So, what keeps you from seizing an opportunity now? We have the freedom to pick and choose what we want to do with life and vocation as things stand now. No one is stopping you. What someone does with what they are given doesn't depend as much on their life circumstances as it does their attitude or drive. Even the most rudimentary education teaches people how to read, write, and perform basic math.

 

With Communism it's a guarantee. I'd take a guarantee before a chance.


I guess this is winding down, but I enjoyed this. Thanks everyone. Hope we can all walk away with another point of view.

 

Nope. I hate to say this but, I tend to take advice from people who are successful in whatever endeavor they are on. You have fine sounding arguments but I've seen life with its inherit ups and downs. I've watched the world and how things are run on large and small scales. In other words fine sounding words come in second place to actual life experience. This quote is attributed to Winston Churchill; "If you're not liberal when you're young you have no heart. If you're not conservative when you are old you have no mind." I'm not saying you have no mind. You are intelligent and put your point across pretty well. But, you haven't adopted a kid in foster care whose parents are on welfare taking drugs, or the mother who keeps popping out babies so she can keep getting checks from the government. The immorality of these situations tells me there are givers and takers. Takers will be a drain while givers will be what they are. To create the kinds of opportunities you're talking about would be a massive undertaking that assumes everybody will do their part. Well, everyone doesn't do their part. That, and who is going to distribute the "fairness". Without a moral code you have Attorney Generals who go after big oil after an accident while they refuse to prosecute Black Panther members filmed with clubs intimidating white voters. Your whole model doesn't take into account some very basic things that you may have learned or may not have. There is good and evil in this world. The evil doers will not do their part to make this homogeneous Utopia you're dreaming of and the good will be drained of their resources. We have a 14 trillion dollar debt largely because government is trying to "level the playing field" and redistribute the wealth from the doers to the takers. When you keep confiscating hard earned wealth sooner or later the wealthy will say, "I'm not going to try so hard just to see most of it taken away." Your whole system requires massive amounts of bureaucracy to bring it all together (which won't work because not everyone will want your system) and bureaucracy is very expensive. I hope you learn all these things the easy way and not the hard way. I typically don't take too much advice on life from 18 year olds because I know what I was like at that age, 3 decades ago.

Try your system on your own family but please leave alone the system that has outlasted every attempt to bring it down thus-far.

 

There so many programs,grants, free doctor's care,free meals, scholarships,etc available for the "poor children" that is getting beyond the word ridiculous! Even in my grand daughter's kinder garden class there is a program for "certain" children after school that includes child care for the kids when their parents have to pick them up later,special English tutoring classes,etc! And teachers are forbidden to ask about a childs immigration status!! I emphatically call this REVERSE discrimination because my grand daughter is NOT considered eligible for ANY of this,even after school care!!! If these "under privileged" children fail to reach their dreams it's because they don't care,NOT because of MISSED OPPORTUNITIES that are handed to them !! Look at California and the FREE university education offered to illegal immigrants! Granted the term "give me your tired,your poor,your huddle masses yearning to breathe free" is wearing a little thin with me and a lot of others that have to pay for this!! Guess I lied when I said I would shut up!! OPT

 

I`m with OPT on this and I agree 100%.I too am getting wore thin on all the gimmee programs.I do not know anywhere in the constitution that says that the kids in America will get FREE rides to basketball games or anyother sporting events.I did`nt vote to have any of My school taxes include events such as this.thats all,rant over.

 

Lolumad, according to you anyone wh works in manufacturing is getting "robbed" by the owner.
Has it ever occured t you that the owner came up with a good idea, on his own.
He/she probably worked 10, 12, even 14 - 16 hour days to make their company a success and in doing so provided jobs (no one was forced to take them) for hundreds or even thousand of people. Through payroll and taxes the owner has injected millions of dollars into not only the local economy but also into the government coffers.
Every single one of employees chose to take a job there even though had they came up with a good idea and worked extremely hard they too could have (still can) become as successful as the owner they work for.
Your idea of a utopian society has never worked and never will, history shows us that.
Even the communal societies of the native americans has a hierarchy of command, from the chief down to the lowest in the tribes.
Anywhere that there are people living together and sharing everything, someone not only will want to be "in charge" but it will be a requirement for the group to function.
You're only 18, you have a lot left to learn as you experience life in the real world.

 

Very good point Red400EXROD!! My boss and I when we started the company(actually his,but since we were related he and I basically worked real cheap at first to try to get the shop off the ground!) First few years were tough starting out in late 1987,we only sold FOUR atvs the first year and relied on service to keep us above water. When the PWC craze hit in 1993 to about 2000 or so when it started slowing down,we were able to get out of a rented shop and built our own and kept expanding when the Ranger and Razrs hit the market, adding on buildings on out lot! He spent many,many nights,and still does at the shop catching up on work. I built up the service department and left it in good qualified hands when I retired! I'm proud of my NEPHEW and what he was able to accomplish! He never spent much time with his father(my BROTHER,since his parents were divorced when he was young) and he told me many times I was more of a father to him than an uncle! This is a good example of the opportunities allowed in this country if you're willing to work hard! I was paid adequately(as well as any shop would have paid me) and never felt exploited! And they still call the old man at least once a week or so when they have a problem wanting my old opinion! Plus I am VERY proud of him for what he was able to accomplish in starting a business in his late 20's!! OPT

 

I'm disappointed that my age has made my case less legitimate... The thinkers that I draw influence from were experienced in the workings of society. These ideas have only been put into language in the last 200 years, and have never been put into practice. History shows us nothing about the practicality of these ideas.

I prefer to believe that people don't need to be told what to do. I believe in self management and autonomy. I can't imagine society collapsing if business owners didn't tell employees what to do. I'm sure that employees know well enough how to manage day to day operations of a business, however they may not be versed in profit making... Which in my eyes is an evil that shouldn't exist.

I can't stress enough how Communism isn't about taking the wealth of the "Doers"...

Because someone is rich doesn't mean they work hard. Hard work really doesn't equal large wealth. I bet Chinese factory workers, who live at their jobs, work excruciatingly long hours, aren't rich.

 

You just made our point for us. Communist country ruled by dictator style government. The higher ups live off the labors of the people they keep under their thumbs. You may not consider China communist in order to make your comments but the rest of the world calls a spade a spade.

 

My 32 year old son have had our political differences,but as I've seen him go from adolescence to adult hood,having a beautiful wife and daughter,a very nice home,a better paying job with better benefits(because he's better educated and smarter technology wise than his old man ,I'm starting to see a gradual maturity change in him and can see how much he's changed since our head butting days when he was about 18 or 19! Like the old saying about a 16 year old son and father that could never communicate. The son left home and when he came back 5 years later and started talking to his father and said in amazement: "Father I just can't get over how much you have learned in 5 short years! OPT