Thor~

It's fairly simply. It's quite obvious you're fast and loose with fact and while others may give you a pass when referencing their words, it doesn't fly with mine, for anyone for that matter.

I guess I'll take the spin comment as a compliment coming from a master such as yourself, although I always give as honest an answer as possible. Let's face it; this all started by someone asking a valid question, and you flopping over here trashing other manufacture's quads, but licking the paint of the infallible polaris. That is, in my book, Bravo Sierra. I also own other quads, ride with other quads and the entire point of your post sure as heck doesn't jive with the real world I've seen. Lastly I also post on 3 other forums, and it's post exactly like your first one that **** people off, and would be slammed down as well as at the Nation or Highlifter. The "Mine's better then Your's because it's a Polaris" crap is a very old, worn out, and outdated tune.

Suffice it to say I'd like to end my participation on this thread. It's value was lost some time ago for anyone looking to the question, with the possible exception of somebody needing a good laugh.

Personally, I think all the manufactures have their strong suits, including Yamaha. While I am not a "Brand loyal" person, the 660 Grizzly has been an excellent quad for me, of course so has Suzuki, & Arctic Cat.

Andy~

I've read a couple posts about that gas boiling in the bowl of the carb thing due to the exhaust being too close, shrouds holding heat in, etc. I've never experienced that, and 90% of my riding is done in low range, but I do live in northern Idaho (not near as warm as the southern states). You live down south, has that happened to you?

SilverBear

 

Sorry, , , I didn't mean to start something here.

I can see that my original question has sparked some firm opinions.

I can also see where I have kept things going to some extent with some of my comments.

 

Ratman~

No need to apolagize. If anyone should, it oughta be me. Posts's like Thor's initial and to some extent subsequent, are a dime a dozen on all the internet forums, this time my stamina must have been low and the factless potshots at the Grizzly & other machines set me to try and clear the record. The Grizzly's certainly not without it's faults, but anyone would be hardpressed to find a machine with the same options & advances without a new model year quirk here or there.

Did you get my reply to the PM?

SilverBear

 

Thor- that was basically a reply to Ratmans two posts. Mainly the questions about the sway bar preceding the post that had the quip about a Grizzly with handwarmers being able to go over anything. I think its understandable.

 

Thor- again what are you trying to accomplish with your last post. To look innocent or what? You should join the debate team or something. What do you mean getting defensive. Well, thats generally what people do when somebody starts picking their stuff for any and all problems with it. What the hell good does it do you to try and point out the bad things. Do you own it? Is it going to harm you any or cost you any money? How does this affect you? Thats the question. It doesn't. Its just like it always is. Somebody sees a quad that is pretty much superior to whatever they own or their brand's flagship, and they have to find something wrong with it to make them feel better that they have something else. Thats how it is with any material item whether it be two quads, two bridal dresses, two pickup trucks, or anything else. Perhaps that was not your intention, but it gives some insight as to why I would become defensive. I think you would do the same if the quad in question were the Magnum 500 and we were sitting here trying to find all of its faults.

 

Innocent? NO

Defensive? NO

In a debate? Yes. Let's take a look at the post that started this entire flame contest for a moment. On January 26 I entered a post in reply to ASFASTASU regarding three wheeling on an Arctic Cat. The intent was to dispel misinformation and the everpresent spread of incorrect second hand information. I indicated that all ATVs have weaknesses. Please re-read the post. The intent was not to BASH. Life and the purchase of quad is a compromise. You take the good with the bad. We both know that.

>>>>>>Where do you newbies get all of this misinformation? I have seen Honda 450's Honda Ranchers, and All Arctic Cat 500s negotiate mud without problems. If you want the ultimate mud machine be prepared to trade off some other trail qualities. >>>>>

Where was that inflammatory? Except for the newbies who refuse to use the search engines of the forum.

>>>>>>The new Grizzly is allegic to water.

This is what really started it all. I had no idea that the word allergic would cause such a controversy .

>>>>>>The new Kawasaki does not ride as well as a Polaris Magnum

The fact is, it doesn't.

>>>>>The Honda 450 is not as fast as a Polaris

We all know that the 450 is more durable than the Polaris but stiffer riding.

>>>>>>the Polaris has "true 4WD but it's weight puts it at a disadvantage to a Rancher with reasonably sized mud tires.

See I put down the Polaris because of it's weight but did not go into detail the tractibility of the Rancher.

>>>>>>>Hang around a local hole long enough and you will see what I mean.
The Honda 450s/Ranchers/AC500s will be going thru things with the proper tires that only the Polaris and the big dogs should. Strange but true.

Isn't this endorsing Hondas?

>>>This forum is not the last word in the real world. IMHO

and neither is Dirt Wheels.
__________________________________________________ ________________________

Then the fun starts.

Human nature is: fight, flight or denial.

After being called a "Dyed in the wool Polaris Owner"
A shallow poster,
A purveyor of Bravo Sierra,
Ignorant to the cures of electronic overrides for the Grizzly
Fast and loose with the facts
Trashing other peoples machines
Licking the paint of Polaris

I thought that I would post one more time. Wouldn't you?



<< ... it's post exactly like your first one that **** people off, and would be slammed down as well as at the Nation or Highlifter. The &quot;Mine's better then Your's because it's a Polaris&quot; crap is a very old, worn out, and outdated tune. >>



Where did that come from? Another subtle innuendo. Very good, on the verge of being masterful. How would you like to work for this guy and get you personnel review from him if he didn't like you? Think about it.

That is why I posted the last post. To clear the air. Was my initial post too curt for the average uniformed newbie? Probably.

Am I a choir boy? No Am I always potitically correct? No Will I stand by when somebody twists a thread using subtle nuances to discredit the opinions/and credibility of the other participants? No.

In answer to your question, that Is what I was trying to accomplish. I had to choose between fight, flight or denial.


[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

 

I'm outa here.

Sorry I started this everyone.

You can't learn anything from a person who is always putting himself above all others. When someone is always telling you that you are inexperienced ( a 'newbie' ), people ussually get a little on edge. You can't say it's all for a higher cause, to educate. People don't learn that way. All you see in the back of your mind is &quot;Who do you think you are?&quot;
(Then again, Maybe I'm just a little weird that way )

When that same person, is faced with overwhelming facts and still will not concede, Personally I tend to disregard anything that is said as mere opinion and completely worthless.

I will make this comment: Your actions, attitude and demeanor, along with your information on the Polaris has convinced me not to buy a Polaris. Thanks Again.

I know this may seem like flaming; If so, I apologize.

Thor:
You know the old addage better than the rest of us (after all we are just &quot;newbies&quot &quot;You reap what you sow&quot;.

You asked for it.

 

Thor- I have to agree with most all of your points (on the quads) except maybe the Rancher thing. I agree that it is more manuverable than the Polaris, but I would prefer the Sportsman over it in all situations. The Rancher can't turn the tires near as good. Its not as stable I don't think either despite the lesser weight.

I definitely agree that you will sacrifice something with any quad. Even the newest big bores give up something to the other one.

 

Well I am really confused about this whole thread. Everybody is entitled to their own opinions. The only problem I see in this whole thread is the statement:
&quot;The Hondas that we had were utterly reliable but only designed for someone under 30 years of age who wanted to ride less than 25 miles per day.

I take issue with that. (I think) I have had a Foreman for the last 4years. I am 47 years old. When we go, we ride, thats all we do. We leave early and come home late. I am the oldest guy in our group and I am last to bed and first to get up! So my contention is this. Either the Foreman doesnt ride all that bad, (which is my belief) there are a lot of pansies out there, or I am way tougher than I think and have the body of a 29 year old. (ya right!) So......in sumation ahhhh I guess I dont take issue. I want to thank Thor for his compliment!
I feel like a kid again. (still)

 

The Foreman rides rougher than several of the newer big quads. That could be said. I think of it this way though. The Foreman doesn't ride rough to me, but doesn't ride like a Cadillac like some quads do.

I think for somebody whose first quad ever was a Sportsman 500, they would say the 450 rode like a log truck. For those of us that got a taste of the first evolution of quads, the 450 rides like a dream.

My first quad was a 1985 Yamaha 200 which had a &quot;rigid&quot; suspension. That means it didn't have any shocks at all. You cannot make a rougher riding quad than this, and I rode the hell out of it when I was younger. Next we got an 86 YFM 225. Shocks at each corner and a far cry from the 200. This was like a dream, but its total crap compared to the worst quad made today. After that was the 300 Honda with its 5.1&quot; travel and Macpherson struts. This bike was heaven on earth.

Since then I've had an Arctic Cat 500 and now a 660 Grizzly and the ride on these two is excellent. The Grizzly compares to any quad ever made in comfort. Still, the point being is that if I had seen a 450 Foreman back in say... 1991, I damn sure wouldn't have anything to say about it having a rough ride or being for short trips and youngsters.


From my standpoint, some quads out there don't ride as smooth as others, but none that you can buy ride rough. I've seen rough, and they quit making it back in the mid-90's. 450 is a good quad that anyone can enjoy regardless of the fact that it doesn't have 9&quot; of suspension travel. It all depends on perspective.

If we were talking sport quads, I wouldn't have any perspective.