I don't know if I would say they don't care at all about racing. They haven't had to the 250r first and later the modified 400ex's dominated for a long time. They were winning races without putting any effort into it. Now with the Cannondales the Z400 and it's clone and a couple of other quads on the way from Gas Gas, Bombardier and possibly Yamaha the dominance they didn't have to work for is gone. So now they have to work for it but when has honda ever been on any time frame but there own. I think sooner or later they'll come out with something and it would make sense for Honda to compete with the bigger bores with less cc's, lighter weight and better handling after all that's kind of their trade mark.

I however am not getting any younger and have no intention of waiting for honda to get around to my needs. If they get the new quad out and it rips when I'm ready to be cool. If not I'll be hangin' with YoDaddy in C-Dale land. Every time I ride SparkyEX's Dale it's a freakin' rush. That quad pulls like a raped ape in every gear all the way to the rev limiter. I took it around the flat track a couple time's last night and all I can say is YYYEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!

 

1 more thing I thought you were MXDale71 now YoDaddy?

 

Honda was suied big time in the past and they are showing no interest in ATV racing in fact the have distanced themselves quite a bit.
Look at the 90cc quad Honda came out and said they knew they would increase the sales if the put electric start but that would mean younger kids could ride it to easy, b/c if you are not big enough to pull it you should not ride it.They are so afrade of lawyers they keep making it with pull start even though they loose sales.
I will lay money on this, You will not see a sponsered honda ATV race team and you will not see and answer to the 450 type race bike.

 

Who said anything about a sponsored race team??? What company other than Cannondale is currently sponsoring a race team? (Cannondale is doing it out of pure necessity, to help break into the marketplace)

Honda can bring out whatever quad they want without being concerned about racing or sponsoring a race team. If they do release a new sport quad, which they will at some point in the future, it will not be for staying competitive in racing, it will be for staying competitive in the marketplace.

Everyone thought that the Raptor would challenge the 400EX in sales, it did not. Now the attack of the clones (LTZ400 and it's variants) may actually put a dent in sales and that's what's going to get big red's attention.

It's become clear that the 400 class is where the bulk of the interest lies. This is why I am now leaning more toward Honda eventually releasing a CRF450 variant instead of a XR650 based machine. Not only the race crowd but a large percentage of the "sport/recreational" crowd likes the 400 class size.

Honda is interested in building the quad that will sell the most units, period.

It's true that they are leery of lawsuits because of the mid 80's, they have the most to lose since they are the largest & as such, are the biggest target - however, keep in mind that they were also the ones that ended the sport quad drought of the 90's.

You can rest assured that they will not sponsor a race team - heck they don't even do much in the way of contengencies for the dirtbike crowd (they don't have to & they still outsell all the others), they're sure as heck not going to do anything for us.

 

KAW has had a GNCC race team for a while SUZ has also hade a race team.

 

I don't see why Honda would still be leary of lawsuits when all the other manufacturers came out with high performance quads first. It's not like Honda is leading the way this time around they're after the fact.

 

daimon - note the word "Had" - their "team" consisted of one racer on a one off custom machine that was not even built by Kawasaki and was never intended to make it to make it to production, hardly a real race program... I can't remember the last time Suzuki had a "race team".

Honda still has to be careful, they are still the largest and have the most to lose. Let's say you're someone who's looking to sue ATV manufacturers. You're more than likely going to follow the money and name the largest manufacturers in your suit. That's why Honda took the bulk of the damage in the 80's. Honda's been burned once, it's only smart for them to be cautious.

You guys are arguing moot points. Honda will not be involved in racing. Yes, Honda is leery of lawsuits, as all manufacturers are to some point - if they were not, we would see a lot more Cannondale type machines out there.

If Honda does bring out a CRF450 or XR650 based quad, you can rest assured that it will be targeted at the masses, it will be detuned, and it will not be targeted directly at racing. It will, however, be a good basis to start from to build a race machine.

As much as everyone forgets, the 250R was *not* a "race" machine out of the box either - it was a fun recreational rider with tons of potential. If you had a 100% stock 1989 250R today, it would be competitive with a 400EX on the trail, the track, and at the drags.

 

1986atc250r,

You make good points, your logic is good. The only weak point I see is the topic of this subject - The CRF450. I am not sure if honda will go for the big displacment (600+cc) or the 400 class. Either way they go, I still believe it will be based on the 650 motor. A good example is KTM. KKTM makes a 250, 400 and 520cc four stroke. All of the engines are the same. The last one to come out was the 250cc four stroke. The 250 was no more than a sleeved 520. I think we are easily as smart as the guys at Honda amking the calls. They may may be closer to the technology but we are closer to the customer.

If I was at Honda amking a choice for 400 or 650cc quad, I would use the XR650 motor and sleeve it to a 400. This would fit perfect with the "detune" approach of the Japanese manufacturers. If I were bold, I might even release a line of quads with heavily leveraged motors and frames. This would be a 450EX and 650EX both based on the XR650 motor. Either way, targeting the masses with a quality reliable quad would force me look close at using the 650 as a baseline.

It is an interesting discussion.....

 

<< 1 more thing I thought you were MXDale71 now YoDaddy? >>



I switch back and forth every now and then just to check my PM's under my other name.

86atc - I believe Suzuki had a factory sponsored rider when they released the LT250. It was pretty muchly a one season deal just to get their quad out to the public. That was when ATV Racing did make a few appearences on TV. I thought that Kawi sponsored that guy on the Prairie? I might be wrong though.

All of yall are makin some really good points, I don't really know what else to say.

 

Actually if you want to go back, Honda had sponsored team riders back in the 3wheeler days....

GNCC ATV racing is currently on TV.