Boreem BMS 250cc 2006 coil wires
Jun 1, 2012 | 11:33 PM
#13
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Dang, I'm letting a lot of posts slip by me lately. I've been super busy at work and get home tired and apparently inattentive.
There are three connections to an ignition coil:
1) The primary side input terminal. This comes from the CDI. The signal here is a high voltage pulse (100 volts peak or so) happening at firing time, ringing back and forth for a few cycles at 30 KHz.
2) The high voltage ouput wire to the spark plug. This has thousands of volts on it. It is an exact image of the primary side signal only many times bigger. You can't measure it directly because anything you tie onto this wire will either load down the high voltage or get damaged by the extreme voltages here.
3) Ground. Most of the time ground comes through the coil mounting bolts.
Note that there is no 12 volt anything at the ignition coil. It is all high frequency, high voltage AC stuff.
So if you have two input pins at the coil they must be ground and primary input from the CDI. So ground one, hook the other to the black yellow wire and see if it works. If it doesn't then flip the wires around.
There are three connections to an ignition coil:
1) The primary side input terminal. This comes from the CDI. The signal here is a high voltage pulse (100 volts peak or so) happening at firing time, ringing back and forth for a few cycles at 30 KHz.
2) The high voltage ouput wire to the spark plug. This has thousands of volts on it. It is an exact image of the primary side signal only many times bigger. You can't measure it directly because anything you tie onto this wire will either load down the high voltage or get damaged by the extreme voltages here.
3) Ground. Most of the time ground comes through the coil mounting bolts.
Note that there is no 12 volt anything at the ignition coil. It is all high frequency, high voltage AC stuff.
So if you have two input pins at the coil they must be ground and primary input from the CDI. So ground one, hook the other to the black yellow wire and see if it works. If it doesn't then flip the wires around.
Jun 7, 2012 | 02:51 PM
#15
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Weekend Warrior
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From: California
Ok so I tried doing what you said and I got nothing . Can you tell me how to test my cdi to make sure all is ok there ?
here is a picture of it https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...&type=1&ref=nf
here is a picture of it https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...&type=1&ref=nf
Jun 8, 2012 | 04:30 AM
#17
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Weekend Warrior
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From: California
no I got no spark and as far as i can tell the cdi is 6 wires this picture of cdi and plug it is not like all the other ones I have seen on this site
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...&type=1&ref=nf
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...&type=1&ref=nf
Last edited by KicknUr; Jun 8, 2012 at 04:30 AM. Reason: forgot to post link of picture
Jun 8, 2012 | 11:38 PM
#18
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Yes, I neglected to look at the link in your last post. I've not seen that CDI before. CDIs all work on the same general principles, but I have no idea which pin is what. We need to figure that out:
1) On your wiring harness side of the CDI connector, what are the wire colors?
2) Find your stator wires coming out of the engine. What are the wire colors on the harness side of the stator/wiring harness connector set?
3) Find a ground connection where a wire from the wiring harness that is bolted to the engine or quad frame.
This is a start. The idea here is to determine the function of the six wires coming off your CDI. Once we know the functions then we can start measuring each of them. But to do this I need to know where those wires from the CDI are going. Follow along carefully for the logic in this paragraph... I'm going to make the assumption that any wire in your taped up wire harness that enters the harness from a connector will still be the same color wire when it emerges elsewhere. This assumption is almost always valid, and it is a very good tool for tracing out how things are actually wired up (without having to unravel a wire harness). I know that some of your CDI wires must go to the stator. That's how CDIs work. But which wires? Look at the colors in the wiring harness at the CDI and at the stator. Let's match them up. It's kind of an electronics jigsaw puzzle...
I went looking for Boreem quad parts. I wasn't very successful. It is possible that you have a kill switch issue, or a wiring issue, or a grounding issue. But what if you have a stator issue, ignition coil issue, or a CDI issue? Do you think you have any source of parts? It appears that this is *not* a typical, generic, me too quad that a zillion chinese companies were cranking out a few years ago - all buying their parts from the same few vendors.
Is this also a non-standard engine? I don't know.
1) On your wiring harness side of the CDI connector, what are the wire colors?
2) Find your stator wires coming out of the engine. What are the wire colors on the harness side of the stator/wiring harness connector set?
3) Find a ground connection where a wire from the wiring harness that is bolted to the engine or quad frame.
This is a start. The idea here is to determine the function of the six wires coming off your CDI. Once we know the functions then we can start measuring each of them. But to do this I need to know where those wires from the CDI are going. Follow along carefully for the logic in this paragraph... I'm going to make the assumption that any wire in your taped up wire harness that enters the harness from a connector will still be the same color wire when it emerges elsewhere. This assumption is almost always valid, and it is a very good tool for tracing out how things are actually wired up (without having to unravel a wire harness). I know that some of your CDI wires must go to the stator. That's how CDIs work. But which wires? Look at the colors in the wiring harness at the CDI and at the stator. Let's match them up. It's kind of an electronics jigsaw puzzle...
I went looking for Boreem quad parts. I wasn't very successful. It is possible that you have a kill switch issue, or a wiring issue, or a grounding issue. But what if you have a stator issue, ignition coil issue, or a CDI issue? Do you think you have any source of parts? It appears that this is *not* a typical, generic, me too quad that a zillion chinese companies were cranking out a few years ago - all buying their parts from the same few vendors.
Is this also a non-standard engine? I don't know.
Jun 9, 2012 | 12:38 PM
#19
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Weekend Warrior
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Ok wire's on the harness side are
Blue
Blue/white stripe.........and goes to stator
green/white stripe.......and goes to stator
Green........................Ground
Red/white stripe..........and goes to combo switch on left side bar's
Black/yellow stripe.......and goes to coil ?
STATOR WIRES
3 Yellow's
green/white stripe
Blue/white stripe
Now as for the motor I'm not sure but here is a picture of the plate that is riveted to the front of quad...https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...&type=1&ref=nf
As for parts yes I believe I have found a place that carries parts for bms it is a part store linked thru the bmsmotors web site..
oh and almost forgot green wire is ground wire from battery and attached to frame
Blue
Blue/white stripe.........and goes to stator
green/white stripe.......and goes to stator
Green........................Ground
Red/white stripe..........and goes to combo switch on left side bar's
Black/yellow stripe.......and goes to coil ?
STATOR WIRES
3 Yellow's
green/white stripe
Blue/white stripe
Now as for the motor I'm not sure but here is a picture of the plate that is riveted to the front of quad...https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...&type=1&ref=nf
As for parts yes I believe I have found a place that carries parts for bms it is a part store linked thru the bmsmotors web site..
oh and almost forgot green wire is ground wire from battery and attached to frame
Last edited by KicknUr; Jun 9, 2012 at 12:40 PM. Reason: forgot ground wire
Jun 10, 2012 | 10:05 PM
#20
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I'll embed my comments in blue:
The above tests have a double purpose. First they will verify or reject my hypothesis' for the function of each wire, and second, they will do some preliminary tests on your ignition system. The big caveat is that we are doing this on a broken system - so if a test doesn't come out right then we have to figure out if the hypothesis is srong, or have we stumbled onto the problem itself , or is it simple measurement error (very common). Let's cross that bridge when we get to it...
Ok wire's on the harness side are
Blue [I'm suspecting this is fused and switched 12 volt power from the ignition switch. If I'm right then your CDI is DC powered. Unplug your CDI, turn on your ignition switch and measure this wire to ground. You should have 12 volts DC.]
Blue/white stripe.........and goes to stator [Timing trigger pulse using classic wire color]
green/white stripe.......and goes to stator [I'm betting Timing trigger signal return wire. On many quads the timing trigger return gets grounded back at the stator. But on some quads the return wire returns all the way back to the CDI, where it gets grounded inside the CDI. With the CDI unplugged and the ignition switch off, measure the resistance in ohms between blue-white and green-white wires at the CDI connector. You should see about 150 ohms or so.]
Green........................Ground
Red/white stripe..........and goes to combo switch on left side bar's [I bet this is an ignition kill switch of some kind. With the CDI unplugged measure the resistance of this wire at the CDI connector to ground with: 1) Ignition switch on and all kill switches off, and 2) Ignition switch off and a kill switch on (like the left handlebar kill switch). One case the wire should be shorted to ground (zero ohms), and the other is should be open (infinite resistance)]
Black/yellow stripe.......and goes to coil ? [Yes, black-yellow is a classic color for the ignition coil output wire. Measure the reistance of this wire in the harness to ground (CDI unplugged). Use the lowest ohms scale you have. You should see something like 0.7 ohms (but not zero ohms).]
STATOR WIRES
3 Yellow's [Battery charge system through the voltage regulator. This has nothing to do with "no spark" problems so you ignore these wires.]
green/white stripe [Described above at the CDI end of this wire]
Blue/white stripe [Described above at the CDI end of this wire]
Now as for the motor I'm not sure but here is a picture of the plate that is riveted to the front of quad...https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...&type=1&ref=nf
As for parts yes I believe I have found a place that carries parts for bms it is a part store linked thru the bmsmotors web site..
oh and almost forgot green wire is ground wire from battery and attached to frame
Blue [I'm suspecting this is fused and switched 12 volt power from the ignition switch. If I'm right then your CDI is DC powered. Unplug your CDI, turn on your ignition switch and measure this wire to ground. You should have 12 volts DC.]
Blue/white stripe.........and goes to stator [Timing trigger pulse using classic wire color]
green/white stripe.......and goes to stator [I'm betting Timing trigger signal return wire. On many quads the timing trigger return gets grounded back at the stator. But on some quads the return wire returns all the way back to the CDI, where it gets grounded inside the CDI. With the CDI unplugged and the ignition switch off, measure the resistance in ohms between blue-white and green-white wires at the CDI connector. You should see about 150 ohms or so.]
Green........................Ground
Red/white stripe..........and goes to combo switch on left side bar's [I bet this is an ignition kill switch of some kind. With the CDI unplugged measure the resistance of this wire at the CDI connector to ground with: 1) Ignition switch on and all kill switches off, and 2) Ignition switch off and a kill switch on (like the left handlebar kill switch). One case the wire should be shorted to ground (zero ohms), and the other is should be open (infinite resistance)]
Black/yellow stripe.......and goes to coil ? [Yes, black-yellow is a classic color for the ignition coil output wire. Measure the reistance of this wire in the harness to ground (CDI unplugged). Use the lowest ohms scale you have. You should see something like 0.7 ohms (but not zero ohms).]
STATOR WIRES
3 Yellow's [Battery charge system through the voltage regulator. This has nothing to do with "no spark" problems so you ignore these wires.]
green/white stripe [Described above at the CDI end of this wire]
Blue/white stripe [Described above at the CDI end of this wire]
Now as for the motor I'm not sure but here is a picture of the plate that is riveted to the front of quad...https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...&type=1&ref=nf
As for parts yes I believe I have found a place that carries parts for bms it is a part store linked thru the bmsmotors web site..
oh and almost forgot green wire is ground wire from battery and attached to frame