Differential Locked
#1
Differential Locked
I have a 2004 Twin Peaks (700 Prarie clone). Saturday, my father and I went riding in some pretty muddy terrain. We were horsing it through the mud and had to use the differential lock to make it through. My dad then complained the steering was real stiff. Upon getting it home, I discovered the differential lock seems to be permenantly engaged.
I put it up on blocks and made sure the 4-wheel drive was engaging and disengaging and it was without a flaw. I had the dealer change the differential fluid last year and have only put about 5 miles on it. The machine only have 250 miles total. I have never had a problem.
I was thinking the cable could be jammed. Is it possible to engage the differential lock without the 4-wheel drive engaged or is it jammed from when it was in 4-wheel drive. I thought I would ask some questions before I tore all the plastic off to check closer. Pulling the cable, the small arm moves, but it doesn't seem like it moves far and then returns.
Any suggestions?
I put it up on blocks and made sure the 4-wheel drive was engaging and disengaging and it was without a flaw. I had the dealer change the differential fluid last year and have only put about 5 miles on it. The machine only have 250 miles total. I have never had a problem.
I was thinking the cable could be jammed. Is it possible to engage the differential lock without the 4-wheel drive engaged or is it jammed from when it was in 4-wheel drive. I thought I would ask some questions before I tore all the plastic off to check closer. Pulling the cable, the small arm moves, but it doesn't seem like it moves far and then returns.
Any suggestions?
#2
Differential Locked
On my AC, if im not in 4x4, and i engage the diff lock, it does engage. Sometimes ive heard when in diff lock, if it sticks, put it in gear, fluctuate the throttle and turn the wheels back and forth. Ive seen this work before. Otherwise, i would take it in to the dealer
#3
Differential Locked
It sounds like your spider gear/shaft are seized causing no differentiation of left/right wheels (stiff steering) due to any of following reasons:
> Water got in there when muddying.
> Wrong oil in the gear case.
> Lack of oil/lubrication.
Do not ride anymore to prevent further damage. First remove the oil drain screw from the gear case and see what's coming out. If you see shiny metal pieces, that's not good (but this is not the end of the world). You can easily rebuild it once you take out the gear case from the quad. Good luck.
> Water got in there when muddying.
> Wrong oil in the gear case.
> Lack of oil/lubrication.
Do not ride anymore to prevent further damage. First remove the oil drain screw from the gear case and see what's coming out. If you see shiny metal pieces, that's not good (but this is not the end of the world). You can easily rebuild it once you take out the gear case from the quad. Good luck.
#4
Differential Locked
Thanks for the replies. I called the local dealers around here. Some where helpful others just said bring it in. I will check out the cable tonight. The helpful dealers all said they don't see any in for service usually and none for this problem. I'm hoping this is just the cable that is hung up but will drain the fluid anyway. This is actually the only time I have had the differential under water.
Is it unusual for water to get into the differential? If so, are there ways to prevent?
Is it unusual for water to get into the differential? If so, are there ways to prevent?
#5
Differential Locked
Water usually gets inside the diff gear case via 2/4wd actuator motor assy. Older models (I think before '05) have a fitting for the vent tube. If the tube comes off from the fitting, water can go in there. If you submerge your quad up to the handlebar, water will enter also because that's where the vent tube ends. If the actuator's plastic body is cracked or if it is not sealing against the gear case well (there is an o-ring), water will also enter into the gear case.
Front diff gears in Kawi quads will seize if you use typical hypoid gear oil - too thick. Kawi recommends 10W-40 engine oil in their manual. I use 5W-30 synthetic and it's been so far so good.
Front diff gears in Kawi quads will seize if you use typical hypoid gear oil - too thick. Kawi recommends 10W-40 engine oil in their manual. I use 5W-30 synthetic and it's been so far so good.
#6
Differential Locked
Well, its not the cable that would be too cheap. I will drain the diff fluid this evening. Come to think about it, the muddy water was not more than 15" deep but we were churning it up like a fountain under the fenders. If it splashes under the fenders, it may have went in the vent tube.
Will draining the fluid and refilling with fresh and repeating release the differential or will I have to tear it apart?
I'm not the most mechanically inclined, is this an easy procedure?
Will draining the fluid and refilling with fresh and repeating release the differential or will I have to tear it apart?
I'm not the most mechanically inclined, is this an easy procedure?
#7
Differential Locked
If the cable or actuating arm is not what is sticking, it is definately an internal problem. Simply flushing it will most likely not fix it. If the spider gear in fact siezed on the shaft it spins on, you will need to replace it or run the risk of detonating your front diff.
Most people assume the locker is of bad design and become afraid to use it. But the spider gear seizing on the shaft is caused from excessive tire spin without the locker engaged. The locker is the same setup as the rear brakes on the SRA quads. It is just a clutch pack that squeezes together when you pull the locker. It is in fact a very good design. However the tolerances of the spider or planetary gears and the shafts they spin on are a little on the tight side. Making it very important to use the proper weight oil. If you spin alot without the locker engaged, these planetary gears run the risk of starving themselves of proper lubrication when you do alot of "3-wheelin".
Another possibility is underfilling the oil. You have to rotate the front tires when you change the front diff oil. This allows the oil to flow into the carrier. It is very easy to underfill these diffs otherwise. Mine was underfilled from the dealer. Keep track of how much you put in it & compare it to what the owners manual calls for.
I can't say it enough. Using the locker when spinning is cheap insurance.
Most people assume the locker is of bad design and become afraid to use it. But the spider gear seizing on the shaft is caused from excessive tire spin without the locker engaged. The locker is the same setup as the rear brakes on the SRA quads. It is just a clutch pack that squeezes together when you pull the locker. It is in fact a very good design. However the tolerances of the spider or planetary gears and the shafts they spin on are a little on the tight side. Making it very important to use the proper weight oil. If you spin alot without the locker engaged, these planetary gears run the risk of starving themselves of proper lubrication when you do alot of "3-wheelin".
Another possibility is underfilling the oil. You have to rotate the front tires when you change the front diff oil. This allows the oil to flow into the carrier. It is very easy to underfill these diffs otherwise. Mine was underfilled from the dealer. Keep track of how much you put in it & compare it to what the owners manual calls for.
I can't say it enough. Using the locker when spinning is cheap insurance.
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#8
Differential Locked
First, drain the diff gear oil and carefully inspect for any shiny metal debris or pieces. Do this before you do anything else.
Water would not or can not go into the vent tube at the handlebar. Water can go into the open fitting of the actuator ONLY if the tube was somehow disconnected (happened to me). It is quite possible that the gears/shaft just seized due to the lubrication problem. To me removing the gear case out of the quad is more work than disassemblying the gear case itself which is no real big deal, just lots of bolts and nuts.
Water would not or can not go into the vent tube at the handlebar. Water can go into the open fitting of the actuator ONLY if the tube was somehow disconnected (happened to me). It is quite possible that the gears/shaft just seized due to the lubrication problem. To me removing the gear case out of the quad is more work than disassemblying the gear case itself which is no real big deal, just lots of bolts and nuts.
#9
Differential Locked
I drained the oil and it looked like hot chocolate. I took it to a local shop that I really like and he said it was water contamination. This has sat for most of the summer in a shed nice and dry. This is also the first time I have got it in any deeper water since owning it.
The dealer said they would try filling it with fluid and trying to get it to loosen up without tearing apart as they have had some success with this procedure. If not, I'll let them tear into it. I wasn't up to the challenge.
It is interesting that none of the dealers have had a problem with the front differential. They always asked it the four wheel drive was working. That seems to be a much bigger problem.
The dealer said they would try filling it with fluid and trying to get it to loosen up without tearing apart as they have had some success with this procedure. If not, I'll let them tear into it. I wasn't up to the challenge.
It is interesting that none of the dealers have had a problem with the front differential. They always asked it the four wheel drive was working. That seems to be a much bigger problem.
#10
Differential Locked
I called the independent shop that is working on the differential and he said the inside is ugly. He is going to give me the full report today but what he could see the spider gears and clutch pack were all in perfect condition. He said it looked like all the internal mounting was all cracked.
He said he looked like a defect from the manufacturer. If that is indeed true, what are my chances of getting Suzuki/Kawasaki to reimburse? The machine has less than 300 miles on it.
He said he looked like a defect from the manufacturer. If that is indeed true, what are my chances of getting Suzuki/Kawasaki to reimburse? The machine has less than 300 miles on it.