Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Each manufacturer has some type of small glitch in their machines.
(These are only a few reports taken from each Manufacturer’s Forum)

Polaris –Front freewheels steep grades.
Yamaha – Boiling gas
Kawasaki – First year glitches (a few with water-in-the-breather at low depths)
Honda – No Factory Front Diff Lock
Suzuki – Reverse Failures
Bombardier – Very Heavy
Arctic Cat – Hard to Steer

All manufacturers DO have their fair share of problems. Some are extreme others are not.
With that out of the way, here’s the question:
Which ATV manufacturer has the least amount of MAJOR problems with their Big Bores (motors, axles, suspension, transmission)?
In the spring, of 2005, I’m buying a NEW Big Bore.

My Mandatory Requirements:

Very, Very Dependable
Best 4x4 System Available
Huge Amounts of HP (you can NEVER have too much)
Capable of Treading Deep Water
Descending Steep Grades
Climbing Steep Grades (without the front end trying to come up)
Sand Friendly (dried lake bed)
Comfortable Ride

I’ll be riding a lot more next year and I need something to fit these requirements. All input is greatly appreciated.

Sy

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

I bought the 05 Grizzly. The boiling gas hasnt been an issue at all for me and havent heard of it on many 04 and on none of the 05s (so far). Snorkel the tranny, pipe it, re-jet it, put at least 26" tires on it and hold on.

You re not going to find a "perfect" big bore. For me, it came down to the artic cat and the Grizzly. I chose the Grizzly, no real big reason either. I just liked the reputation, mudding ability, power, and the ride. And I havent regretted it one bit either.

Brad

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Polaris Sportsman 800 twin.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

amen

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

No 4 wheel engine braking is a big draw back on the Sportsman 800.
.

Brad

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

ya you can erase that "boiling gas" issue from the Grizzlys, they don't boil the gas anymore.

Very, Very Dependable - I think they all dependable now if you get something thats been out ahwile. Yahama seems to have the best tranny, all of them Mechanics I talked to pointed to Yahama for duribility and dependibility.
Best 4x4 System Available - Difflock a must so Honda is out. Hopefully the Polaris AWD won't bugger up like thier old 4x4 systems after time, one wheel locked and the other not type thing. AWD is a new system though out just this year.
Huge Amounts of HP (you can NEVER have too much) This tells me you want to smoke your buddies, prolly want BF or Polaris 800 for drag racing.
Capable of Treading Deep Water - Any 4x4 will do this, but IRS quads would be the nautral pick here.
Descending Steep Grades - big downfall for Polaris here, that single lever braking will leave you sweating on steep downhills and going backwards if you don't make it to the top is nothing but scary!
Climbing Steep Grades (without the front end trying to come up) - I don't know if one is better than another, they'll all go over backwards if you let them.

Sand Friendly (dried lake bed) - All of them will travel a dry lakebed no probs.
Comfortable Ride- all of them, IRS quads are all soft riding for the most part.

So you want an IRS quad with tons of power, sounds like P800, BF, or Griz.

so I rank them

Dependability Griz #1 Polaris #2 BF #2 or 3 Griz has been out ahwile and I know of no problems for 2005. Polaris might be dependable but the 800 is a new model and needs time tested. BF is also a new model and needs time testing also.

Best 4x4 system. Griz #1 BF #1 or 2 Polaris #3 The Griz is bullet proof and you can choose what you want when you want it. The BF I don't know much about. The Polaris has that AWD crap and it chooses when you are in 4x4 or not.

Huge amounts of HP #1 Polaris #1 or 2 BF #3 Griz I doubt the Griz will drag race like the BF or the P800 with it's 660 engine. I dont' know if the P800 will keep up to the BF or not because of it's massive weight disadvantage. The Grizz is the lightest and I bet it would put down faster lap times in the woods though, or track. But not in a straight out drag race.

Deep Water I dont' know which quad would go in the deepest water, I bet the P800 would do the best in a river though because it's weight would keep it planted and it wouldn't float down stream while the Grizz would prolly be better in a soft bottom mud hole, won't sink as far. Any of them would get your butt wet though.

Descending Steep Grades - Anything but Polaris, The Griz has all wheel engine braking and seperate brake controls. Dunno what the BF has.

Climbing steep grades - anything but Polaris, if you don't make it to the top then imagine coming back down in reverse with one brake lever! The BF would prolly be #1 cause of the HP?? but the Grizz climbs awesome as well.

Dried lake bed? if this is where you drag race then BF or P800 then Grizz, need lotsa HP to drag in the sand

Comfy ride - I'm willing to bet that new P800 will be the sofa here. No idea what the BF would be like but I bet it's a bit stiffer and the Grizz is a bit stiffer than Polaris also.


All three Quads would suit your purposes, some of your "must haves" counterdict themselves so your like anyone else here, there is no "perfect quad" you'll have to sort you prioritys and pick the one that has the most bonus in the areas you feel are most important. Go sit on them all and try to ride them all, if you were to give them each a decent ride then I bet one of them would put a slightly bigger smile on your face then the others. The best thing you can do is take your time, don't rush into a purchase.

[edit] oh crap I forgot that new king Quad 700, I bet it would have some very high marks in here too! Don't forget to sit on that one also. I dont know anything about it but I bet it would be a nice machine.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Thanks for the input!!

I like the thought of the awesome power from the 800 Liberty engine but my Sportsman has the same front wheel engine braking as the 800…. None. This seems to be the only major problem with the Sportsman. Which can be scary down long, steep grades. If only the 800 Sportsman had the Visco Loc system from Bombardier. Some say this is the best 4x4 System on the market.

I don’t know enough about the BF to make a decision, yet. But if it has the same belt system as the Prairies, I don’t think I can handle the noise. The Prairies I’ve rode with, the belt was louder than the motor.

What about the axles on the Grizzly? Can they handle 27” tires plus tow a heavy load? I know when the 600 and 700 Polaris’ came out, the axles were upgraded to handle the power and weight of larger tires (Goodyear Raw Hide). What about the Griz being top heavy? How much truth to this?

Dirtydude, the Grizzly weight problem (not heavy enough) could be solved with 27” Mudzillas, if the axles could handle it.

I should’ve explained the lakebed a little better. In the winter, the power company drops the water level anywhere between 7 and 10 feet on our lake so it’s actually a giant mud hole with sand. Awesome mudding with a little sand mix!!!

As for the KQ, I’ve seen a few posts about the Reverse going out. I’m sure it’s only a first year glitch for the new KQ but enough to make me steer clear for a year or two to see if Suzuki addresses the issue.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

The Brute does have the Prairie tranny. One of the reasons I didnt wait on it and didnt get the Arctic Cat.

The axle on the 04 and 05 are better, 03 was the problem yr. There are alot of guys running 27"+ on them with no problems.

I heard so much crap about the Grizz being top heavy, I almost didnt buy it. And I ve found out its exactly that, a load of crap. Yes it did feel a little tippy with the stock tires but thats the first thing you should replace anyways. I put 26x10s on the front and 26x 12s on the rear and I love it. Notice I said a "little" tippy, not a lot. They say the BF is very top heavy.

If mud is your game, the Grizz is the name to handle it.

I went thru the same decision as you at the first of the yr. I almost waited on the BF but the tranny changed my mind.

Its not the fastest, its not the prettiest, its not the smoothest riding. But when things get nasty, so does the Grizz.

Dont take my word for it, go ride a few. Plus there are rumors of a 800 Grizz mid yr. And unlike others in the market, it ll be a true 800, not rounded up to make the #s look good.

Brad

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

The new '05 Rubicons have front differential disconnect (ala2-4-2) so despite the fact that the engine is "only" a 500, the Honda, to my mind is at least on the running for bulletproof big bores.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

don't get a grizzly 660, they've fallen behind in the power end, which is why yamaha will be coming out with a new bigger one soon i'm guessing. the rubicon doesn't have a front diff lock and is way to expensive. the brute is the machine i'd have cause of it's raw power which is what i most like. the 800 seems to be the best for what you want, and i've been down hills on my sportsman too, i didn't think it was that hard either, just lightly touch the brake while descending, i even like the single lever breaking system, less levers to mess with.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

"don't get a grizzly 660, they've fallen behind in the power end, which is why yamaha will be coming out with a new bigger one soon i'm guessing."


Fallen behind on the power end? Are you crazy? I can outrun the Polaris Sportsman 700 up to 52 mph. But remember one thing, it s a utility atv, not a racing one. If I wanted just fast, I d have bought a raptor or something in the racing line. The only reason the Grizz will go to a 800 is to stay on top. Most people want the "BIGGEST" thing out there. So, in order to compete, the Grizz has to up to 800 also. The reputation is already there. An 800 Grizz is a word everyone else is fearing.

But you know what, the Grizz has set the standard that others are trying to catch. And really the only thing the BF can say is its faster........so what. The SP800 is .....faster..... again so what. Put em in some mud, in some real world situation and see what good faster really does. NUTTIN. And what do most people compare other big bores against? The Grizzly.

Also remember the 800 is the limit. Alot of states have limits set for quad and then they require being registered, tagged, etc etc. So the odds of going over 800 are very slim.

And why should I have to "tap" the gas to get it to stop sliding?

He said he wanted something with power, good going up and down hills, and great in the mud. The BF has a hard enough time keeping the front end down, why would you recommend it for hill climbing.? The Polaris and the 2 wheel enging braking.....nope. And for mud? Thats a no brainer, the Grizz is the king of mud.

Brad

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

I disagree with the bad rap for the Polaris going up and downhills. I agree that it takes getting used to only having one brake lever...but I have descended a >48 degree slope of about 200 feet in length.....and never touched the brake...in fact I had to use the gas to get my speed above a crawl. I have had the engine braking take me so slow the wheels start to slide...a little gas and your back in control. 4 wheel engine braking can be a little disconcerting also. I prefer the 2 wheel engine braking. Additionally on my other bikes/ATCs etc I always worried about beginners.....the polaris with a balanced brake system makes it impossible for the rider to panic and endo over the handlebars.

As for the not making it to the top of a steep hill and having to back down....there is no quad out there that you wont suck half the seat cushion up between your cheeks on before you get to the bottom. I prefer going up till I can't go any farther...then winching to the top.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

haha, that post is hilarious. if you think the current grizzly is the "flagship" of all the 4x4s on the market, then you need to wake up to reality. you seemingly admit the the griz is one of the slowest, but you say how yours can beat a sp700 so i ask, is that an EFI? and either way, the new polaris flagship model is the 800 efi, so yamaha is behind polaris there. who do most people compare other big bores to? certainly not the grizzly. put them in the mud, ok, well polaris usually seems to get the nod when it comes to mudding with their 4x4 system rated as one of the best, but lets just look at the grizzly, that 22 mph speed limit in 4x4 lock mode sure isn't something that i'd want, i like to have FULL power to all 4 wheels when i get in a sticky spot.

face the facts, the grizzly was a great machine for it's day, but it's not with the elite new big bores. i even read in some magazine, i think it was dirtwheels or 4 wheel atv action, where the were talking about the upcoming shootout they were gonna have with the new big bores. they said something like we'll probably include the grizzly and rincon, even though yamaha and honda are gonna have to up the anty to stay with this new group. The new elite big bore sport utes are the Sportsman 800, King Quad 700, Kawasaki Brute Force 750 and Prairie 700. all others in the same catagory are currently a notch below.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Just wanted to add that I prefer the rear engine braking only once you get used to it. I have had buddies sliding down hills with all four wheels skidding, think here no additonl control from the brakes, no steerong while the front tires are skidding. With my polaris the rear will slide easier than if all fours were gopng but I maintain tracton on the fron and control steering, the brakes are 70% front 30% rear from the lever(numbers might be a little off but you get the picture) so you can control the front braking with the brakes and easily add or let up when needed.

I'm not saying this is the best system or not but it is what I prefer.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Listen up guys/girls: FIRST AND MOST IMPORTANT ALL BIG BORES CAN HANDLE WHAT Syclone IS ASKING FOR. And some here is doing that but others need it to be a little clearer. What get's me is the people that are too lazy to do some researching and just ask whats best etc... Syclone is not asking that here!!! He's trying to do some research so don't tell him "if mud is what you are in then you need brand X. Each ATV has downfalls and good points. So tell him what you like and dislike ONLY ON THE MACHINE YOU KNOW and drive and don't compare to a machine that you don't use. That's why CC1999 is so respected here on my POV because he only talks from experience.

I'm on a Kawi 700, haven't been offroad on the BF but drove one around a dealership. I'll mainly talk about the 700. The Kawi can be very dependable well with acceptable amount of repairs. It also has extendend warrenty from Kawi available. I have a lot of hard miles on my 700 and no issue yet except for it overheated once and the belt sensor on the 100 is trip my 700 to limp mode. When that happens it's no biggie you don't even need to get off the seat of your bike to reset it. I like the idea here but for people that do regular maintance it's an overkill. The 4x4 system on the 700 is the Same on the BF and I like it period. I have 2 wheeldrive, 4x4 by switch and a diffi lock on a system the more you pull the more it locks. I also have a quick release strap that allows me to leave it locked but I find I don't use it offen so I don't miss having a locker that doesn't stay locked. Horsepower; well there's enough there and the Kawi puts that power on the ground very well. Deep water; well the carbs sink first. and all machines will sink with the airbox breathers under water. I will travel inbetween the tires and the fenders with no problems however I don't personnelly feel like drowing my machine because I want it to last a very long time and if I pull water in my air box it's twice as expensive because there is 2 of everything. Hills are great, I like the gas tank under the bike and it has a great center of gravity. No problems going downhill infact if you put it in low you almost don't use the brake period but the brakes work great. This machine also loves sand beds. I have no complaints on the ride on a comfort side. The gas milage is not where I would like it but I have fun on it and I guess that's what counts. The BF also has some water issuses but that's been resolved including carb issues. I will not be buying a BF until spring because it's still to new for me. In summary the 700Kawi and the BF should be a conseration.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Did you say sand friendly? No other utility ATV even comes close to the performance of a Prairie 700 in the sand, ... period. That probably isn't what you had in mind though, is it.

I have owned a Prairie 650, a Prairie 700, and three Grizzly 660s, and from what I have experienced, the Prairie's are more reliable. We have had zero problems with either of our Prairies. We had a 2003 Grizzly that vapor locked; a 2004 Grizzly that I broke a front axle CV joint on, that never vapor locked; and another 2004 Grizzly that had the vapor lock problem, and has been fixed. Despite this, our Grizzlys have overall been very reliable ATVs, they just don't have the perfect track record our Prairies have had. My wife still rides one of our 2004 Grizzlys and refuses to let me buy her another ATV, she wants to keep her Grizzly.

Just going from what I have personally experienced, the Grizzlys are capable of getting through more technically difficult terrain than the Prairie's, but the Prairie's are a whole lot more fun to get there on, and a lot faster as well.

And just to clear this up, ... the belt on a Prairie makes no more noise than any other belt, but the straight cut gears in the transmission of a Prairie whine more than the worlds biggest Hoover vacume cleaner. The straight cut gears are used by Kawasaki because they are stronger than bevel cut gears, and in case no one noticed, that v-twin used by Kawasaki makes the most power [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]. The noise from a Kawasaki's transmission is a "reassuring" sound once you know why the transmission makes that sound, and it is not a reason to shy away from purchasing one. An HMF exhaust "fixes" the noisy transmission problem easy enough though [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img].

Good luck with whatever you choose Syclone, and have fun out there.

OuterLimit

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Ok, my dad just bought a 2005 sportsman 600 twin. It has all the power you could possibly want and I am sure the 800 has just that much more. According to the Polaris website they are both 765lbs dry weight, 760 and 597 cc's for each. I put about 15 miles on my dads new one this weekend and that thing is by far the worst handling machine I have ever driven and I have been riding wheelers for many years. If you get is stuck you might as well call a nearby company with heavy machinary to come pull you out. I was seriously dissapointed. I think Polaris needs to get a clue and start making lighter utility quads. With the new sportmans you don't need riding skill, they are just big POS automatic tanks.


When we went riding after, my dad who has been riding for years took the 600 twin and couldn't keep up with my wolvy for the life of him. The only place he had me was the long staight stretches in acceleration. Even the top end we were close. Anywhere you need to turn that Polaris is a POS.


I am not trying to simply bash polaris, I like my dads 2001 500 HO and he likes it better too. He just bought the new one because it was a hell of a deal. We have a big lawn to mow and a big pull behind mower. I think he just bought himself a 600 twin lawn mower.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

I never said the Grizz is the flagship, I said it set the standard that everyone else is trying to catch up.

The diff lock on 05 has an over ride, so go as fast as you like. Or if you dont like that, buy the $10 kit and do away with it, problem solved. When I want 4wd, I WANT IT. I use it for rock crawling and other things. But on the sportsman, you re not in 4wd until the rear wheels slip. I dont want the wheels to slip, I WANT 4WD.

Have you wondered why Yamaha hasnt released a 700, 750 or 800 yet?" They didnt need to, sales on the Grizzly are still strong but yes they will do something bc of all the hype of the new big bores. People now want twin cylinders and 800 cc. NOT bc they need it but bc its becoming the "in" thing, everyone wants to be "bigger than his buddy". The 800 motor is there, all they have to do is install it.

The sportsman 700 is a 683 not a 700. The SP800 is a 760 not a 800. The grizzly is a 660. So, I guess the Grizzly is really a 700 going by Polaris rules. You know Yamaha couldve just put some 700 stickers on the 05s and called them that.

I m not arguing with you or bashing you but you simply told the guy NOT to buy a Grizzly bc its underpowered. And thats simply not true. He didnt ask for an "elite" machine, he ask for which would be best for what he wanted. And I ve stated why I think the Grizzly would be an excellent choice. Would you have ruled it out if it had 700 stickers on it instead? And I havent said any of them suck or shouldnt be considered. I ve told you why I wouldnt chose some of them, why I didnt like some of them, and things on some that I didnt like.

Everything I ve stated have been facts. And I dont want to hear about magazine reviews. I can show you different articles from different magazines and they ll all have different winners. You pay the money and you win. Shot give me a Polaris 800 and I ll swear its the best thing since sliced bread. Everyone knows you dont buy a performance car based on Motor Trend 1/4 mile times. If they want to impress me with a review, put some friggin different tires on the Grizzly..........on all of them. Stock tires suck.

And just so you know, one of my best friends has a SP 700. I dont bash him and he doesnt bash me. We both like what we bought. (It wasnt the EFI that I raced. I know the EFI are faster but I dont want EFI, just something else to screw up. ) But again its a utility quad, I dont care about top end speed. The fastest I go in the woods is 25......30 mph tops. We avg about 15 mph. The grizzly isnt the fastest but it has a ton of torque. And you said it was underpowered. Have you rode one or are you magazine comparing again? If so, was it tuned? The grizzly comes from the factory very rich, they do need to be tuned.

Again, I m not bashing you and I dont want to argue. In my opinion you just ruled it out and without a good reason.

Brad

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

i'm not bashing grizzly's here but they aren't the standard everyone is trying to catch up to, maybe they were at one time, but not anymore.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

This ones good, I can't resist. Polaris needs to get a clue and lighten up their utility quads? YEAH, and yamaha needs to get a clue and beef up their race bikes because their too fast. Does that make any more sense? No, you need to get a clue and realize it is a UTILITY quad. Ya wanna hook that wolfy up to the polaris? You want to see who can plow more snow? Ya wanna go muddin? Sure they are different than a sra quad when turning but all you have to do is use body language, anybody that can ride can get use to it. You said you don't need riding skills to ride the big POS.........then it must handle pretty good. If you can't ride it,it would be a lack of riding skill. I'm sure you get that part.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

I find it funny Polaris owners saying they LIKE the brake system on their quads..

Check out this article from ATV Connection:

ATV's are being made for people with no clue on how to ride them, If you can chew bubble gum then you can ride one. At least that is the question here, ARE ATV's being made by some manufacturers for this purpose? Here is more of the same article:

I like to think of myself as an accomplished ATV'r, and so I choose Yahama. I preferr to have more options at my disposal. I don't want to be forced to ride in a manner chosen by the ATV and not myself.


Perhaps this is why Polaris sells so many machines? There are so many "newbie's" entering the sport and these dummied down machines appeal to them, they can chew their bubble gum and ride the Polaris, and stay away from challenging situations. I also started riding Utility Quads on a Polaris, and if you think you can go in challenging areas as well as a quad that lets the driver choose in which manner to ride (ie: indenepdant brakes, 2 or 4 wheel engine braking, diff lock when you want it) I like the Yahama because it has all of this, it's less weight, and very very dependable.

I don't want a "newbie" machine, but noobs can ride the Yahama too [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

I really shouldn't even respond unintelligent babbling, but I will anyways. First I would have to agree with dirtydude that Polaris makes machines dummied up for newbies. (700 efi with a winch and a plow, oooooooooooohhhhhh) Also, Zorro I would like to congradulate you on knowing that a 700 can tow more and plow more snow than a 350, DUH. Then your comment about mudding, sure I would love to go. Name the time and the mudhole and I will give you a lesson in SKILLED riding. I have been riding atv's almost as long as I could walk and I have ridden many wheelers over the years, so I have riding skills you only dream about.


PS If we ever go mudding I need you to promise that you won't cry when a Yamaha half the size of Polaris has to pull you out of the mud. It wouldn't be the first or the tenth time at that, that I would have to pull a BIGGER Polaris out.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Really?[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img] You and your wolfy are going to come show me how to ride? O.K. Centerville, Pa 16404 Let me know when your coming so I can be prepared to get spanked by you and your 350.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

As always with off-road motorsports, it is 90% rider and 10% machine. I wouldn't discount a Wolverine just because it only has 350cc. The last mud bog competition we went to had a Wolverine in it that won the mid-size 4x4 class.

OL.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Let me shoot this lie down right now. Polaris has not started to ship the 05 600TWIN yet, so your dad couldn't own one. Sorry....

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Hey wolverine.................[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/img]

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Has anyone had experience with the Bombardier Outlander? From my understanding, the Outlander has the best 4x4 system. It's not a twin but is that much power really needed for the best 4x4 system?
Also, does anyone know when the 800s will hit the stores?
Plus, is there any truth to Yamaha releasing a bigger Grizzly?

Sy

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

The outlander is a great 400 class bike. The 4x4 system locks in right a way so no worries about shifting out of 2wd.
I like power sliding so full time 4x4 is not my cup of tea but the 400 outy made my buddies sp500 sweat bullets when they raced and I won't say who won. LOL

My buddies get pissed off when I pull break torqs in a small mud hole spraying everyone with mud, knowing they can't treat me to the same show!

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

ok..I own 2 poaris 5 and 700 so I will answer my likes and dislikes.....understand I can tell you how they ride...nothing on lngevity because they are only 2 months old.

Very, Very Dependable
no problems yet only 150 miles on them

Best 4x4 System Available
4x4 only applies power to the front when the back loses traction, If you are going straight it is seamless and smooth, if however you are off-camber and turn up hill and hammer the throttle.....the front tires will flip the quad on you ( my future son in law found this out being a jerk show-off). However....the 500 was rolled completley on a hard trail with rocks and there was no damage other than some scuffing to the front and rear racks. All the controls survived.


Huge Amounts of HP (you can NEVER have too much) - I can sit on my 700 and hammer the throttle and it does wheelies.

Capable of Treading Deep Water - Airbox is snorkled up to near the gascap

Descending Steep Grades - I do not mind the rear wheel EBS, I have descended slopes so steep the rear tires slide...if all 4 slide you have no control...if just the rears slide you can steer.

Climbing Steep Grades (without the front end trying to come up)...this is a matter of practice and technique...I have found that with experience you learn how much gas it takes to carry the hill...getting part way up, realizing your going to slow and then adding a bunch of fuel can be a mistake....shift your weight forward over the handlebars.

Sand Friendly (dried lake bed)...sand is also a function of your tires, air pressure etc. and what you want to do...if you want to drag race with the nitrous crowd...a utility is not for you.

Comfortable Ride - you betcha

This is my synopsis of my 2 atvs. and since the 700 only weighs 40 pounds more than the 500....it is definately more fun.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Aaron/Polaris5610

I would have replied sooner but I was at the hunting shack for a few days.(deer season) I was not trying to lie, it was a simple miscommunication. When my dad told me it was a brand new 600 twin, I just assumed it was an 05. It is actually a brand new 04 model. MY BAD, I WAS WRONG. I still am completely behind everything else I said about it. I just didn't like it. If you don't believe me that he has the wheeler, call 5 seasons sports in Eveleth, MN and ask them if they recently got a truckload of Polaris 600 twins.

Most Bullet Proof Big Bore Utility on the Market!!!
 

Zorro,

I like your sarcasm. If I only had the time I would be on my way. I really think you underestimate the Wolverine. I could buy a bigger wheeler, but why would I when I really like what I am riding. I have no problem whatsoever holding my own riding around with big bore quads. The only place you would be faster than me is in the long straight stretches and acceleration, but on trails you are gonna need to slow down more than me on corners with your hog. In the mud I think I would drive circles around ya, just do to the fact that you have stock tires(unless you just aren't telling us about other tires) and I have aggressive mud tires on a much much lighter machine.

I personally would take great handing and some power over lots of power and poor handling any day.

All I know you might be an experienced rider, but I doubt it do to your selection in atv's. I just think experienced riders like machines they can control, instead on machines that control them.

If you ever make it to northern MN, let me know. I would be happy to take you out riding and show you the area. I have nothing personal against you, but I just like to say it how I see it.

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I do think that yamaha will come out with a big boy quad to keep up with polairs and kawi. If not they arent any better then honda. Im sure the only thing that he ment is to jsut wait to see what they come out with. Not bashing the grizz. They are a good dependable atv. I ride with 20 people and we all have diff quads. There is many things that one stands out in and it will lack in another part. Grizz is lacking the power and speed at the moment. Polaris well........ Its a polaris, heavy and $$$ who wants to spend another $1000 on 15 more cc. All around I picked kawi for thier best of bolth worlds approach. You get the speed of a sport. And it will still pull and haul anythign I want to put behind it. Just stay true to what you believe in. Unless you want to be proven wrong, hop on a brute and "Let the good times rool"

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Very, Very Dependable- No problems with 100 miles on it.
Best 4x4 System Available- 4wd Low/High and Diff. Lock
Huge Amounts of HP (you can NEVER have too much)- Doesn't seem to be suffering from low HP![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
Capable of Treading Deep Water- Air Filter etc. is very high for a stock set up w/o snorkeling.
Descending Steep Grades- Engine Braking makes it a nice controlled descent!
Climbing Steep Grades (without the front end trying to come up)- No Problems here.
Sand Friendly (dried lake bed)- Lots of sand on the dirt roads but the lakes never dry out!
Comfortable Ride- One of the most comfortable you will find with a Big Comfy seat and IRS![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img]

It's good to be the King!

BigDozer66

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Ok I'm sorry I didn't mean to come on so hard. Everybody thinks different when it comes to ATVs, thats why we have choices. Good day...[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

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Dirtydude, I think you are missing a significant point here:

My wife will never be a high performance trail rider. She just likes to get out. She will never get the highest gain out of a split brake system. Quite the contrary, she will get into trouble. There are many people like her. We don't race anyone. We stop along the trail every 1/2 hour to takes pictures and enjoy the view.

Also, I didn't pick a Polaris because I am a newbie as you seem to imply:

I picked my Quads because they have the highest suspension travel in their class (smooth ride); auto trans (simplicity), single handle braking (simplicity and safety), disc brakes all the way around (safety); steel braided brake lines; (safety) wide, long dimensions (stability); highest ground clearance in their class (less likely to center hang). Larger tires than most sports quads (traction and smooth ride); concentric chain drive (longevity of chain); strut front suspension (durability) and last but not least one of the less expensive quads.

It is your choice to pick your own ride for the type of riding you do. However, I tend to view a machine not as a "newbie" machine versus a "non-newbie" machine, but rather what the machine is made for and its characteristics.

As far as the discussion of racing a Wolverine with a Sportsman. It doesn't seem that the quality or usefulness of Polaris should be measured by its acceleration, its top speed or its high speed cornering. This machine has a high center of gravity, a huge ground clearance and an independent rear suspension. I think that most people would agree that in general this quad was not made to slid around corners as you would a sports quad or even something like a Wolverine that has a solid rear axle and low center of gravity.

MNWolverine01; maybe you/your dad just bought the wrong machine for yourselves. If you crave performance maybe you need to look at a good sports quad. A DS650, Predator or Raptor should pretty much destroy either the Polaris or the Wolverine in handling, acceleration and top speed.

The first time I went out on my quad, I pulled a 4x4 rancher out of wheel deep mud. I didn't get stuck in the mud... But then again, I didn't go in the mud. I could see that any quad would high center in the mud and never get out because jeeps and trucks had created ruts. Sometimes, it makes more sense to know what you are going into and what the limitations of your machine is. Can I now say that my Trailblazer is better than a Rancher? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

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On the single lever braking vs seperate front and rear brake lever issue ...

ONLY Polaris uses an "On Demand" 4x4 system that does not solidly connect the front and rear axles together when in 4-wheel drive. On any other ATV made it does not really matter if you apply just the front brake, or just the rear brake, when you are in 4-wheel drive, because all four wheels are going to slow down equally when either brake is applied. So if someone is bright enough to shift into 4-wheel drive when they should be in 4-wheel drive, such as on a very steep downhill, then they will do just fine, irregardless of which brake lever they use. A Polaris 4x4 ATV on the other hand REQUIRES single lever braking, because the 4x4 system does not solidly connect the front and rear axles. If you applied just the rear brakes on a Polaris 4x4 ATV only the rear wheels would be slowed down, and if you applied just the front brakes then only the front wheels would be slowed down. And in extreme terrain that would be even more dangerous than single lever braking is.

Some of the reason for single lever braking on a Polaris may be because it is easier for a new rider, but I'm pretty sure that is not the only reason. A good part of the reason Polaris uses single lever braking is because of their "On Demand" 4x4 system, which really requires them to use it.

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It wouldn't surprise me if they come out with a bigger Grizzly. They finally got all the issues fixed on the Grizzly (like the gas boiling issue - it is NO MORE). So, since they got it right, why not change everything and start with the problems again... [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img]

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OuterLimit, you make an excellent point about split braking on locked AWD systems. However, by the same reasoning you also must be suggesting that all rear wheel drive quads should have single hand braking because they also provide no front wheel braking! If it is dangerous for a Polaris, it must be dangerous for all rear wheel drives. Also, could you explain to me why single hand braking is dangerous? I might believe braking might be less optimal in certain cases, but more dangerous? Another point, if the front of a AWD quad has a free wheeling differential in it and you apply the front brakes and lock one wheel, the other front wheel will actually speed up because the rear end and engine would drive it. Talk about getting in a pickle!! I am not sure there is any one best system. They all will have their advantages and disadvantages in different situations and with different riders. The key is to know how your quad will respond in a particular situation.

I would think that going down a steep hill for an AWD Polaris, a split braking system could be better because you could use the engine braking in the back and apply the front brakes to brake the front wheels. For a single hand brake in the same situation: One way would be to put it in neutral and use only brakes. The second way is to apply slight throttle and brake simultaneously. The third way is to go very slow, apply no throttle and use the slight rear engine braking and single hand braking. In any case, for the AWD Polaris, the key is to not allow the rear wheels to slide on a steep hill. This can only be accomplished by braking the front wheels using the single hand brakes.

My wife and I were in a particularly hard trail system. We went up a well worn steep incline that had a root protruding half way across the trail from the left side. We were crawing up the hill. When I hit the root, I instinctively leaned forward and left as the quad went more vertical and gave it more throttle when my rear tire hit the root to go over it. My wife did mostly the same, her front tire made it ok; however, when her left rear tire hit the root it threw her to the right. She instantly hit the hand brake and braced her right leg to prevent her and the quad from rolling to the right. She ended up standing next to the quad holding the hand brake. She set the brake and sat down visably shaken. In this situation, she could never have simultaneously held a front hand brake and a foot brake (right foot). A single front hand brake would never have held the quad on such a steep hill. There is no doubt in my mind the quad (and possibly my wife) would have ended up at the bottom of the hill in a bad way without the single hand brake. I relate this story because it showed to me in a very clear way another benefit of the single hand brake.

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Bryce,
I don't think a system that requires you to apply throttle going downhill is an optimal set up. And I have been in the same situation your wife was in with my former Sportsman 500 HO, except for exactly the opposite as your wife. In my case I was on the wrong side of the ATV to reach the single brake lever, and it would have sure been nice to have a brake lever on the side I was on, because I rolled the ATV and ended up busting up the headlight pod, brake master cylinder, both racks, and popping the bead off of a tire. So it just depends on the situation. I prefer the split braking system I grew up with racing dirt bikes, and the single lever braking on the three different Polaris ATVs we have owned always felt "awkward" to me. I thought about buying an Arctic Cat 650i one time, but the test ride and it's single lever braking talked me out of it.

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OuterLimit. I definitely have to agree with you about applying throttle while going down hill. It seems counter productive. And you make a good point about your 500. I am sure we could hear many horror stories and miraculous saves from both sides of the isle concerning one braking system or the other. I too grew up on bikes, but mostly steet bikes. But then again, it has been a few years since I have ridden. On the other hand, since I ride snowmobiles, the single hand brake feels natural. I see my natural progression of quads to go in the Sport Quad direction as opposed to the utility quads. In which case I will find few choices in the braking system. My wife; however, will probably never leave the auto trans/single hand brake quad. Maybe, someday in the future, we will have anti-lock braking systems. LOL That would only cause a new debate: the merits of ABS versus non-ABS. Have a great day OuterLimit. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]