Trying to learn before I buy. What are the pro and cons for each type of tranny?

I've read the CVT trans can eat up belts if abused (mud pits)
Then Honda ESP has its electronic shifting problems and still require a throttle let off to shift

 

That depends on which Honda you are talking about. Anything that is offered with a footshift does need you to let off the throttle.

 

Not all CVT trans are belt eaters. Yamaha's CVT is darn near bulletproof, but there are a few others out there that do have problems. If you use the search on this forum you will probably find out what brands have good CVT's and which do not. I won't name brand names because it will just turn this thread into a Ford vs Chevy debate. But I will say my Grizzly 660 CVT trans is incredibly smooth and has been absolutely trouble free.

 

i bad thing about CVT is the belt can get toasted and belt slippage is sometimes also an issue. the good is it shifts better than a person ever could lol. makes life easier

 

I've done my searches on each model/year of the ATV that i find for sale on the used market in my area. I think I am leaning toward's a bullit proof CVT trans for the wifes bike and for me I can ride anything.

 

I can't help mentioning the foo foo factor here. There are some of us who just think that automatics of any kind (belt or otherwise), are a crutch for beginners and little girls.....what else is there I can say?

When you talk about the Hondas, you have to differentiate between the full automatics (two very different kinds!) and the ES system which shifts an autoclutch manual transmission through a selenoid. The ES has certainly had its share of problems, most probably the result of faulty angle sensors, but I would personally pick it over any automatic if I absolutely was unable to shft with my foot.

 

About that foofoo factor... I know where you're at - been there. I'm a convert now, though.

I grew up in snow country, but never did sleds. I can count on the fingers of one hand the number times I 've been on a snowmobile as pilot OR passenger.

I started riding dirt bikes at age ten. Followed motocross like it was my religion - does anyone here remember the heated 1970s rivalry between Roger DeCoster and Joel Roberts? (showing my age here)

Grew up into street bikes and Harleys. Always insisted upon a manual transmmission in my truck, and preferred it in the family car, too, when I managed to get my way. I always said "I know better what gear I should be in than that stupid slush box".

One of the reasons I never felt in command of a sled is because of the CVT. I wanted to be the master, the boss, to decide about gearing. I don't let the machine decide where it's going to steer - why should I let it decide what gear ratio to use?

Now, I've got a couple of quads. Right away, of course, I wanted a fullly manual hand-clutch type ... just what I'm used to, just what I'm comfortable with ... kinda just a dirt bike that doesn't fall over. SHE wanted the CVT.

Now that I've actually experienced both, IMO CVT is THE shie-zaaa. I'm sold.

Man, you are NEVER in the wrong gear.

Honkin' down the trail & suddenly you come up on an obstacle? Gotta grap a whole lotta SLOW in a whole lotta hurry ... THEN accelerate again? On the "old fashioned" quad, the wat I WANTED things, in order to do that manuever I'm all-of-a-sudden busy with all four paws like a cat in a moving llitter box... two brakes, one hand on the clutch, the other leg fanning the shifter as fast as possible (which isnt' very fast) ...

... and by the way, unlike a dirt bike, if you have one of the many manual-shift quads on which you can't do all that shifting without lifting your leg, then when you lift your leg, you shift your balance...

... and then when you shift your balance, you have steering issues...

...which makes life even more interesting if the trail is narrow.

If I'm in 3rd or 4th and suddenly come upon something I almost always wind up coming to a complete stop to get myself in the right gear again before I can proceed. In the meantime my wife on the CVT machine goes from 40 MPH to 5 MPH and back up to 40 just that simple, and she disappears off over the next hill.

Because she's NEVER IN THE WRONG GEAR.



Same deal when it comes time to accelerate. Doing 17 MPH then come to an open space? No downshifting, just peg the throttle and go... because you're NEVER IN THE WRONG GEAR.

Wide open space, steep short ridge to transverse, wide open space again on the other side? On the manual machine it's like five minutes of dancing ... complete with lots of required planning ahead .... to do this. It's like doggone aerobic exercise. On the CVT machine : point, wiggle your thumb, say "weeeeee!", repeat as needed.


Yea, she's a girl. AND she having a helluva lot more fun than me, with less work, and leaving my butt in the dust.... because of the CVT.


The CVT machine is easy to load up 2x8 ramps into the truck, too, because it will move/stop with the single control. All I hafta do is stand beside the machine and use the throttle to walk it right up the ramps and stop at the top.



So, I USED TO think a CVT was foofoo. I used to think a lotta stuff that I don't think anymore:

I used to think toaster-oven was pretty cool (showing my age AGAIN) , but now I'd never be without a microwave. It is quick, easy, and convenient... is THAT foofoo?

Some people still like to shift. Some people still like to bake thier own bread, cure their own beef jerky, and load their own rifle shells. I'm glad they have fun. None of that makes you a wussy if you buy your ammo at the store.

As far as that goes, I used to think a quad was like a dirtbike with training wheels - for kids and dirtbike-rider wannabees who were too foofoo to keep their balance. We used to joke about quad riders not being able to stand up by themselves on 2 feet like an adult, just like they can't ride with only two wheels liek an adult. I don't think that way any more, but I used to think like that ... back around the same time when I thought CVTs were wussy.

...and now that I've owned and ridden quads with both manual shift and a CVT, as far as I'm concerned CVT is the way to go. CVT will be a minimum requirement for all future ATV purchases in this household.

 

I've never had a problem because I was caught in the wrong gear ........

I can generally tell by looking at the terrain, what gear I need to be in. And on those rare occasions where I find myself needing a quick gear change, it is done in a flash and I don't feel all confused "like a cat in a litter box" as you put it....

I ride all the time with my Father and his KFX700 ..... I'm never getting left behind because I'm in the wrong gear or because his CVT gave him an advantage.

I always found a CVT just the opposite. I find that the power is not there as quickly or with as hard of a "hit" when you want it because the CVT is spooling up. Just like an auto in a car, there is a delay compared to a direct clutch.

There is a reason racing of all kinds predominately uses a manual design.....

CVT's may not be "foo-foo" and I have no problem with people who ride them. For me, part of the fun of riding an ATV is shifting and banging gears. I literally get bored riding an auto and always wish I had a clutch when I'm on one. Even for my work quad, I prefer my Honda Rancher's manual foot lever to a Polaris CVT.

 

hehehehe....


In my scenario the cat in the litter box isnt' confused, he's just very busy!

Yea, it takes some planning ahead I know. Often there is time to plan ahead, but sometimes I feel like it's not enough ...which I'll admit is a function of riding maturely/safely... something at which I'm not a very good example. Anyway, at this point in my life the gears just seem like one more thing to tsake up my attention instead of the mountains, the scenery and the wildlife.

Yes, manuals deliver power to the ground more quickly, IF you're in the right gear - which depends on powerband. With a smaller, peakier engine mine is pretty picky about which gear it wants to be in before it can deliver. That larger the engine, the less this is a factor.

I mentioned that the quad doesn't seem to let me shift quickly, and to be fair I'm sure that's just a function of this particular machine. I could always rifle through the gears pretty quickly on my dirt bikes.

Being a former diehard gear-jammer I do understand when you say that to you it's all part of the fun. I was there, too. Maybe i'm just ...


GAK!

... getting old!

 

There was a great editorial many years ago, and it dealt with the "dumbing down" of our sport. Anybody remember it??? Got a link to it??? I lost it and can't find it anymore......

I think back when, most new quad and 3 wheeler riders had some motorcycle background and already knew how to shift a manual trans. The editorial predicted that the massive influx of new "unseasoned" riders would make it necessary for everything to go automatic.....and it looks like the prophecy has pretty much come true, at least in the utility ranks!