You that doubt my previous post are certainly welcome to your opinions. I wish that I could say that Polaris is up to the quality of Japanese designed quads. Polaris and Bombardier are both problem prone. The Japanese designed quads far out number these two in the quantity produced. Sure, you will find some that have problems but compared to the amount manufactured it is an extremely small amount. Don't get me wrong, I love the good 'ole US of A but I'm also a realistic and fact driven individual. The statement about this being true "five years ago" was the same thing said back then. Besides, Honda and the other Japanese owned ATV brands employ many more Americans than Polaris could ever hope to. Ask the guys that work in a Honda plant what quality is all about, I'm sure they would agree. To Bionic, don't you EVER question my patriotism, especially in times of war. I drive a Ford Ranger and to be honest it is underpowered (even for a 4 banger) and I believe most of the parts came from freakin Canada.....you know, the jerks that won't support our war in Iraq, unlike the Japanese that at least sent troops!
Good day.

 

Polaris has sold more automatic wheelers than all of the other manufacturers combined Captin Fact. Check your source. I'll question anyone jumping into a question on which Polaris to buy just to bad mouth them and praise Japan. The record sales of foreign brands are only that because of consumers like you.You create those #'s and the profits go right back to Japan mr realistic. I don't know if your proud or pissed that you have a Ford. Canada has sent troops everywhere with us and I'll take my Canadian brother over you and Japan anyday. I'ts the French that did'nt send troops. And from the 700plus dead Americans and growing hatered for our country worldwide I'd say anyone not dumb enough to follow us is doing a better job electing their leaders than we are.Let me know if you've found the Weapons of Mass Destruction! Realizing we have a mistake at the helm of the American Ship is not unpatriotic or the worn out line " not supporting our troops" I'ts a fact and needs to be rectified this fall. We never,as a people, bring anyone up on deck worth getting excied about in these elections because no one thinks anymore.We let big buissness tell us who's our choice and scratch our heads for another 4 years wondering why things are so f!@#ed up. Next time you buy something, think for a minute where the money goesIf you "love the good old US of A" Right?

 

Polaris sold more ATV's in 2002 than any other manufacturer besides Honda. So as far as quantity goes, you are wrong. And of course you will have less problems with some of these Jap machines (especially Honda) with their stoneage technology. And I HIGHLY doubt that the Jap companies employ more US workers than Polaris, especially if it as many as you are trying to make it sound like. Not to mention, even though they may be built HERE, the money STILL GOES BACK TO JAPAN!!!!! At least with Polaris, it stays HERE!!! Do you own a Polaris???? Where do you have the right to call MY machine unreliable???? If that were the case, then I would HIGHLY doubt that OUR UNITED STATES MILITARY would have just handed over a contract to Polaris to build ATV's for them. What? Dont believe me? Read it for yourself

 

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]Too bad your so far away Big Bad you'd fit right in up here. Lots of Americans. We must have been typing at the same time

 

LOL[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img] It took me a few minutes to find that article too. The non-believers need hard facts[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

Here we go again,
Before some of you mouth off and attack me and my patriotism, maybe you should consider some of the bogus statements you've made. First off to say that Polaris has sold more automatic ATV's than other manufacturers may indeed be true but that accounts for a small amount of the current market share. Suzuki, Honda, Yamaha and Kawasaki has sold more ATV's individually as well as a whole. Before accusing me of just "bad mouthing Polaris" you need to comprehend my previous post in which I stated that I would truly like to see Polaris make the best ATV's. I'm sorry to say that the facts don't bear this out. And for BigBad, who like to call Honda's "stoneage", do you know that Honda started the ATV craze in this country? Do you also know that Ranchers have a reliability that is unmatched in the industry? I would like to see just how your Polaris is fairing ten years from now. Most likely it will be in a trash heap while my RancherAT, the atv with the smoothest new tranny in the industry, will be still cruising the trails. Also for you to have the idea that Honda doesn't employ more than Polaris would suggest that you are an idiot. Honda makes not only the most ATV's but motorcycles, cars, mowers, automobiles and now aircraft. Get a clue, Polaris is lucky to employ one tenth what Honda does. By your "Jap" comment it is obvious that you have some rather ignorant notions of one of our allies in Iraq. Let it also be known that the U.S. military has ATV's from many manufacturers....Japanese included. Of course they gonna give the main contract to an American company though.
Maybe you and that pro-union Democrat, Bionic, can get together and come up with a better argument than the lame one you have submitted.

 

Uhhh... Domestic suppliers are BY LAW given preference in govt. contracts for vehicles and systems. Sgt. Larru Meyer, Army Reserves sits next to me at work and is always saying how unreliable the Hmmwv is. Breaking axles all the time, suspension parts, transmission probs, etc... Why are American cars at the bottom of the quality list in ACCREDITED surveys, like JD Power and associates? Does JD Power do quality surveys on ATVs? Too bad if they don't, because then we'd know the real numbers.
Saying that ALL ATVs ARE THE SAME quality wise is a pretty intellectually bankrupt statement. Having NO data to back it up, it sounds to me like a 'feel good' saying, to placate the guys that have a lot of probs with their machines.
Unless someone can show a true, scientific collection of data on reliability, heresay and anecdotal evidence just isn't good enough to say "mine's the best" or "they're all the same".
I ride a Suzuki, on the whole a pretty reliable machine. Do I think it's the most reliable machine in the freaking world? I don't know, maybe it is! It could be a complete piece of crap that I ride so gently that by luck and the grace of God, will never break. Maybe somebody DOES have the most reliable Make/Model in the world, but they beat the hell out of it and never change the oil and therefore it breaks all the time.
Why don't we do some actual research before we go making crazy blanket statements, then we can discuss WHY one is better than the other, rather than just argue about opinions.

 

Wow guys.

Personally, I don't know how this turned into a political issue, which is clearly has in many aspects.

First off, I'm an American, and love this country. So, the first person who tries to claim otherwise is wrong.
Don't bother trying. Read my signature if you question my convictions.

Some points made so far are valid, but many I don't believe are.

First off. American employees who work for Japanese corporations here in the states, do get paychecks here in America. Not all the money goes back to the land of the Rising Sun, nor even the majority. That's assinine to think that. All those paychecks get spent right here in the USA.

2nd, I would love to buy an American made ATV. Hey, I'm from Minnesota people, the same state that pumps out those Polaris's and Artic Cats. As I have zero experience with Artic Cat ATV's, I'm going to leave them from this statement.

My personal experience is that Polaris ATV's seem to have quality issues. I've seen, heard, and read posts about what would appear to be an above average number of quality-control induced failures on some Polaris', compared to other manufacturers.

If Polaris made a quad that fit my needs, had the power, suspension, handling, and quality that I feel I get from my Rice Grinding Yamaha, then I'd buy it tomorrow. But the facts are the facts. In my opinion, my Grizzly is the best machine for the money. Hence the reason I spent $6000 on a friggin ATV from another country.

NOW>.......

We could ALL argue this to death and never come up with an answer because it's all opinions. Not always facts.
So, please don't turn this into a "My ATV can beat up your ATV" post.

NOW, if you don't like the fact that my opinion is that Polaris' are subpar in quality, then that's fine. Go tell Polaris there are ALOT of people convinced their wheelers suck. Again,...my opinion. My opinion indicates where and how I'll spend my money. It has NOTHING to do with my love for my Country. If it was an Afghanistanian, Iranian or Iraqi ATV, I wouldn't buy it if it gave me hummers every time I rode it. But last I checked Japan isn't fighting us, and they are very much our ally.


Next point. Polaris isn't the only USA made quad....obviously Artic Cat is too.
And take this one with ya.....Every time someone buys a good-ole Artic Cat 650, their STILL SENDING MONEY TO JAPAN!!
Cuz the damm motor is made by Kawasaki.

Are any of you guys dumb enough to really believe that Polaris or Artic Cat actually design, engineered, fabricate and assemble EVERY part on their wheelers here in the US?!?!

Think of it this way. What carb you got on your USA-made Polaris??? Mikuni, Keihn??? Sound like they're made in Kentucky to you?!?

Don't question others patriotism because they bought a Japanese quad. That's just close minded and unrealistic. One doesn't have anythign to do with the other. Nothing at all.

PS - How's your Sony Home Theater, or your Pioneer car deck?

There's a word for what you are doing.....it's called Hypocrisy.

And if either one of you two mis-informed, redneck, Militia wannabe's can come back here and post that you own nothing foreign, you'll also be a liars.

So....Randy1621....to get to your question....
I own a Grizzly, but I've ridden the Kawasaki Prairies. They are very good motors and seem awfully reliable. Probably want to start there. Then you have to choose IRS or SRA. You want IRS....right now your only choice if you go with that motor is the Artic Cat 650.

Good luck.

 

Bionic:

I usually don't get into political rants but I have got to respond to this. I wouldn't respect myself if I didn't

>Canada has sent troops everywhere with us and I'll take my Canadian brother over you and Japan anyday<

Japan has troops with us in Iraq. A few. They are constitutionally prohibited (imposed on them by us after WW2) from doing much more than logistical support. Canada actively opposed the US over Iraq. Canada has no troops in Iraq as far as I can determine. It is more or less irrelevant since Canada won't even have an armed forces in a few years due to funding issues. Their assistance in Afghanistan was welcome and skilled but it looks like it will be about the last time they will be able to contribute anything but token troops to any military effort. A shame. Canada has/had a very skilled military with a proud and honorable tradition but that is being allowed to wither on the vine. Easy to do when you have a protector to your south keeping you secure. As for Canadian "brothers" I find a distinct difference in Canadians. The ones from the urban areas I have found I don't care for. The rural folk I mostly love. Much of America is like that that these days.

>I'ts the French that did'nt send troops<

Thank Christ. And as it has been said. . ". you know frankly, going to war without France is like going deer hunting without an accordion. You just leave a lot of useless noisy baggage behind."

Plus the French were pretty much caught with their zipper down and apparatus wet as far as the corruption of the UN "oil for food" program and doing all sorts of shady deals with Saddam during the sanctions after the the Gulf War. We already know money Saddam had money flowing to France. He had his buddy Chirac running interference for him and Chirac let him down. Who knows how much money was changing hands there.

The French as of late have been actively trying to undermine US policy and intrests by standing in opposition to the US at every opportunity. Some friend. At least where we know where we stand with them now.

Don't get me wrong. I don't particularly hate France or the French. I have visited there and really enjoyed parts of it but France is a nation in decline (some would even say free fall) . Its culture is rapidly disappearing which I think is tragic. It needs to look inward and correct its growing problem before the Eiffel Tower becomes a minaret. Appeasement didn't work for them in WW2 and it isn't going to work for them in their new predicament. Some of their forefathers rose to the challenge a thousand or so years ago. I hope they have the guts to do it today. I fear they don't

>And from the 700plus dead Americans<

We kicked down the door and occupied and entire nation and did so in the most humane manner possible. Remarkably light losses considering what has been accomplished. We have taken the war twice now into the heart of the Islamist world and have killed the evil bastards by the bushel. Al Qaeda has been drawn out in Iraq and we are killing them there so we don't have to fight them here. We have taken the fight to THEM on THEIR turf and are kicking their asses. I will adapt and plagiarize a bit here from someone who said it better than I but it will make my point.

Have you seen the video of Al Qaeda taking a knife and removing the head of a tied up screaming American businessman in Iraq? Find the unedited video and watch it. Watch it a couple of times. Then look at your spouse and children. Look at yourself in the mirror. Look at those men in the hoods. You better look at them. Those are the people out to kill you. Who do you think will win? You? Or them? Think you can take your ball and go home and they will leave you alone? Read a little history. Start with last week, last month, last year, and every other year back for half a century. Then go back a thousand years. Nobody hides from this fight.

Like it or not, that’s the way it was and that’s the way it is.

In the process of invading Iraq and Afghanistan we scared the living sh*t out of Libya and they cashed in their chips and said they didn't want to play anymore. They revealed their extensive WMD programs (way more advanced than even we thought they had) and said basically "we give up". Their WMDs are under control and more importantly their program apparatus is safely locked up in the US. The war in Iraq is and continues to be a success no matter what the media, sniveling congressmen or myopic idiots foreign and domestic say about it.



>growing hatered for our country worldwide<

Like that is anything new. They have been hating us for a very long time. They hate us even more when we do things to protect ourselves. They hated us when we were fighting the Cold War. Now they hate us while we are fighting the Islamists. We are in the process of doing what needs to be done. If some countries don't like it too damn bad.
I can put it best in Latin:
Oderint dum metuant
"Let them hate us, so long as they fear us."

>I'd say anyone not dumb enough to follow us is doing a better job electing their leaders than we are.<

OK. I won't even try to unravel that statement.



>Let me know if you've found the Weapons of Mass Destruction<

Some still may be in Iraq but most of the actual agents and equipment went to Syria and are probably secreted in Syria or the bekka valley area in Lebanon. From one of our own weapons inspection team leaders David Kay to the London Telegraph:
"We know from some of the interrogations of former Iraqi officials that a lot of material went to Syria before the war, including some components of Saddam's WMD programs,"

Saddam had WMDs and used them before. He had WMDs and the programs after the Gulf War after he was suppose to get rid of them. He more than likely had the weapons before we invaded and he most certainly had the capability to manufacture WMDs. Now he does not. He is in a cage and hopefully will soon be hanging at the end of a rope. His regime is dead. His sons are dead.


>Realizing we have a mistake at the helm of the American Ship is not unpatriotic<

A stunningly ignorant realization and view but probably not unpatriotic if voiced in a proper manner. Some things have to be approached differently in wartime.

>We never,as a people, bring anyone up on deck worth getting excied about in these elections because no one thinks anymore<

I don't entirely disagree with you. But electing the leading challenger to the current occupant of the White House would be an utter disaster. I would make the comparison to the British electing Neville Chamberlain to replace Churchill during WW2 but I wouldn't sully Neville Chamberlain with the comparison. Chamberlain was ignorant but not an utterly traitorous honor-less despicable lying conniving bastard.


Now about buying American. It seems that the people who scream thet loudest about buying American are usually people who are building crap.

I do buy American when I can. But I only buy American if it is worthy of my buying it. Subsidizing substandard workmanship on the grounds of patriotism does no favor for the American worker. I'm not going to buy a substandard product just because it is American made. If a Japanese product meets my needs and is of better quality than its American competitor I will buy it.

Example: A friend recently bought an American made truck (with parts coming from all over the globe like all vehicles) assembled in the USA by supposedly skilled UAW employees. He paid nearly 50 thousand dollars for this vehicle. The build quality is terrible and lackadaisical. Screws and bolts missing seams and panels misaligned the list goes on and on. On the other hand another friend bought a Japanese truck and has had zero problems with it. A quality vehicle that exceeded its American competition. The build quality was outstanding. Another guy I know bought a new German made (Mercedes) car and it has incredible build quality and engineering. A Cadillac or Lincoln doesn't have quality like that. They simply don't. They could but they don't. I wish they did. I wish I could buy American and get the best product but unfortunately I can't. Who's fault is that? Some slob on an assembly line who doesn't do his job is a big reason. The engineering was there for my friend's half-assed assembled truck but the guy on the assembly line screwed the pooch.

When given two identically performing products one foreign and one American, of course I will buy American.

/rant off

 

Fantastic posts!
I was beginning to think that I was in moron city with no escape! Aksafari, fruitjacket and captainQuint, you guys saved the day for me. I was starting to lose my cool and wasn't able to get my point across. I'm glad you guys all piped in. Common sense seems to be lacking these days and emotional decision making seems to be the rule. To CaptainQuint, you are really a smart sounding and informed guy. I wish I had your skills of getting to the point and being so articulate. Sometimes I get people pissed-off because of my lack of tact. Oh well, at least I have passion and believe in what I say even if it's still just an opinion.
God bless the USA!