There are 3 different markets: Big bores (600+ cc's), Mid range (400-600 cc's) and the low range (50-400 cc's). Thats what I mean by different markets, they may not go out of their way to advertise to these markets but the price defines them this way.

I agree the Z400 won't have record sales like the 400ex, its just another quad release. You can't keep re-inventing the wheel over and over, you need to start with a base and work on that, and thats what the 400ex was, a base. Now everone is going to one up Honda until they get back in the game. Then everyone will one up that quad, its a crazy and expensive cycle.

I don't think its fair to compare a $8400 z400 to a $9999 Baja DS 650. (canadian prices)

Also the word " High Performance " is another marketing term to replace the words " Sport ATV. "
High Performance to us means something totaly different. Its all marketing. The world is run by lawyer and marketing people.

 

Well, just don't be surprised when you see a Raptor, 400ex, Cannibal, a Z-400 and Possibly a Banshee and DS, head to head in a shoot-out in Dirt Wheels.

Or will Dirt Wheels be nice and only compare it to the 400ex??? Guess it depends on how much money Suzuki waves under their nose....

I don't see the Sport quad group classified under "displacement". It's more by level of skill. That only applies to the 4x4's.

You have the entry level, mid-sized and the high performance quads.
Yes, it's unfair to compare a 250ex to a 400ex....but not a Cannibal to a Raptor....they both have substantial displacement difference, but they're in the same classification.....

 

Definitely look for a Raptor 450 next year but, don't think the Raptor 660 will be around. Word is they are using the 426 engine and updating it to 450 for the Raptor. The 660 will end production in favor of the 450 engine.

I agree, the Zuke is not aimed at the large bores. I sat on one at the dealer last weekend as did my wife. She thought it was a great quad size wise for her. I will either get her that or the new Bomb DS400 (depending on how it looks and power, etc) when it comes out in the fall.

The market is going to be packed in the 400 area in about a year. Gotta think the old Yamaha Warrior will not be around much longer.

 

Maybe I shouldn't have used the motor size to define the markets but maybe the horsepower and the technology it uses. Price is what counts in the end. You can't compare a Z400 to a C-Dale just like you can't compare a 300ex to a Z400. The price difference and horsepower difference is what actually defines these markets. So the C-Dale is going to win obviously because it has much more money sunk into it and more technologicaly advanced. The 300ex is not going to beat a Z400 because it has much less power.

I can talk forever trying to make my point and I never will. I see markets like how I explained it, they don't tell us these markets exsist but they are created after many years of releasing quads onto the market with different attributes to suit people's different needs and wants.

So in the end there are different markets within markets. Just like trucks, cars, etc. Everything is this way. How much do you want to spend to get what you want? Thats what it boils down to. I don't expect my Z400 to beat a raptor or a C-Dale because they paid more for theirs and it should perform better. But I do expect my Z400 to beat a 300ex because I paid more.

 

I use the best dyno known to man, my butt. I own a 2001 DRZ400 and a 2002 Raptor. The initial hype was the LTZ400 would run with the Raptor. I believe that is very wishful thinking. The Suzuki is down on cubes and no matter what the dyno's say, the yank just isn't the same. I'm waiting for the LTZ to show up to verify that thought, but I'm sure I already know the answer.

 

Let's get the Z's off the dyno & on the track to see what they'll really do!!
There is susposed to be 2 or 3 at Atoka Memorial day weekend for the Heartland nationals.

TheFasterTheBetter, Do you really think Yamaha is going to kill the 660 after just 2 years??? No way!!

It wouldn't suprise me to see a smaller Raptor in a couple of years, But I doubt it'll be based on the YZ426. Look how restricted the 660 is out of the box. It'll probably be based on a trail bike motor.

 

The 400EX was anything BUT revolutionary when it showed up in '99. It is a very good quad and it is based on the best sport quad of all time, but come on, if anything it was evolutionary... lol. The other reason that it sells so well is because the market was so starved (still is). Cannondales, now those have a "wow" factor all their own.

I agree with the market assesment of placing the 400EX and Z400 in the same market, and leaving the 660R and DS650 to themselves. They are different beasts. Of course some crossing over will happen, as it does happen with dirtbike segments. But, there are definite distinctions...

 

The 400ex not revolutionary? What do you think started all of the sport quad craze???? It was the quad of the Century, It was the first sport quad released after the 10 year ban.....do you blame Honda for starting out with something alittle underpowered? I sure don't. And Honda sold more 400ex's in the first 3 years than 250r's. So what does that tell you?

 

<< It was the quad of the Century, It was the first sport quad released after the 10 year ban..... >>



i hate to break it to you, but the 400ex wasn't the first sport quad released after a &quot;10 year ban&quot; there was no ban on sport quads, a few manufactorers just stopped making them. the 300ex, mojave, blaster, warrior, and banshee had all been made during this supposed &quot;10 year ban&quot;



<< What do you think started all of the sport quad craze???? >>



Unless I'm totally incorrect the whole sport/performance fourwheeler craze was started by in 85 by suzuki.





<< do you blame Honda for starting out with something alittle underpowered? >>



i'm glad the honda came out with the 400ex, but the banshee is what really kept the sport alive during the 90's. And yes, the 400ex is underpowered, even for the time period that it came out. quads were looked at in an even worse light in the early and mid 90's and yamaha continued to still produce the banshee.

 

DSAPP, &quot;meg&quot; means megaphone.