biggy- you said to get the honda to 50hp and upgrade the suspension and i'm set. but it would seem easier to get the raptor to 50hp. trinity advertises their pipe gives you 50hp. this may or may not be true, but they are a big name reputable (sp) shop and it would look really bad if they didn't do this.

i know the raptor has tranny problems but fortin makes a replacement 2nd,3rd, and 5th gear, plus a new shifting fork - so the fix is out there but i don't know where to get these. i see the the loboII is available in the xc version. if i go with either quad i'm looking at new a- arms anf shocks so i guess maybe the raptor is worth looking at. i see you have a raptor and the 440ex. do you favor the 440 because it is set up for xc? i'm not arguing with you just looking for answers.

the quad i buy (now seems like next year sometime..) will also be a rec. quad. reverse may be kinda nice. i don't know im just thinking out loud. i must confess i've only looked at the lrd 440 kit and not anything else as far as the yammy goes.

 

If its gonna be a recreational quad at all, I would definitely get the raptor. especially since your used to that banshee powerband.

I'm not sure about that biggy, I dont see how a 440ex, with a new front end, new shocks, and a good amount of motor work has less mods than would be required on a raptor

I wouldnt worry about the tranny problems too much. 2nd and 3rd are new on the 2002.

 

second and third may be new but are they better? biggy said 50hp with the honda that may be enough for the 250 class but with the raptor i have to run open class - is 50 hp enough in open? don't get me wrong i can hold my own when it comes to rider ability. i've been riding the woods in michigan since i was 9 and im now 24. my family has about 800 acres most of it is tree farm but some (the 120 i stay on) is a mix of hilly hardwood and swamp.
i must confess im partial to yamahas. to say they are junk is not true and just unintelligent banter.
i'm wondering... i will have to do alot of motor work to get the honda to 50 hp. i learned the hard way that the more you mod the less the reliability-(in the long run). but if i only have to add 13hp to the raptor instead of 23hp to the honda then in an endurance race- which is what gncc or xc is - maybe the raptor is best.
by no means is my mind made up im just trying to stir the pot up a bit. i would like to hear only mature comments in this discussion. it does get old reading personal attacks and unprovable comments like "raptors suck cuz i smoke all of them on my blaster,trx 90, go-kart". that type of stuff just proves you are 12 yrs old and when you learn to reinforce your point of view instead of yelling on the computer you will be taken seriously. you may also get some help when you need it from people who do know. no flame intended
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Raptor, hands down. If you want power right out of the box it is there. If you want to race you can and if it is mostly a quad for having fun on then the extra stock power will suit you well. How much racing / play riding do you plan on doing? 10% race / 90% play? If thats the case dont get a high strung high compresiuon fuel guzzling modified 440, get a near stock 660 with reverse and stock reliability to boot. The Honda is a cool machine its just not in the same class of machine as the raptor (by class I dont mean its not as good, I mean in terms of engine displacement, weight, and hp).

 

i would say my riding will be 60% play and 40% race. but when we play it always seems to turn into - follow the leader in the woods in 5th gear. lol
it seems that LRD is the place to go for the 400ex/440ex but where would i go for the raptor? if i go with the 400 then i know the 440 kit is next but with the raptor i was thinking of just porting the head and an exhaust. i looked at Curtis Sparks 690 kit but i would like some info on other possible places.
who out there runs the loboII in the xc trim? if you could give me some feedback then it would help me budget. due to some recent cashflow problems my purchase would be next year but i want to do as much research as poss. 'till then.
this is the set up as i see it now :

400ex:complete LRD 440 kit, steering stabilizer, nerfs, holeshots on b-locks, loboII xc front end and custom axis rear shock. ims large capacity fuel tank, hinson clutch, maybe magura hyd. clutch.

Raptor: exhaust(who?), port head(who?), loboII xc front end and custom axis rear shock, fortin gears(depending on if Yam. fixed this), steering stabilizer, nerfs, ims large capacity fuel tank, holeshots on b-locks, hinson clutch, maybe magura hyd. clutch, or maybe the curtis sparks 690 kit?

i don't know... i have a long time to figure it all out but i want to do it right. thats why i'll be picking everyones brain here for the next several months.
i think it's more fun to play on a race machine than to try and race a play machine.

 

I guess in your situation you could get either machine. You will just have to spend more on motor with the Honda and more on the suspension with the Raptor. I like the idea of a liquid cooled Raptor as a starting point but for mostly racing you cant really go wrong with a built up honda. Good luck, Visit the Yami board for more info on modifying a Raptor. I am very recently converted to a raptor from a White Brothers 250X so I am still learning the Raptor stuff as well.

 

Warrior007 u may think ur doin this guy a favor by bashin the 400ex and throwin what i said up in my face man. The truth is this: i made a mistake in the ponies spot and i was right about the handling being terrible and the engine being under powerd on the raptor and you cant stand to see your precious machine totally destroyed and picked apart like that!

I'm outta this thread man!

Ride on upracer!

Urban Cowboy

 

see ya Urban

Dont get me wrong upracer I think they are both great machines and havent bashed the 400ex. It seemed one of your concerns was with power and having to mod the engine right away on the 400ex. as urban so elegantly pointed out the raptor was WAY underpowered. I was just making my point as well.

your best bet is to ride them both!

 

If you want to build a xc raptor go ahead . you can do it . it will be fine . first here is my input . the raptor's I've seen have over heated in muddy tracks. clutches will fry also .. so those problems need to be addesed . my preferance is the honda . why? the honda is smooth. Even with numbers in the 50hp range . the raptor is tweeky (takes more input to drive)
Here is another thought Dont buy a new quad ! buy a old beat up 99 400ex and strip it down start from there . Ive seen them in the paper for $3,000 that will give you a 2g plus to start with . then sell the stock stuff on e-bay you will have a good starting point.

the biggest worry in xc racing is not finishing . if you want to finish you need a machine that will have the least amount of failures and or troubles . right ? go with the old saying (keep it simple stupid) the ex is simple and it works !

the 250r's are very fast also but all of the riders of them will tell you its a gamble to know if it will make the race. gas is a issue also. the 2 hour races are hard to make even with the big tanks .

 

ok mnwildfan here we go

your right the raptor is not in the same class .
1. mine will go farther then a stockraptor on a tank of gas (ex has a smaller tank to )
2. you live close to me and I have a xc track you can come race me if you want !
3. bring a signed wavier because of the 70ft @ 50ft jumpes and the 5th gear straight that has trees railed on both sides with no more than 6 inches to fumble .

4. you say high strung ....not even close to being high strung . I only run 10.5 to 1 comprestion and a stock carb ...I can run 92 gas all day long ....

5. we are building a jump across the streem . it will be intense to say the least . It will be from bank to bank 65ft from bottom to top of the bank is 11ft deep. after the ramps are done it will be in the 70ft range. Im not sure I will have the guts to be the first to jump it . the banks are steep and there is no turning back if you come up short .you can come down and be the first if you want ?