waiting for the TRX500R that was SUPPOSED to be produced to compete with the Quadzilla 500 back in 1987.
Honda doesn't want to produce quads with big HP... never have, never will. (Not saying a 650EX would be a big HP machine, but it would be nice to see something in the 60+ HP range)

I'll be riding my antique forever at this point..

 

The big advantage of a 650 would be durability, not horsepower. When you can get 55 horsepower out of a little 450, hard to imagine needing more than that! But, the 450 will need more frequent rebuilds, where a 650 should last forever.

 

big bore is necessary yes the crf 450 produce as moush hp as the xr 650r but whit less more torque and the durability is a lot diferent
they need a trx 650 r liquid efi too complete whit bombardier yamaha and even kawasaki i love honda i add 3 honda atv they were all god but slowwwww vs the competition 1 trx300 4x4 2 400ex they need something new more than a 450

 

Power delivery would also be different on a big bore 650 than a little 450 and getting 55 hp out of them would be easier and more reliable with the 650.

 

Actually, all the other manufacturers are needing everyone's advice to figure out what they need to do to beat Honda in sales. I just got off the phone trying to explain to them why all their customers are on a Honda forum telling Honda what they need to be doing better to maintain their ample sales lead.

/Jon

 

Sales lead? Wasnt the yfz the best selling sport atv last year? Wasnt the raptor660 second? Are you talking about the full line, sport line, ute line, individual bikes, etc?

 

It's a joke (my previous post) because it seems everyone is ragging on the overall market leader for not entering niche markets (big ute and big bore sports). Perhaps Honda doesn't want to enter another market because their management team understands the BIG picture. You have to at least consider that introducing more models most likely increases costs in all phases from marketing, production, parts inventory, technical knowledge, etc. I am betting Honda believes there is a magic number of models to have out and Honda isn't willing to give up one to make room for another. For example, I bet the 400ex results in more profit for Honda than the Raptor does for Yamaha. The delta in advanced technology compared to the increased price for the Raptor is in Honda's favor (Yamaha is having to eat a percentage of profit to get you to buy the Raptor). So what is the point in Honda producing a more complex model to compete with the Raptor if it means having to drop the successful 400ex? How many 400ex buyers would be lost to a less profitable 650ex? I seem to remember taking a class on this in college. It was some sort of management class that also focused on just-in-time inventory management, distribution centers, etc. It tied in very closely with cost accounting.

Also, KNOWSALOT hit the nail on the head a long time ago in another thread that basically stated "we" website clicking, performance junkies are not the average consumers. The other manufacturers should worry more about marketing, customer service, and reliability for the masses if they want to grow market share. It is hard to grow market share selling $7,000-$8,000 quads. The "average" joe can tell you every time his/her quad had to go to the shop. If it is more than once, it isn't something soon forgotten. Honda knows what butters the bread. They may not lead in each and every segment. I am betting they beat out the YFZ450 though just from adding electric start.

Lucky for everyone that Honda has stayed away from these other niche markets so far. It gives the other product managers the opportunity to show some profit and promise to keep investors happy so they can do more R&D. It is the smaller number of performance oriented consumers that need to support these other manufacturers for their efforts if this is what you want. Everyone who is anti-Honda should stop giving helpful advice to Honda. You certainly won't sway many consumers on the websites as most don't come to the web for advice. If you purchased a big ute or a big bore sport, you have to accept the fact you are in a niche market that Honda doesn't compete in. It really is that simple. You can sit around all day and make comparison but the comparisons aren't any more valid that me comparing a 400ex to a UTE and trying to explain why it is better.

I can understand a die-hard Honda fan as being upset for Honda not entering this market but it shouldn't bother everyone else who has the choice of picking another manufacturer. It is only those that have "red" running in their veins that are impacted by not being able to buy what they want.

/Jon

 

You are right, sometimes less is more but, Honda is missing out on a market that Yamaha seems to be the only one involved in. Big bore sport quads are popular right now. Raptors are not loved by all but, they do sell remarkably well. If Honda ever made a big bore quad with reverse, I would be doing myself a diservice if I did not give it a good hard look. I am a big heavy guy who is too lazy to get off my quad in in the woods to back it out of somewhere. I am not saying my Raptor is better or even faster than a 450r. I am just saying it is better for me. I am sure Honda, with their record of bulletproof reliability, would sell gobs of them. I hope they do. Competition in the marketplace makes all of the manufacturers work harder.

Thanks.

 

I sold Honda ATVs for about 18 months back around 2002,and most of the folks that bought a Honda ATV were usually brand loyal folks because of a past experience with some sort of a Honda that might date back to 80s or so..The remaining customers bought a Honda because the ATV said -------HONDA------ somewhere on it and they were familier with the brand name. These are generally the type of folks that Honda ATVs appeal to,the FIRST TIME buyer that dont know any better or does not care what else is offered in the ATV market,or their LOYAL fans that dont want to hear anything EXCEPT HONDA...I fully understand this trend,BUT,there's something else thats happening too as the years pass us by..

ATV sales and use are skyrocketing every yr..As the years go on,we are begining to see a wider use of ATVs and CLUBs on trails across the country.What is stiffling here is that those trail riders that use to ride red and then buy something else,are not returning to red again..This is how it is in our Michigan based ATV club anyways..And it all goes back to Honda not addressing the wants and needs of these types of riders..Sooner or later,IMO,Honda will have to address these riders,cause there's more/more of us every year..