john,

i may be working myself out of a job, but i am helping people while i'm doing it. i think that it's a shame that so many things have $ signs attached to them. if we would help each other more often th world would be a better place. our store may still be in business because we often turn the other cheek and help people regardless of where they bought their parts, therefore winning them over as new customers.

loose the focus on money and focus on people, we will all benifit. i dont see mr. atvbbs getting upset when we mention other sites and refer others to these sites. ya know, i think it is a free site also......go figure

I guess we'll just have to AGREE to DISAGREE. See ya on the trails.
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Shane

'97 Honda 300 4X - Vamped, Locked, & Lifted



[This message has been edited by Shane West (edited 01-06-2000).]

 

Tree,
I exchanged about 15 e-mails with Jeff. Some of them were questions about his products and some were stories about where I had ridden and asking where he rides.

Everyone,
Jeff e-mailed me back today and said he would have to ask mike about negotiating the price. He says that the reason RMATV is soo much lower is that they sale only to consumers not to dealers. Highlifter slaes to dealers and therefore has to set there prices above what they sale to dealers for. He hasnt e-mailed me with a price yet, but said he would soon. So RMATV has screwed some people with service??? Reply soon, all answers welcomed!!

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Matt Sibley

1999 Honda 300 4x4 Vampires, Lift Kit, 2500lb WARN winch

 

Well Jeff e-mailed me. He read what I put in here and talked to me directly. I think this is what the manufactures do. Well here is his e-mail:
Boner,
In response to your post on ATVing, I do care. It's just that I get over 40 e-mails everyday now. Substantially more than I used to. I must answer every one in detail and when I get one that is not in my department I simply reply to the author and let them know who they need to be e-mailing. I sorry if you felt like I was just blowing you off. You ought to know better than that man!!!! :-)
Keep Slingin that Mud,
Jeff

Now this is how all companys should respond to you. He remebers me from previous talks. He know that I like to mud ride. And most of all he apologizes for my mistake. I think Highlifter will be in selling us parts and modifications for many years to come.

 

OK, OK. Shane if you want to help folks who aren't your customers that is fine. I'm sure your employer likes for you to do that, while not being able to provide other services for the paying customers. The $ signs that are attached to services and tangible items is called free enterprise, and I'm sure you would be the first person to bark when you didn't get paid. I'm willing to believe that you would like to get paid more $$, but are willing to work for less cause you are just a good guy. When attaching a $ to things I don't do it to make money I do it to put a value for what I do. A $ is simply a measurement, like a mile is a measurement for a distance, and it's obvious that you and most folks in here do or this forum would not have been created, cause it looks like Matt went somewhere else to save some of that $$$.

If you want to do it your way, then more power to you. I've been to the discount warehouses, and to Rocky Mountian, and I've been burnt. I even bought a computer for $200 less from a discount other than gateway. The first month I spent $100.00 for tech support without an (800) number and shipping my system to and from to be worked on. I'm willing to bet any of you that gateway would have saved me that money with thier (800) line and they would have picked up my computer for free and shipped me air frieght within 2 days. That is service that I would pay for.

Shane: if you were with Rocky Mountian or High Lifter I bet atv connection would not let you advertise in here for free. They do not run a free website. They do not do this site just for fun in thier spare time. They are business folks trying to make a profit. Your system of free may work in China, but it has never worked here in the USA. If you like to help folks, that's great, but you can't keep giving something for nothing. You obviously have never owned a business. If I were your employer and found out that you were doing that at the frequency that you claim, you would be umemployed.

 

Matt, before considering Rocky Mountain ATV please consider my experience with them.

I too was taken back by thier really low prices while searching for a new set of tires.
When I ordered my tire I was told 4-8 days and the tires would be on my front steps. Nearly 1 month and numerous calls later, I finally obtained my tires by driving 50 miles to the nearest RPS shipping terminal and picking them up myself.
I doubt they will ever earn my business again. I would also advise anyone else to avoid them, low prices or not.


[This message has been edited by Eric Zeh (edited 01-08-2000).]

 

Every point of view expressed on this topic appears interesting, each with its own measure of merit.

As I understand the situation, High-Lifter assembled a kit of components, integrated them, and developed application instructions for installation, adjustment, and use of the set. High-Lifter sells the kit, providing "one-stop" shopping, full warranty, and technical support to its customers.

In this instance, I understand a prospective client, after exchanging an acknowledged fifteen E-mails with substantive questions about this specific kit, buys the individual components in the kit from another source and is frustrated because High-Lifter is unwilling to provide technical support to the purchase from other vendors, likewise refusing to provide the proprietary instructions and specifications developed by High-Lifter.

Interesting. How do the President, Chairman of the Board, Members of the Board of Directors, and stockholders of High-Lifter feel about one of their employees spending his time and energy on salary, answering fifteen E-mail messages containing substantive questions, arming a potential client to buy products elsewhere?

Unless High-Lifter embraces as a corporate goal, winning the "Mother Theresa Memorial Technical Support and Parts Counterman Good-Guy Award," they might ask; "What's wrong with this picture?"

I have been the beneficiary of parts-counter advice; yes, even regarding parts purchased elsewhere. Appreciating this consideration, I reward and subsidize this support by subsequent purchases, even at my friendly local authorized dealership, where they kite list prices on all their parts (especially the small ones), buying as a minimum oil filters, etc., from them, when I KNOW I can save a buck by mail order . . . Maybe I'm a fool, but if a merchant stocks a part when I need it, I don't begrudge him his profit, especially if the sale is backed by service.

Oddly, I find customers outraged at the slightest hint of misrepresentation from a vendor, whether an intentional lie or ambiguous interpretation; yet, some have no qualms about lying to the vendor. Are expectations regarding this one-way street realistic? The vendor must ALWAYS tell the truth, while the customer may lie at will? Or did I read in a book somewhere, "Do unto others . . ."

End of sermon. We shall now collect the offering!

Tree Farmer

 

AMEN!

Well spoken Tree Farmer. I, too, agree with you about the situation at hand. I have purchased several items from Highlifter and have recieved very detailed instructions that I know they spent many hours hammering out. Sure I might have gotten them cheaper somewhere else, but I always know that the instructions are going to be excellent and that technical support is only a phone call away. The way I see it is that the guys down at Highlifter have been a major motivating factor in the development of 4x4 accessories. With out these guys we might not have mass produced lift kits (We would still be hoping our back yard creations held up!) or other things like the front end lockers. We may not even have things like the 27" and 28" Vampires. I know that Highlifter works very closely with the guys at Interco when it comes to ATV tires. Why wouldn't they? They're practically neighbors.

So, I guess my underlying statement here is that if they (Highlifter) don't make enough money to stay open and make it seem profitable and worth their while to spend time and money developing new products, then they might as well close their doors to us (the public) and keep all of their secrets to themselves. Do you want that? I sure as heck don't!!! I love four wheeling! Especially in the mud, and that seems to be their specialty. So if you want quality products and people to stand behind them then go ahead and pay a few more bucks because the extra bucks are going for an experienced staff to back the product up.

"LOCK 'EM AND LEAVE 'EM!!!"
SwampMonster

1999 Foreman 450S Locked, Lifted, Vamped, Snorkeled, and did I mention widened? (wheel spacers)

 

I too have dealt with Jeff from HL. Very helpful, etc etc etc. I think the Dynojet kit though, is a COMPLETE waste of money. Who needs jets that are smaller than the stock one already in my machine? I realize thats not Jeff's fault at all. We've been going back and forth trying to determine the best way to debug the jetting problem with my 99 Foreman. Tomorrow, I take his advice, drop in the brand new spark plug, warm it gently, run it to redline in ALL 5 gears and swtich the key off while coasting to a stop, pull the plug and check for ANY blackness on the electrode or ground ring. If there's black, it's too rich. He suspects that very problem with mine, although it's running a heck of alot more stout in the midrange which is oddly enough, exactly where I needed the performance boost.

I'm thoroughly pleased with Jeff's responses, and his attention to ME, the customer. I can and have taken my business elsewhere in the past. I'm not afraid to do it. After all, someone did say it's OUR $$, right?


Joe

 

I did exchange around 15 e-mails but not all 15 were about the kit!!! I understand where you guys are coming from. I'm still waiting for jeffs reply about the nogiating price. He said he would ask his boss about it and let me know. I still havent heard, but I'm in no hurry because I still have to save a little more money before I buy. Shane, I'm glad there are still some nice, willing to help, people in this world!!!

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Matt Sibley

1999 Honda 300 4x4 Vampires, Lift Kit, 2500lb WARN winch