Baja 250.....another Honda 450R Sweep!
#11
All the factories pick and choose what fight to enter. It would make no sence for Yamaha and KTM to pick a fight with Honda over domination at Baja. Honda just has too much at stake here and they have nearly unlimited budgets compared to others. My link to Dist 37 results clearly proves that Yamaha and KTM dominate southern Calif desert racing where the huge majority of riders from beginner to pro are on Yamaha and KTM. Yamaha and KTM have earned this overwelming support by a combination of performance and reliability unmatched by Honda. Actually a large portion of Honda entries are still on the old school but rock solid XR650R and XR400. Without these privateer Honda racers on old equipment Honda would look much worse.
I am absolutely a believer in nearly everything Honda does. Besides the dirt rides in my profile I also own a couple Honda road motorcycles. But facts must remain facts and we need to admit when Honda products don't quite measure up to the competition. Forum members run risk of loosing credibility or even worse we run risk of steering forum members into the wrong direction for their particular needs.
Honda is good but they are not always the best at everything. Why can't we admit this simple fact?
I am absolutely a believer in nearly everything Honda does. Besides the dirt rides in my profile I also own a couple Honda road motorcycles. But facts must remain facts and we need to admit when Honda products don't quite measure up to the competition. Forum members run risk of loosing credibility or even worse we run risk of steering forum members into the wrong direction for their particular needs.
Honda is good but they are not always the best at everything. Why can't we admit this simple fact?
#12
Originally posted by: oldturtle
Honda is good but they are not always the best at everything. Why can't we admit this simple fact?
Honda is good but they are not always the best at everything. Why can't we admit this simple fact?
#13
Hondas motorcycle domination of Baja started right after Kawasaki quit going to Mexico to race. It was the year after Danny Hamel was killed during one of the races down there.
#14
Obviously the free market is at work here, no matter what excuses the Honda detractors try to come up with.........
If there were a better desert race quad than the 450R, wouldn't all the freelancers be riding it???? Why not, then they would have a better chance of winning.......wouldn't they..........but nobody does because that machine doesn't exist!!!
And, a bunch of rag tag D37 weekend warriors isn't exactly the same thing as long distance endurance racing, is it........
If there were a better desert race quad than the 450R, wouldn't all the freelancers be riding it???? Why not, then they would have a better chance of winning.......wouldn't they..........but nobody does because that machine doesn't exist!!!
And, a bunch of rag tag D37 weekend warriors isn't exactly the same thing as long distance endurance racing, is it........
#16
motox. Honda's first high performance racing 4 stroke, the 450R motorcycle, was rushed into production and had huge reliability problems. They started out several years behind Yamaha and KTM as evidenced by the big surprise when Doug Henry was first to win an AMA National motocross series on a 4 stroke, a 400cc Yamaha. KTM was also way ahead of Honda in 4 stroke development. Honda has been playing catchup to the other factories ever since. The first Honda 250R 4 stroke was also a high maintenance motor and we are beginning to see the same poor results with the Honda 150R motor. I do believe the latest Honda TRX450R motors are an improvement over the first rushed into production motorcycle motors. I am glad to know your ride has been reliable and I suppose your deligent wrenching has a lot to do with reliability.
Recon. The big attraction to 450R motors in Baja for privateers is very simply because Honda provides huge pit support for any Tom, Dick, or Harry riding a Honda. For all Honda's the privateer pit crew doesn't even need to get to the gas checks because Honda will provide all services, gas, tires, parts, goggles, whatever is needed for a price....I will admit that there is a big difference between Baja racing and the Dist 37 rag tag amatures. AMA Dist 37 and 38 in Southern Calif and all the other amature desert racing scenes is much better indicator of what brands really dominate than a three race series with relatively few riders and only one serious factory sponser....To then reach out and claim that Honda absolutely dominates desert racing is quite a stretch all right....One more thing; Baja racing and desert racing are not the same animal. Desert racing is a race of usually not over 100 miles and the huge majority of participants are amatures and familys trying to get a break from the regular 40 hour job and enjoy the weekend without going broke. These are the guys on Yamahas and KTMs.
Recon. The big attraction to 450R motors in Baja for privateers is very simply because Honda provides huge pit support for any Tom, Dick, or Harry riding a Honda. For all Honda's the privateer pit crew doesn't even need to get to the gas checks because Honda will provide all services, gas, tires, parts, goggles, whatever is needed for a price....I will admit that there is a big difference between Baja racing and the Dist 37 rag tag amatures. AMA Dist 37 and 38 in Southern Calif and all the other amature desert racing scenes is much better indicator of what brands really dominate than a three race series with relatively few riders and only one serious factory sponser....To then reach out and claim that Honda absolutely dominates desert racing is quite a stretch all right....One more thing; Baja racing and desert racing are not the same animal. Desert racing is a race of usually not over 100 miles and the huge majority of participants are amatures and familys trying to get a break from the regular 40 hour job and enjoy the weekend without going broke. These are the guys on Yamahas and KTMs.
#17
Originally posted by: oldturtle
Honda has been playing catchup to the other factories ever since. .
Honda has been playing catchup to the other factories ever since. .
I do agree that the first years were "iffy" on the valve life, but as of the '04 and definately the '05 models they are on par with the rest in reliability. The Yammi's have always gotten great valve life, and they deserve the reliable tag they get (for a modern 4-stroke), but now a days they will where out just as quick as any of the Big 5 brands if neglected.
As for the 250f, I'm not going to argue to much because 250f's are ticking time bombs anyways. I know the '04's (first year) were short on valve life as well. '05's were better and now they are about the same as the rest.
And the 150f, I don't have any experience with that, but I know they're never going to make one of those that aren't a grenade with the pin pulled. That's just to many RPM's for all those moving parts!
BTW, glad to see you know your history with Doug Henry and such.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img][img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
#18
Originally posted by: motox26
Actually.......in the Baja type races, they are closer to stock than you think.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Originally posted by: Scooter86 Bottomline though, the quads winning these events are set up vastly different than the one in your garage for the most part.
#19
None of these race bikes have anything done to them that the average guy can't do to his every day ride or privateer race machine, if one cares to lay out the $$$$. Anyone can ride the same quad the racers do, and that is whole point of the aftermarket industry, isn't it!
#20
Hey reconranger-thanks for the info on the filters. Got a question for ya. Got to ride last weekend and sort out some carb fine tuning issues but noticed that the transmission shifts hard. For some reason, upshifting through the gears was really difficult, like a synchronizer issue(if I had to describe the symptom), but more like a thin trans. fluid issue. I bought my '05 new as a leftover model in december. Maybe put only 16-17 hours on it so far. Changed the engine oil and filter after9,10 hrs. and judging by the condition of the oil(black, but not shiny), went ahead and changed the trans. oil shortly thereafter. The trans. oil was slightly shiny(very fine metallic) but I assumed it could be just from breaking in all the new trans. components could be the culprit of the shiny oil. I told my dealer that I wanted the best oil and trans fluid I could get for it. He gave me the gn4 and the 80w85 honda hi-perf trans fluid(side note: It does not have the thickness of a true 80weight oil). Thinking that new trans fluid would at least improve shift feel, it did not. Money is not an issue to me when it comes to the "life blood" for the engine and trans. Any help is greatly appreciated.
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