There will never be a 650EX quad............
#11
12-12-2005, 11:24 AM
There will never be a 650EX quad............
Originally posted by: Duneaddict
Not a good idea to stereotype the general populus.... The 450 doesn't even come close to being 'enough' for me and the majority of our riding group.
When they build one with around 80-90 HP, that might be getting close.
Not a good idea to stereotype the general populus.... The 450 doesn't even come close to being 'enough' for me and the majority of our riding group.
When they build one with around 80-90 HP, that might be getting close.
And your the type who rides in wide open spaces in the dunes. Throw in some technical obstacles and then try and hang onto 80-90 HP. Even in the baja which is wide open but still has plenty of obstacles a 450 is plenty.
Chad Reed, one of the best motorcycle riders in the world, said just last week that a 450 is a handfull for him.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img] Jeremy McGrath has said the he has trouble riding a STOCK 450 to it's full potential. So are you saying that you are better than pro's? Some of the best in the world?[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]
With the exception of drag racers and hill climbers, big displacement is just for ego's and that is it. Handling, Suspension, and weight is far more important. Displacement is only a replacement for testicular fortitude.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img]
#12
12-12-2005, 12:21 PM
There will never be a 650EX quad............
Originally posted by: Duneaddict
Not a good idea to stereotype the general populus.... The 450 doesn't even come close to being 'enough' for me and the majority of our riding group.
When they build one with around 80-90 HP, that might be getting close.
Not a good idea to stereotype the general populus.... The 450 doesn't even come close to being 'enough' for me and the majority of our riding group.
When they build one with around 80-90 HP, that might be getting close.
#13
12-12-2005, 01:57 PM
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There will never be a 650EX quad............
Some of us like the big bores and not the little revvy engines like in the 450's...sure they keep up but who really wants to replace pistons in the yfz for example every 200 hours...hell thats like 2-3 months of riding for me. I have rode a 450r and yfz and they both had to be revved to be fast unlike the big bores where ya just shift whenever and it doesnt really matter all to much. I think if they made a 650ex lots of honda fans would be buying one for the reliability and the big bore that it is.
#14
12-13-2005, 10:54 AM
There will never be a 650EX quad............
Originally posted by: motox26
And your the type who rides in wide open spaces in the dunes. Throw in some technical obstacles and then try and hang onto 80-90 HP. Even in the baja which is wide open but still has plenty of obstacles a 450 is plenty.
Chad Reed, one of the best motorcycle riders in the world, said just last week that a 450 is a handfull for him.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img] Jeremy McGrath has said the he has trouble riding a STOCK 450 to it's full potential. So are you saying that you are better than pro's? Some of the best in the world?[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]
With the exception of drag racers and hill climbers, big displacement is just for ego's and that is it. Handling, Suspension, and weight is far more important. Displacement is only a replacement for testicular fortitude.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img]
Originally posted by: Duneaddict
Not a good idea to stereotype the general populus.... The 450 doesn't even come close to being 'enough' for me and the majority of our riding group.
When they build one with around 80-90 HP, that might be getting close.
Not a good idea to stereotype the general populus.... The 450 doesn't even come close to being 'enough' for me and the majority of our riding group.
When they build one with around 80-90 HP, that might be getting close.
And your the type who rides in wide open spaces in the dunes. Throw in some technical obstacles and then try and hang onto 80-90 HP. Even in the baja which is wide open but still has plenty of obstacles a 450 is plenty.
Chad Reed, one of the best motorcycle riders in the world, said just last week that a 450 is a handfull for him.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img] Jeremy McGrath has said the he has trouble riding a STOCK 450 to it's full potential. So are you saying that you are better than pro's? Some of the best in the world?[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]
With the exception of drag racers and hill climbers, big displacement is just for ego's and that is it. Handling, Suspension, and weight is far more important. Displacement is only a replacement for testicular fortitude.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif[/img]
There you go stereotyping me again! I do ride alot in the wide open dune areas, however I also woods/trail ride and do some pretty wicked hill climbing and desert riding also. I see no issue in controlling 80-90HP, granted my current machine is only around 75HP, but I sure could use more! Obstacles are traction!
So, I stand by my original statement that a wimpy little 450 IS NOT PLENTY FOR ALL OF US!
Am I better than the pro's? Guess that depends now doesn't it? Am I highly compensated to make these kinds of statements for the manufacturers? Nope!
Have these guy's ever been on anything with real power? Doubtful!
There may be other motivating factors hidden beneath those statements... besides, I know what works for me far better than these yayhoos.
Guess I don't have 'sheep like' mentality like some folks do... And I certainly wouldn't follow them off the cliff, just because that's what they do.
Handling, suspension, and weight are important factors... Most of all Power to weight ratio!
That's where the big displacement comes in...Not merely ego's...
You've got a pretty healthy one there yourself, especially since someone comes here and challenges your broad statements..
I know what works for me, so don't go spewing worthless statements about egos, etc.
Engage brain before keyboard.
I'm done!
#15
12-13-2005, 10:59 AM
There will never be a 650EX quad............
Originally posted by: dunefool
When he said the 450 is enough for most, I believe he was talking about the crf450r dirtbike. The dirtbike is enough for most. The quad isn't as much. Just wanted to try and clarify.
Originally posted by: Duneaddict
Not a good idea to stereotype the general populus.... The 450 doesn't even come close to being 'enough' for me and the majority of our riding group.
When they build one with around 80-90 HP, that might be getting close.
Not a good idea to stereotype the general populus.... The 450 doesn't even come close to being 'enough' for me and the majority of our riding group.
When they build one with around 80-90 HP, that might be getting close.
I'm an old CR500 rider, so to get the full mental picture of 'enough'... swing a leg over a 500 and try to hang on.
#16
12-13-2005, 12:04 PM
There will never be a 650EX quad............
Originally posted by: Duneaddict
Have these guy's ever been on anything with real power? Doubtful!
Have these guy's ever been on anything with real power? Doubtful!
LOL, that is humorous.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img] They get the best parts in the world from manufacturer's that we couldn't get a hold of if we tried, and you think they havn't felt real power? Please![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]
I do see we started off wrong here because I was refering to bikes and I think you were going down the quad route. Quads, yeah I can see how riders can want and use a 660, or 500 2-stroke in more open trail riding, dunes, or what not. I doubt there is many that can use it to it's full potential, but a great point like Dunerider650 said, not everyone like high reving machines. BUT, you have to agree with me that there is A LOT of people that buy big quads do to the fact that they have to have the biggest and baddest there is even if the are a rookie who can't ride.
As for the 500cc dirtbikes, why do you think they don't make them anymore? Because they were too powerful and everybody was racing 250's instead. There is very few men that can ride a 500 to it's fullest. Power doesn't mean faster when turns or obstacles are involved. There is a LOT of good riders out there that put down faster lap times on a 250f than a 450f. Why? They can use the power of the 250f better and run the p!ss out of it, on a 450f you have to try to manage the dam thing unless you are really good and talented. You get my point?
#17
12-14-2005, 02:28 PM
There will never be a 650EX quad............
>>>LOL, that is humorous.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img] They get the best parts in the world from manufacturer's that we couldn't get a hold of if we tried, and you think they havn't felt real power? Please![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]<<<
I would bet a cold beverage of your choice that none of your 'moto-boyz' have ever swung a leg over a 80+HP quad in their life... That's to what I was referring to with my statement.
I'll agree that we haven't exactly been speaking of common ground here.. (Me quads, you bikes)
Regarding the bikes and what's faster (Lap times), Once again I agree... The bikes that are easier to ride, with more controllable HP turn quicker lap times. No arguement here from me! Seen it done many times...
The 500 production was stopped because of sales or lack thereof.... Nobody wanted to ride them for the exact reasons you've stated (In the MX crowd)
Many of us weekend desert riders love that kind of arm ripping power, however uncontrollable it may be... There is a niche, just not in MX.
We're not worried about lap times... I'm more concerned that I can make it up a 300' very soft/steep verticle climb, dodging sagebrush all the way with little to no room to get a run at it.. That's where the big machinery shines, instant handfulls of power.
It's fun to watch the thumpers try it, but it gets tiresome waiting for them to find an alternate route because they can't make it.
#18
12-14-2005, 09:11 PM
There will never be a 650EX quad............
granted my current machine is only around 75HP, but I sure could use more! Obstacles are traction!
So, I stand by my original statement that a wimpy little 450 IS NOT PLENTY FOR ALL OF US!
Am I better than the pro's? Guess that depends now doesn't it? Am I highly compensated to make these kinds of statements for the manufacturers? Nope!
Have these guy's ever been on anything with real power? Doubtful!
There may be other motivating factors hidden beneath those statements... besides, I know what works for me far better than these yayhoos.
Guess I don't have 'sheep like' mentality like some folks do... And I certainly wouldn't follow them off the cliff, just because that's what they do.
Handling, suspension, and weight are important factors... Most of all Power to weight ratio!
That's where the big displacement comes in
So, I stand by my original statement that a wimpy little 450 IS NOT PLENTY FOR ALL OF US!
Am I better than the pro's? Guess that depends now doesn't it? Am I highly compensated to make these kinds of statements for the manufacturers? Nope!
Have these guy's ever been on anything with real power? Doubtful!
There may be other motivating factors hidden beneath those statements... besides, I know what works for me far better than these yayhoos.
Guess I don't have 'sheep like' mentality like some folks do... And I certainly wouldn't follow them off the cliff, just because that's what they do.
Handling, suspension, and weight are important factors... Most of all Power to weight ratio!
That's where the big displacement comes in
you know dune, i respect you..you seem like a person that is a true motorsports fanatic and obviously loves power. which is good. and i dont doubt your ability to handle such machines and im not trying to start a pissing match however, according to your statement of what you ride and comparing it to the below list of machines in your inventory, the only ones you can swing a leg over (not counting the sand rail b/c thats a 'dunebuggy' -different category) are the Quadzilla 500- which is claimed to be nearly stock, the lt50, and the 1986 250R and the hybrid LT250/500...did i miss one? Now i know the 250R doesnt make 80-90hp unless you have it SERIOUSLY modded and since the LT500 is claimed to be nearly stock(and looks very nice by the way) - how can you be riding and swinging a leg over 80+ HP machines or even the 75HP machine you claim to be riding now? did i miss something b/c last i checked and i grew up during the quad revolution in the 80's so i'm not some 14yr old that doesnt know his @ss from a hole in the ground- A stock or nearly stock Quadzilla, as much as i love them, do not put out 75HP....unless yours isnt stock and that is what you tell people when you race them....
heres your list in the bio wich kinda matches your sig:
Mom - 1986 Honda TRX250R Bought new in '86
Dad - 1987 Suzuki LT500RH 2nd owner Bought in '91
Owen - 1984 Suzuki LT50 restoring from the cob-webs
V-8 Chevy 4-seater long travel sandrail from The Sandman Offroad... Soon to be LS-1 powered
Building Hybrid '85 LT250/500.... Finish date TBA
Dad - 1987 Suzuki LT500RH 2nd owner Bought in '91
Owen - 1984 Suzuki LT50 restoring from the cob-webs
V-8 Chevy 4-seater long travel sandrail from The Sandman Offroad... Soon to be LS-1 powered
Building Hybrid '85 LT250/500.... Finish date TBA
#20
12-15-2005, 09:22 AM
There will never be a 650EX quad............
Originally posted by: Duneaddict
I would bet a cold beverage of your choice that none of your 'moto-boyz' have ever swung a leg over a 80+HP quad in their life... That's to what I was referring to with my statement.
I'll agree that we haven't exactly been speaking of common ground here.. (Me quads, you bikes)
Regarding the bikes and what's faster (Lap times), Once again I agree... The bikes that are easier to ride, with more controllable HP turn quicker lap times. No arguement here from me! Seen it done many times...
The 500 production was stopped because of sales or lack thereof.... Nobody wanted to ride them for the exact reasons you've stated (In the MX crowd)
Many of us weekend desert riders love that kind of arm ripping power, however uncontrollable it may be... There is a niche, just not in MX.
We're not worried about lap times... I'm more concerned that I can make it up a 300' very soft/steep verticle climb, dodging sagebrush all the way with little to no room to get a run at it.. That's where the big machinery shines, instant handfulls of power.
It's fun to watch the thumpers try it, but it gets tiresome waiting for them to find an alternate route because they can't make it.
I would bet a cold beverage of your choice that none of your 'moto-boyz' have ever swung a leg over a 80+HP quad in their life... That's to what I was referring to with my statement.
I'll agree that we haven't exactly been speaking of common ground here.. (Me quads, you bikes)
Regarding the bikes and what's faster (Lap times), Once again I agree... The bikes that are easier to ride, with more controllable HP turn quicker lap times. No arguement here from me! Seen it done many times...
The 500 production was stopped because of sales or lack thereof.... Nobody wanted to ride them for the exact reasons you've stated (In the MX crowd)
Many of us weekend desert riders love that kind of arm ripping power, however uncontrollable it may be... There is a niche, just not in MX.
We're not worried about lap times... I'm more concerned that I can make it up a 300' very soft/steep verticle climb, dodging sagebrush all the way with little to no room to get a run at it.. That's where the big machinery shines, instant handfulls of power.
It's fun to watch the thumpers try it, but it gets tiresome waiting for them to find an alternate route because they can't make it.
LOL, so basically we agree on about everything, and I think both of us just wanted discussion over the sport we love and enjoy![img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
I would want the big-bore thumpers or 2-stroke quads myself if I was in the open desert or dunes, but I ride mostly in wooded terrain trails or MX tracks so a great abundance of power is not necessary.