Sandfire, how much do you want for your 250R? I'm looking to buy a 88 or 89 250R before next glamis season.

 

Cudaman... the only reason the 2-stroke would be banned is if they don't meet the EPA specs for emissions... The technology is out there... SOMBODY needs to pick it up and run with it.

Several universities have engineering competitions regarding emissions of 2 vs. 4 stroke snowmobile engines.... the 2-strokers can actually burn cleaner!!!

Honda started looking at this years ago with their 'clean burning' twin.... then decided that it is better to be another sheep in the flock... that way they can't stand out in the crowd for the land sharks (Lawyers) to pick them out...

Looks like my next quad will be a Gas Gas... at least they are making a 300 2-stroker!

If we the consumer would refuse to support the 4-stroke revolution... maybe we'd get what we want...

 

83Honda200X, not sure what it's worth. Seen them anywhere between $3500 & $5000 in the cycle trader. Had a guy offer me $4800 when I had it at DJ's Cycle in Yucaipa when I had it in for a tune up. I will negotiate when it comes time to sell it. Got it stored for the summer right now. I'll keep in touch if your serious. I'll send pics when I get a chance. It's really clean.
89' Fourtrax 250R with FMF Gold Series pipe, FMF Tip, K & N Filter, New chain, & Twist throttle. Everything else stock.

 

well i dont see the technology becoming usable before 2 strokes get banned for sale. i wish we could refuse 4 strokes but it seems lots of people like them so i also dont see that happening. Hopefully they dont get banned yet and maybe someone can work with the technology to make 2 strokes better(does that affect there performance??) anyway hopefully the gas gas will do well and will show ccompanies there is still a large market for new two stroke quads and will help to fight them getting banned.

 

From what I understand, the 2 stroke technology needed for passable emissions would be a type of direct injection to the combustion chamber, eliminating the normal crankcase fuel passage. No company would invest in this complex system to sell quads, but there has been research here for the automotive sector. A small, lightweight engine with a high ratio of horsepower per pound is naturally highly desireable in that field. Maybe they will get this tech developed and it can spin off into the toy world. More efficient fuel management equals more power too, just like today's computer managed injected autos. You never know.....in 1995 who would have seen the 4 stroke off road thing developing as much as it has. In auto 4 stroke engines, we are now deep into the laws of diminishing returns now that we have variable valve timing and the computer engine brains. 2 stroke technology offers at least an opportunity to make the next big step. Or maybe I'm just full of crap.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

 

I think you're spot on the money S.Rascal!!
What I think we'll see over the next few years is the snowmobile market developing the direct injection tech. Ski-Doo is already working on it and I'm willing to bet the other big boys are too.
4-strokes are simply way too heavy for a mountain/poweder sled. Yamaha introduced a big inline 4 sled last year... while it's a great trail sled... they still can't compete with the big bore powder sleds..
IT's the same old arguement of power to weight ratios..

It's way too risky/expensive/whatever you want to call it... for the ATV market at this point, but the future could be bright once again.

Just my $.02

 

yeah

 

Bombardier has had a direct injected two stroke in PWC for three years now, as well as what they call their semi-direct injection. I don't work on PWC but my fellow tech who does says they have worked out very well, comparable performance and 75% better gas mileage than their standard Rotax equivalent. But in order to troubleshoot problems, set timing, in general service them, you need a laptop, software, junctions, passwords only available to dealers. Plus now you're dealing with pressurized fuel. Very cool technology, but it negates one of the main virtures of two strokes, simplicity. Not exactly like jetting down a size in your 250R is it?

 

Bombardier recently (2 years ago) purchased the dying OMC (outboard Maine Corporation)brand. The reason for purchasing this crappy boat oputdrive is because it came with Evinrude Outboards too. Evinrude developed a system called FICHT. It is a direst injected 2 stroke system. They had a lot of problems when it was first invented. In fact many believe it is the reason for the downfall of the OMC marine empire. I perrsonally saw one motor (early 175hp ficht) with over 7,000 in warranty claims. They had worked out the bugs, but unfortunatley it was too late. Bombardier snatched up theie technology and R&D for $.60 on the dollar. It has been a year since I talked to the Bombardier rep. but they were talking about FICHT Snowmibiles, PWC and Quads. The only other company in the world who has the technology to do it is Mercruiser. You can produce a low emissions 2 stroke, in fact you could buy a 1999 Evinrude outboard that would pass 2006 C.A.R.B tests. You can, with the same work, get a 4stroke to produce even lower emissions than ANY 2 stroke. Fuel injected, computer controlled (which is what it takes for a FICHT motor), 4 strokes are the way of the future. It will take a while, but we will see it before we see new direct injected 2 strokes (which is not going to happen).

 

Gentlemen, read this:

New 2 stroke