<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: BigC
If I can ask,</end quote></div>
Sure, it doesn't seem like you are trying to hijack this thread...
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote> what is the cost for something like that?</end quote></div>
For doing the cylinder work, new piston and rings (depending on the machine shop cost) is around $300 if you do the non-machine work yourself. Valves or other work just drives the cost up. Bearings, camshaft, or otherwise -- uhh, I dunno if it is even affordable for an old atv.
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Mine 450 foreman stalled too? Was low on oil, there was a little rattle then it lost power and stalled. It turns over fine, has spark, seems to get fuel but won't catch and start up?</end quote></div>
Check the compression, and that will tell you.
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Does the machine on this post start up and is very noisy or will it not start either?</end quote></div>
After it ran out, we tried to start it with new oil and it was real noisy, then suddenly it made the sound of losing compression - turning over with no resistance.
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>How much oil should show up on the little dip stick?</end quote></div>
Check the manual, but on this one, it should be between the marks.

If you decide it is not worth fixing, tell me where you are, because I might be interested in parts!

 

I've had a rash of the 450's that ran out of oil. All have required piston, rings, rocker arms and shafts, and oil pump. The bottom ends have fended well with only a few needing bearing replacement. Other items found harmed under no oil condition has been cam chain streatched, valve heads resessed and cylinder sleeve loose, cam decompressors bad and fried clutch discs
Another note is that cranking compression on these quads will only pump 70PSI as the decompressor is relieving compression when turned over with the starter.

----- Gimpster -----




Best to do a total tear down and inspect all bearings and gears.
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: HardwareMonkey

My son has a Foreman 450ES that ran out of oil. I have done a fair amount of tinkering with my Polaris, including reassembling the 2-stroke after having it machined. So, I am competent, but not real savvy. And I know little about the Honda, but my son has a Clymer book.



When it ran out of oil, it started pinging real loud and was shut down immediately. Opening the oil filler indicated no oil, and some smoke came out. After oil was put it, it sounded real tight at first (and noisey), then it turned easily. I don't have a compression gauge that fits this atv, but it does not have enough pressure to move my finger.



Here's my question: what all should I expect to replace? Should I start by just tearing apart the head, or should I assume the worst and deal with top and bottom of engine? Which is easier: pulling the entire engine or working with it on the atv?



THANKS!!</end quote></div>

 

<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Originally posted by: Gimpster
I've had a rash of the 450's that ran out of oil.
</end quote></div>
Strange, that this is actually common!
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote> All have required piston, rings, rocker arms and shafts, and oil pump.</end quote></div>
Did you purchase parts through the local machine shop, or where? Know how much?
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>The bottom ends have fended well with only a few needing bearing replacement.</end quote></div>
Good to know
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote>Other items found harmed under no oil condition has been cam chain streatched, valve heads resessed and cylinder sleeve loose, cam decompressors bad and fried clutch discs</end quote></div>
Those are quite strange. I never would have guessed about the cam chain, or clutch disc. Not sure what the decompressor actually is either... but I'll find it in the book.
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote> Another note is that cranking compression on these quads will only pump 70PSI as the decompressor is relieving compression when turned over with the starter.</end quote></div>
Good to know. And I think this points me toward the decompressor. The way the compression suddenly went out when trying to start after oil los makes me think it really threw a ring or the decompressor.
<div class="FTQUOTE"><begin quote> Best to do a total tear down and inspect all bearings and gears.</end quote></div>
So you recommend taking the complete engine out from the very start. Sounds like you have had the most experience with this, so regrettably, I think I will take your advice.

 

You could say I worked on a few Hondas. Was with Honda dealers since '86. Opened my own shop last May. Had aquired the highest honors Honda hands it's techs which is Red Level status. My supporting status icon for this site under my user name disappeared shortly after I walked out on Honda. HMMM...
I buy and install only Honda parts during overhauls, from a dealer I worked for around 15 years ago.
Depending on how hot the quad got will determine if valves streatched or the cam chain.
Consumers running them out of oil does happen as these quads are very dependable and many neglect checking their oil.
On anohter note, 450 decompressors are part ot the cam assembly, don't see issues with them like on rincons and rubicons.
The reason I suggest pulling the engine is to completely check the bottom end for debris. Disassemble the oil pump and check rotors for scoring also.
Better safe than sorry !

----- Gimpster -----

 

So on min, is it possible that even though it sounds fine when it cranks to start, that something serious is wrong? Also, if it doesn't "burn" a lot of oil, how fast doe sthe oil level drop? It was changed last spring, whould it be extremely low by now?

What would cause it to not strat up? How much compression should it have? Is it possible that adjusting the valves would do it? If I check the oil and it has not debris what then? It has me pretty stumped. I am no expert and definitely not the best and diagnosing things but can change out parts prety easily. I trully appreciate all your help.


C