450r vs. Banshee
#11
12-11-2006, 12:34 PM
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Honda, accept nothing less!
Honda, accept nothing less!
450r vs. Banshee
Rode yesterday at Glamis. Our group was composed of 450R's and "old school" guys on their "sand" Banshees. My feeling is that it all comes down to SUSPENSION! All the drag race places are completely whooped out. Whoever can take the whoops at the bottom of the hill at the greatest speed is going to get the best start, and probably be the first to the top of the hill.
Personally, I don't think the ancient Banshee was very well designed to start with, so it is the hardest machine on which to improve the suspension. On the other hand, on the steep hills I had trouble keeping the front end down on my 450 (stock swingarm), so I was constantly having to hold back on the power.
Personally, I don't think the ancient Banshee was very well designed to start with, so it is the hardest machine on which to improve the suspension. On the other hand, on the steep hills I had trouble keeping the front end down on my 450 (stock swingarm), so I was constantly having to hold back on the power.
#12
12-11-2006, 08:45 PM
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450r vs. Banshee
i think it depends on the rider skill, the port job,pipe, carb, and dome size on the banshee. a bad port job can be worse than having stock cyl./ head. then you go to suspension and tires. tires make a big difference. heck you look around at the banshee world and it seems the biggest motor a guy needs is a 4mil.........its all about set up and rider. ....but in your case i would prolly have to say the honda....no im not biased, i just traded my ds for the one i have.
#13
12-11-2006, 09:22 PM
450r vs. Banshee
i beat a banshee on a piped and mildly moded 400ex one time. it was a nice looking banshee i dont know what was done to it but it was new looking. the 400 i was on was a few months old.
it was not a up hill it was flat and very very rough. we did a rolling start and i just nailed it .the 400 had sand skate 2's i dont remember what the banshe had.
i thought the shee would win. it is not like i smoked him though but i was ahead.
thats one of the cool things about drag racing there is allot to it.some times horse power isn't everything.
i bet the shee would of won on a paved road.
it was not a up hill it was flat and very very rough. we did a rolling start and i just nailed it .the 400 had sand skate 2's i dont remember what the banshe had.
i thought the shee would win. it is not like i smoked him though but i was ahead.
thats one of the cool things about drag racing there is allot to it.some times horse power isn't everything.
i bet the shee would of won on a paved road.
#14
12-12-2006, 02:06 AM
450r vs. Banshee
Originally posted by: carlw
i beat a banshee on a piped and mildly moded 400ex one time. it was a nice looking banshee i dont know what was done to it but it was new looking. the 400 i was on was a few months old.
it was not a up hill it was flat and very very rough. we did a rolling start and i just nailed it .the 400 had sand skate 2's i dont remember what the banshe had.
i thought the shee would win. it is not like i smoked him though but i was ahead.
thats one of the cool things about drag racing there is allot to it.some times horse power isn't everything.
i bet the shee would of won on a paved road.
i beat a banshee on a piped and mildly moded 400ex one time. it was a nice looking banshee i dont know what was done to it but it was new looking. the 400 i was on was a few months old.
it was not a up hill it was flat and very very rough. we did a rolling start and i just nailed it .the 400 had sand skate 2's i dont remember what the banshe had.
i thought the shee would win. it is not like i smoked him though but i was ahead.
thats one of the cool things about drag racing there is allot to it.some times horse power isn't everything.
i bet the shee would of won on a paved road.
Most of the time though, horsepower does win in a drag. It mainly depends on the power:weight ratio (weight includes the rider). Rider skill has some influence too.
It could be possible that the Banshee was geared down (a lot) from stock. Whoever rode that 'Shee was probably interested in keeping it in the powerband at all times so they geared it down to accelerate harder and to avoid feathering the clutch at times and to be able to pull the revvs up as fast as possible.
#15
12-12-2006, 02:49 AM
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450r vs. Banshee
2 strokes rely on all hp, thats why they have powerbands and powervalves. they dont make as much torque where as a lower hp 4 stroke rely's on torque to get the bike moving and torque is the force that drives you. thats why they can keep up. a 4 stroke with just a few ft. lbs of torque under the hp should run with a little higher hp 2 stroke.
#16
12-12-2006, 12:48 PM
450r vs. Banshee
Originally posted by: BBR650
2 strokes rely on all hp, thats why they have powerbands and powervalves. they dont make as much torque where as a lower hp 4 stroke rely's on torque to get the bike moving and torque is the force that drives you. thats why they can keep up. a 4 stroke with just a few ft. lbs of torque under the hp should run with a little higher hp 2 stroke.
2 strokes rely on all hp, thats why they have powerbands and powervalves. they dont make as much torque where as a lower hp 4 stroke rely's on torque to get the bike moving and torque is the force that drives you. thats why they can keep up. a 4 stroke with just a few ft. lbs of torque under the hp should run with a little higher hp 2 stroke.
#17
12-13-2006, 01:12 AM
450r vs. Banshee
Originally posted by: BBR650
2 strokes rely on all hp, thats why they have powerbands and powervalves. they dont make as much torque where as a lower hp 4 stroke rely's on torque to get the bike moving and torque is the force that drives you. thats why they can keep up. a 4 stroke with just a few ft. lbs of torque under the hp should run with a little higher hp 2 stroke.
2 strokes rely on all hp, thats why they have powerbands and powervalves. they dont make as much torque where as a lower hp 4 stroke rely's on torque to get the bike moving and torque is the force that drives you. thats why they can keep up. a 4 stroke with just a few ft. lbs of torque under the hp should run with a little higher hp 2 stroke.
Sorry man, but someone had to do it.
#18
12-13-2006, 01:38 AM
450r vs. Banshee
Originally posted by: TwinCam95
What is this Powerband, and where can I buy one for my 400ex?
Sorry man, but someone had to do it.
Originally posted by: BBR650
2 strokes rely on all hp, thats why they have powerbands and powervalves. they dont make as much torque where as a lower hp 4 stroke rely's on torque to get the bike moving and torque is the force that drives you. thats why they can keep up. a 4 stroke with just a few ft. lbs of torque under the hp should run with a little higher hp 2 stroke.
2 strokes rely on all hp, thats why they have powerbands and powervalves. they dont make as much torque where as a lower hp 4 stroke rely's on torque to get the bike moving and torque is the force that drives you. thats why they can keep up. a 4 stroke with just a few ft. lbs of torque under the hp should run with a little higher hp 2 stroke.
Sorry man, but someone had to do it.
I thought you were serious at first haha
#19
12-17-2006, 05:47 AM
450r vs. Banshee
Hands down the 450r will win... I have raced all kinds of those banshees, the only ones that beat me have +4 everything and are totally polished out, so basically the best of the best.... I have a 450r with full exhaust cam piston K&N Rev Box, ported heads, +1 tooth up front.... I walk all over those banshees, there have been a few that started to gain once I topped out because they have slightly higher top speed but I am soo far ahead its no race.... there's no replacement for displacement. I raced a 410 Banshee with twin carb kit ported and some other stuff and was fast but not fast enough haha
#20
12-17-2006, 09:19 PM
450r vs. Banshee
Originally posted by: zettler450r
Hands down the 450r will win... I have raced all kinds of those banshees, the only ones that beat me have +4 everything and are totally polished out, so basically the best of the best.... I have a 450r with full exhaust cam piston K&N Rev Box, ported heads, +1 tooth up front.... I walk all over those banshees, there have been a few that started to gain once I topped out because they have slightly higher top speed but I am soo far ahead its no race.... there's no replacement for displacement. I raced a 410 Banshee with twin carb kit ported and some other stuff and was fast but not fast enough haha
Hands down the 450r will win... I have raced all kinds of those banshees, the only ones that beat me have +4 everything and are totally polished out, so basically the best of the best.... I have a 450r with full exhaust cam piston K&N Rev Box, ported heads, +1 tooth up front.... I walk all over those banshees, there have been a few that started to gain once I topped out because they have slightly higher top speed but I am soo far ahead its no race.... there's no replacement for displacement. I raced a 410 Banshee with twin carb kit ported and some other stuff and was fast but not fast enough haha
True, there is no replacement for displacement. However, you cannot use that statement when comparing a 2-stroke with a 4-stroke. Obviously your 450 is SICK, but a stock 450r and a stock Banshee head to head, the Banshee will beat it on take off and top end. I have never seen a race like that but in theory, that's how it will work. The Banshee is a 350 2-stroke, meaning it makes 350cc worth of power in 2 strokes while the 450r makes 450cc worth of power in 4 strokes. However, 2-strokes are not as efficient so just because there is a power stroke every two turns rather than four doesn't mean that it makes two times amount of power.
Does anyone know of a relationshiop between 2 stroke and 4-stroke engine size?