ok so i have been working on ridding my ds of the loud sounds at idle (valve train) but, today i pulled the cam chain tensioner because the chain was really loose when i took it apart. But, as i checked the tensioner, it compressed and rebounded nicely. There was only about a few cintimetrs of in and out movement but it seemed to be working fine and not stuck out or in. so i re installed, and the chain was tight. so as i turned the crank moving the motor to TDC, the chain stayed tight except for one rotation where it had the slack at the top, but as soon as i moved the crank, it tightened back up to normal? what is going on. why is the slack coming and going??

secondly, i used a feeler gauge once i had the motor at TDC(when the marks on the cams were pointing towards eachother and were close togather and were dead even bc i could not see the TDC indicator on the left bottom side bc it was dark) BUt, the smallest feeler gauge i had was a .006 and it would not fit at all.

any recomendations? the tensioner? do i need a smaller feeler gauge? was my method of TDC ok?

 

iccky turn your idal up just a tad and see if this rattal goes away turn that little *** below the carb and speed it up a little just curious. let me know what that does. i went in for a valve adustment and all they had to do was turn my idal up . thats what my chatter was

 

the cam chain tensioner is hyldraulic, oil pressure forces it out against the plastic chain slide when motor is running. if you are getting loud chain slap sounds at idle it is possible that the chain tensioner is not applying adequate tension to the chain. this is assuming idle speed is correct, if idle speed is so low that the bike is on the verge of dying, then loud chain slap can be heard, so be sure idle is at or above 1400rpm. a faulty chain tensioner may not necesarily be apparent inspecting in the hand. they are around $30 to replace.


valve gap specs for stock motor and cams is .004-.006. when you park her at TDC with the cam marks facing each other, it is important to be at TDC of the compression stroke, not the exhaust stroke. TDC of exhasut stroke has the exhaust valves open, thus no gap. easily confirmed by simply having all 4 cam lobes pointing out away from the spark plug holes, rather than a pare of them aimed towards them.

any measurement below .004 on a cold motor will need adjusted, because once things heat up the gap decreases and you don't want a valve hanging open slightly from insufficient gap creating loss of compression.

 

my idle is around 1600 according to the tach, but i have turned the idle down before and heard the chain slapping around really badly so, i dont think that is the issue here.

hightower..
i had the cam marks pointing in towards eachother and both cam lobes pointing out, front pointing to front and rear pionting towards rear, and the motor was cold. Is this correct? am i on TDC during compression stroke? if this is right, should i get a feeler gauge that can measure .004? bc my current only has .006 and bigger.

but, the motor has made the loud slapping sound for a good bit now, so something is out of whack.... assuming that my procedure above is correct, i am assuming that my tensioner is faulty even upon visual inspection and i should replace it and then start the bike to see if that fixed it. Because all in all, that chain had more than 1/2 and inch of slack when i first tore it apart.

 

if you had chain slack when you first pulled the headcover, most likely the tensioner is faulty, this would be the most likely cause.

FYI the chain slap you hear is a seperate issue from valve adjustment, one has nothing to do with the other, valves in need of adjustment cause no noise, except for possible backfiring if a valve is not fully closing due to no gap at all. yes you can get a tapping sound from excessive valve clearance, but in the case of the DS valve gap usually decreases over time, not increase, as valves and seats wear.

yes iccky you are correct, lobes facing out as you mentioned means you were at TDC of comp stroke.

and yes you need smaller feeler gauges, all the way to zero in .001 increments. valve spec as mentioned is .004-.006, no way you can know if you are in spec without having gauges smaller than .006. anything less than .004 needs adjusted with a different shim, you need to know exactly what the gap is to calculate what shim you need to aquire.


given the fact that your chain was so loose, you will want to be certain it has never jumped time. look into the plug holes with a light, or stick a screwdrve in the middle one, and be certain you are at tip top dead center, then recomfirm cam sprocket marks are in line.

 

Iccky, you have a couple of issues here.

1. You need a valve adjustment. If the .006 would fit any valve, you're way off on the exhaust. Intake... you are right at, or past the minimum. Exhaust calls for .10 - .015.


2. When you get your clearences right, I think your incosistant slop should go away. I think that your cams are under such pressure that your are creating the slop when you turn the motor over. Also check to make sure that the cam bolts that hold the gears on are tight. Make sure that your trays are tight (to spec... which is 89lbsIN).

Keep us up to date, and don't ride until you get this stuff into spec. This could be bad if you are not careful.

Also, how much time on this motor? What year, and are you the first owner? I didn't catch if the cams were stock or After Market.

 

bigdaddy,
what i meant to say earlier was that when i put the motor at TDC, and checked the gap, the .006 would not fit in between at all, indicating that i need to get some much smaller feeler gauges like a .004 all the way to zero so i can see what the gap is.

also, i went to the dealer today and they are going to order a new tensioner for me at no cost. Even though i am out of the warranty, i had it in the shop for the loud slaping sound while it was still under the warranty. so, now that they think they know what the problem is, they are gonna replace it for free due to them not fixing it while it was still covered.

and the bike is and 03 with 50 hrs on it( i purchased it brand new in the crate last july) it was part of left over stock from a dealership that went out of business. (plus i got a killer deal on it as compared to the new 05's they had.

 

iccky, I have an o3 as well, and I doubt that you've tortured it more than I. That bike should of had a valve check at 10hours and then ever 6 months. I check my valves every 4 - 5 trips to the dunes. I've never fell off as much as you have. I would go so far as to say that not only should you re-lash, but you should probably pay some attention to the vavle seats and valves. I like my intake to be at LEAST .008 and am completely happy with .010 and even .012. I like my exhaust to be .014 - .016 on a fresh head. Get your tensioner and then re-lash your valves.

did the dealsership check your vavle lash when you took it in for the knocking? I would be interested to see what they came up with.

Careful on this one....

 

the dealer told me that the lash was within spec, and that i should not have to worry about the lash until the 100-150 hour mark. But i am gonna get the new tensioner and install it. but in the meantime, i am gonna try and get some smaller feeler gauges tommorow and check the lash. what should i expect to see? something in the range of .004 and .006 right?? ( which i have read is the recomended ammount)