Trouble with Yamaha corp!
#11
10-21-2001, 09:00 PM
You can try going to this site: http://pub33.ezboard.com/byamaquad
A few guys have been through the same fight with dealer/yamaha. They can offer you some more insight on this. HTH
A few guys have been through the same fight with dealer/yamaha. They can offer you some more insight on this. HTH
#12
10-22-2001, 05:01 PM
#13
10-22-2001, 10:03 PM
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Ok guys this is where i am. I alled yamaha today. I told them i had been riding my yamaha raptor about a month ago when my tranny locked up(2nd gear) I told them i brought it to my dealer for a warrenty fix, and while it was in the shop, i told them that i have collected much info on the raptor's 2nd gear tranny problem. I told them that it is a factory defect. They said "there is no defect, it is how you rode it" then i asked to speak to there supervisor, and she said "for what reason" i told them it was to inform them that there is INDEED a problem with the trannys. She said no way!. She said that the tech at yamaha and my dealer talked and decided that it was user error!. Now i don't know what to do now. I called my dealer today left a message saying that 1. my raptor is not like a yzf426, it does have a warrenty, and 2nd that when i broght it into the shop, i told them that I only wanted the work done if it was covered under warrenty. This is nice, because now they tore the whole tranny down (10 hrs of labor) and after it is apart, they decide my clutch is "abused" so they won't cover it....it dosen't take 10hrs to take off the clutch cover to find that out!. Now i am at a dead end, because to take my quad to another dealer (the dealer i bought the quad from, 2hrs away, because they diden't have a raptor at my local shop at the time, and wanted over $400 more for it out the door)tI have to pay out $600+ labor, not including parts,ect!!! now, i ask of you guys, if you own a raptor, or if u have had teh same problem, to give me any info that you may have, ect, but please i need VIN numbers of the quads that you own taht have had teh same problem, so when yamaha says "there is no reported problem" i can say "OH YEAH!!! All these vin numbers here have had the same problem, go ahead look em up, and now tell me that it is an isolated incident!
Thank you for any help you can provide.
Thank you for any help you can provide.
#14
10-22-2001, 10:58 PM
I Can NOT say I had a similar incident but, My last six are 006144 (purchased 11\00) and I've had not a single problem (at least one that's Yamaha's Fault). My understanding from my dealer's techs (whom is a fellow atv'r) tells me the problems seem to be random, and Yamaha is not certain it is their fault, thet're dealers fault, or the riders fault. I have called him and told him about your problem and discussed a problem of my own ("popping"
and he said your first mistake was going to a dealer that you did not purchase it from (they hate fixing other dealers bikes cause they did'nt get they're cut out of it), He said the second thing is the fact that the clutches were wasted..that leaves them under the impression you were riding with wasted clutches and bangin gears(even though you may not have)that is they're perception of it. Things may have turned to your favor if the two items occured at seperate times instead of the same time. I'm not here to defend YAMAHA but I will defend the Raptor 100%. I bought a new ATC 250R way back in 85 and I was young but still, I remember tons of problems with the new engine/chassis design...hell I had to threaten GM with a lawyer to get my 99 silverado fixed ...again it's all the "NEW" thing...there's no possible way ANY manufacturer can test they're product under every circumstance. Try a lawyer..that's what I did with my truck..and GM sent some big wig in and straightened every problem I had and then some!! It only cost me $100 but GM gave me my fees back in the form of accy's for my truck. Please don't hate the machine it's just that...a machine.
and he said your first mistake was going to a dealer that you did not purchase it from (they hate fixing other dealers bikes cause they did'nt get they're cut out of it), He said the second thing is the fact that the clutches were wasted..that leaves them under the impression you were riding with wasted clutches and bangin gears(even though you may not have)that is they're perception of it. Things may have turned to your favor if the two items occured at seperate times instead of the same time. I'm not here to defend YAMAHA but I will defend the Raptor 100%. I bought a new ATC 250R way back in 85 and I was young but still, I remember tons of problems with the new engine/chassis design...hell I had to threaten GM with a lawyer to get my 99 silverado fixed ...again it's all the "NEW" thing...there's no possible way ANY manufacturer can test they're product under every circumstance. Try a lawyer..that's what I did with my truck..and GM sent some big wig in and straightened every problem I had and then some!! It only cost me $100 but GM gave me my fees back in the form of accy's for my truck. Please don't hate the machine it's just that...a machine.
#16
10-23-2001, 11:13 AM
WreckRaptor660R,
My suggestion is to start looking at your states laws and contact a lawyer.
Yamaha is trying to **** you on this one. Don't give in, not even an inch. 6 Month warranties are just that, 6 months. It's got a BAD tranny now and it should be fixed. I would also go after them for THEIR defective clutch, it shouldn't have failed in less than 6 months.
I see this as a big corporation trying to screw the little guy again. Even with a bad clutch the tranny shouldn't dump within the first 6 months, and a lawyer isn't going to take their BS.
In the good ole USA, You do NOT have to prove it is there fault; it is the responsibility of the manufacturer to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that it was YOUR fault, and not theirs. This puts the burden on them in court to prove it was your riding style, not a defective part that burnt up the trans. That is almost impossible for them to do. As I see it they are trying to strong-arm you, don't take this BS from them. I would start out by researching "Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act" passed by congress in 1975. It gives you some very specific rights. Click here to link to the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act
Unfortunately the Massachusetts lemon law specifically states that off road vehicles are not covered, did you happen to purchase it from another state? If so some states (including Ohio) allow the lemon law to be applied to all titled vehicles, even quads.
I am not a lawyer by any means, just a very informed consumer, but it sounds like you need a lawyer. I would give Yamaha one last chance to make good on the warranty. I would want to speak to the general manager, and I would tell him you are going to seek a lawyer, that you have read and understand that you have rights under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, and that if your quad isn't fixed in a timely fashion your lawyer will be contacting both the local dealer and Yamaha corporation. Generally most GMs have heard of the "Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act" and they know they are going to end up fixing the problem anyway. Once you seek a lawyer, they are also going to get billed for his time if they lose the case, so they are just piling on the losses, and all it does is cost them more. You also might have specific rights, which vary from state to state, which a local lawyer should be able to help you with.
I wouldn't give up this fight! I have seriously been considering starting a website similair to blueovalnews.com. I was going to call it blueracingnews.com. If you haven't followed the story of blueovalnews.com, it has been the biggest pain the in the rump for Ford. At one point Ford offered to buy it out for 6 million, and it didn't happen. Ford sued the owner of the website, which went all the way to the supreme court, which ruled in favor of blueovalnews.com. Basically they pool data from every vehicle complaint they can get their hands on. They post internal documents. The 2001 Cobra Mustang wasn't built on time beacuse of HP problems posted on blue oval news, that has ended up a class action lawsuit. Thats what yamaha needs to see, a bunch of people posting real problems, that would get there attention and stop this BS treatment of customers.
On a side note:
I had an issue with my local service center, they didn't want to fix something covered under warranty cause they were 'busy', they wanted me to wait till winter when they weren't busy. I told them that was fine, it didn't matter to me, cause on the 31st day they'd hear from a lemon law lawyer and they'd be forced to purchase the bike back. Needless to say, I had mine fixed in 6 days.
My suggestion is to start looking at your states laws and contact a lawyer.
Yamaha is trying to **** you on this one. Don't give in, not even an inch. 6 Month warranties are just that, 6 months. It's got a BAD tranny now and it should be fixed. I would also go after them for THEIR defective clutch, it shouldn't have failed in less than 6 months.
I see this as a big corporation trying to screw the little guy again. Even with a bad clutch the tranny shouldn't dump within the first 6 months, and a lawyer isn't going to take their BS.
In the good ole USA, You do NOT have to prove it is there fault; it is the responsibility of the manufacturer to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that it was YOUR fault, and not theirs. This puts the burden on them in court to prove it was your riding style, not a defective part that burnt up the trans. That is almost impossible for them to do. As I see it they are trying to strong-arm you, don't take this BS from them. I would start out by researching "Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act" passed by congress in 1975. It gives you some very specific rights. Click here to link to the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act
Unfortunately the Massachusetts lemon law specifically states that off road vehicles are not covered, did you happen to purchase it from another state? If so some states (including Ohio) allow the lemon law to be applied to all titled vehicles, even quads.
I am not a lawyer by any means, just a very informed consumer, but it sounds like you need a lawyer. I would give Yamaha one last chance to make good on the warranty. I would want to speak to the general manager, and I would tell him you are going to seek a lawyer, that you have read and understand that you have rights under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, and that if your quad isn't fixed in a timely fashion your lawyer will be contacting both the local dealer and Yamaha corporation. Generally most GMs have heard of the "Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act" and they know they are going to end up fixing the problem anyway. Once you seek a lawyer, they are also going to get billed for his time if they lose the case, so they are just piling on the losses, and all it does is cost them more. You also might have specific rights, which vary from state to state, which a local lawyer should be able to help you with.
I wouldn't give up this fight! I have seriously been considering starting a website similair to blueovalnews.com. I was going to call it blueracingnews.com. If you haven't followed the story of blueovalnews.com, it has been the biggest pain the in the rump for Ford. At one point Ford offered to buy it out for 6 million, and it didn't happen. Ford sued the owner of the website, which went all the way to the supreme court, which ruled in favor of blueovalnews.com. Basically they pool data from every vehicle complaint they can get their hands on. They post internal documents. The 2001 Cobra Mustang wasn't built on time beacuse of HP problems posted on blue oval news, that has ended up a class action lawsuit. Thats what yamaha needs to see, a bunch of people posting real problems, that would get there attention and stop this BS treatment of customers.
On a side note:
I had an issue with my local service center, they didn't want to fix something covered under warranty cause they were 'busy', they wanted me to wait till winter when they weren't busy. I told them that was fine, it didn't matter to me, cause on the 31st day they'd hear from a lemon law lawyer and they'd be forced to purchase the bike back. Needless to say, I had mine fixed in 6 days.
#17
10-23-2001, 11:18 AM
Wow kids.. I hadn't been to blueovalnews.com in a while.. read this page
Liar Liar?
What if we had a page like that against yamaha [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/img])
Liar Liar?
What if we had a page like that against yamaha [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/img])
#18
10-25-2001, 05:06 PM
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Ok, listen to this.
I called yamahaect, and they told me that my problem is in the hands of my dealer for now, because the dealer called yamaha and said that it was abuse.
Now, get this...I left a message to the dealer telling him that he lies up the A$$, and that my raptor did have a 6-month warrenty instead of "NO warrenty because it is a race bike like the yzf426" then sencond, i told them that they wern't suposted to do 10 hrs of work, dissassembling the tranny,ect after they saw my clutch was "abused" and that they should have called me at that point. So, teh next day, i got a call saying that my raptor haden't even been taken apart yet, and they were waiting on yamaha!!! now comon, a week ago, they said i owed 10 hrs of LABOR!!! now comon! now i just gave them there "OK" to take it apart and see what's wrong with the tranny. Now the only thing i don't understand is why they told me 2nd gear was gone, and that it was user error, when tehy haven't even taken it apart!!!! comon?
I called yamahaect, and they told me that my problem is in the hands of my dealer for now, because the dealer called yamaha and said that it was abuse.
Now, get this...I left a message to the dealer telling him that he lies up the A$$, and that my raptor did have a 6-month warrenty instead of "NO warrenty because it is a race bike like the yzf426" then sencond, i told them that they wern't suposted to do 10 hrs of work, dissassembling the tranny,ect after they saw my clutch was "abused" and that they should have called me at that point. So, teh next day, i got a call saying that my raptor haden't even been taken apart yet, and they were waiting on yamaha!!! now comon, a week ago, they said i owed 10 hrs of LABOR!!! now comon! now i just gave them there "OK" to take it apart and see what's wrong with the tranny. Now the only thing i don't understand is why they told me 2nd gear was gone, and that it was user error, when tehy haven't even taken it apart!!!! comon?
#20
10-25-2001, 05:33 PM
I would call yamaha back and tell them this:
It's your bike, I don't care what the dealer says. You're going to be named in my lawsuit also, you had better fix it.
Yamaha's name is on the warranty, not the dealers. Typical finger pointing.. don't take that BS.
PS. Under the law of most states they can NOT keep your quad for lack of payment unless they have a signed work order with a written estimate.. that you OK'd. I'd go get my quad.. and don't pay a damn dime. If they won't give it to you.. call the police and tell them you want to put file charges against the dealer for not returning your property.. your names on the title, not the dealers. Let them go to the hassle of sueing you.
It's your bike, I don't care what the dealer says. You're going to be named in my lawsuit also, you had better fix it.
Yamaha's name is on the warranty, not the dealers. Typical finger pointing.. don't take that BS.
PS. Under the law of most states they can NOT keep your quad for lack of payment unless they have a signed work order with a written estimate.. that you OK'd. I'd go get my quad.. and don't pay a damn dime. If they won't give it to you.. call the police and tell them you want to put file charges against the dealer for not returning your property.. your names on the title, not the dealers. Let them go to the hassle of sueing you.