What is your problem man? Relax...

I can understand your concern for the first year having problems, being a Polaris owner and all. Unfortunately American motor vehicle manufacturers have a reputation for not having done all their homework on engineering and releasing a product to be tested by the public that is not quite ready yet....

Fortunately Honda does not have this reputation on their ATV's, cars, generators, motorcycles, lawnmowers, outboard engines, or anything else they build... They are one of those rare companies that prides themselves on making some of the best, most durable, well engineered products in the marketplace, not to say they are perfect, but on average, do much better than the others.

Polaris does not enjoy such a reputation. The reason for their success stems from their belt driven tranny, while not very elegant, it is very enticing to people who are intimidated by shifting, or just plain want an easy ride. Their low price points in the past, also helped to establish them, as well as being able to say "American Made" (which has a lot of pull with some folks) even though they use Fuji engines...

I am not a Polaris hater, I just choose to embrace reality. We have owned a Sport 400L in the past, and am currently looking for one for the wife, just for the CVT tranny, not that it is better by any means, just she needs a bike that is very easy to ride to have a little fun on and follow me around....

As for all the "this manufacturer copied that", give it a break, cases could be made for all sides from here to eternity...

 

Hey, settle down here cowboys! LOL. Let me just add my two cents for what its worth. About the liquid cooling thing, Honda had liquid cooling way back in 1985 on their 250Rs. Why? because it needed it. As for the rest of their 4 stroke utility quads, they only needed to add oil assist because its lighter and smaller than a liquid system. Now that a big bore with an auto tranny (rubicon) is coming out, Honda must have felt that liquid was the only way to go. (bigger motor=more heat) BTW, I have been on trails where a liquid cooled machine would overheat and an air cooled oil assist quad wouldn't so liquid does NOT always mean better. Does having liquid cooling mean longer engine life? I don't know, I had an 85 Honda 250 utility machine that we beat the crap out of for 9 years and never had one single problem with it. It also had drum brakes which never failed me and I could lock them up on tar.(I really had to push hard though!) Never one time did the brakes ever not work and we never touched them. I now drive a TrailBlazer and I have had to mess with the brakes on several occasions. Again, its not that one system is superior to the other, they both have their goods and bads. The biggest difference is that driving a Honda utility machine, I hardly ever need to even use the brakes. As soon as you let off the throttle, you are slowing down. On an auto tranny TrailBlazer, with no EBS, I always have to use the brakes. Of course on Hondas sport machines, they went with disk brakes because of the increase in speed and the need for stopping on a dime. So my point is, Honda takes the approach of reliability where less is more. Where Polaris usually takes the approach of more is more. With the more is more approach, you get more weight, more maintinence and more bells and whistles. with Hondas approach, you get less weight, less maintinence and less bells and whistles. again I will say that no approach is better, they are just different. It depends on what you want. I am just getting sick of the arguments about how my quad is better than yours! If you like your quad then thats all that matters. Honda has been working on their Hondamatic tranny since 1962, If it wasn't for Polaris introducing their auto trannys, I doubt Honda would have been putting the Hondamatic into one of its atvs. Competition is good for all of us. We (the consumer) are always the winners because of it. exept for the increase in price of course. Now stop arguing and go ride!

 

Its funny really, alot of the reasons I bought a Honda seem to be the very things that most people use in their argument against them. I.E. no liquid cooling, shiftable transmission, and yes even the sealed drum brakes and limited slip differential. I've allways been of the opinion, that reliability and proven engineering are more important than "bells and whistles". To each his own.

 

here is a list of just a fraction of some of the older honda products that I have owned with zero trouble:
1. 81' Honda civic 455,000 miles- just clutches and brakes oh, and a fuel pump
2.83' EM 500 generator-countless hours powering our fith wheel up hunting
4. 83' XR500R First year for the RFVC (400EX type) engine-not one problem with almost 16 years of beating
5. 85' ATC110- seriouly the most durable engine found, only problem with it was when my friend broke the frame in half on a 10 foot jump
6. 1979 Honda 6HP 4 stroke outboard- runs like a champ
7. Fathers old 1966 Z50- probley more miles than the civic, but still runs great even with 2 inches rust in the tank

Now to Polaris, I love them- super fun but I always have to change the plug on my friends Express 400 when the going gets slow, give the company time-honda has had 50 years (although the first hondas where bulletproof) hmm, well anyway I like all rides

 

There are "lemons" involved with everything, I don't dispute that. I simply stated that the Hondamatic would be perfect. Perfect may have been a strong word to use, so let me rephrase for your liking. "The Hondamatic will be 400 times better than any current auto tranny on ATV's. And I'd bet money that's it been tested very thoroughly. I'd also bet that this has been in thr works for a few years. So it isn't something they just threw together in 3 months to use on a production ATV so people could sit in a chat room and argue on how good it will or won't do. Let's just wait until it comes out, there is no sense in arguing about it now.

I'd rather argue after tests proove that it's better than everything else

 

I CALLED HONDA @ 1-310-532-9811 AND ALL THEY WOULD SAY IS THE NEW RUBICON FOREMAN IS THE ONLY ONE THAT WIIL GET THE NEW DIFF. HE SAID THAT THE 450 WAS DESIGNED FOR IT'S PURPOSE AND MAY NOT GET UPGRADED WITH THE SURE-TRAC IN THE 2001 MODEL. AS FAR AS I CAN TELL THERE IS ONLY HOPE AND SPECULATION ON THE 450'S FUTURE ALSO. IT MAY BE DISCONTINUED IN A COUPLE OF YEARS AND MAY STAY THE SAME UNTIL THEN. THE 300 IS GONE THE 400 GOES AWAY NEXT YEAR, PROBABLY THR 450 WILL GO A YEAR OR TWO BEHIND THAT. I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE A 450 WITH THE NEW DIFF. AND THOUGHT MAYBE IT COULD BE ADDED TO THE OLD MODEL. THE GUY ON THE PHONE AT HONDA WAS NOT SURE IT COULD BE DONE DUE TO THE SHAFT SET-UP ETC. MAYBE IT CAN, MAYBE IT CAN'T. JUST GET A LOCKER AND BE DONE WITH IT!

 

[red]JABRONI!!!!![/red]

 

I love a debate. He is a fact. First ATV (defined as it is by this web group) HONDA.

Now, who is copying who????
Relax guys, it's a ATV, not a communist takeover.
The Rubicon WILL have a problem or two when it comes out. The Rancher did when it came out. I feel confident that Honda will fix these problems. As for the sifting problems with the ES, they fixed the battery problem. The Rancher has the new ES and it doesn't suffer from any cold weather problems. The Foreman's ES did not have a significant number of failures to recall them.

Somebody called Honda a motorcycle company and Yamaha a piano company. Guess what, Polaris is a jet ski company and a snow mobile company. That means nothing.

Now for copying, it's called evolution. Look at AWD in cars, they really didn't exist fully until they were reliable, now almost all car manufacturers make some form of it. Polaris tried to shave cost by going to chain and 2 stroke, now they are looking at reliability.

Evolution...........

Just ride guys.

If you really want trouble free transportation, get off and walk.

 

The new Rubicon has the competition sweating. It will have the best auto transmission in the business, once the minor kinks get worked out. It should have very good power with it being a 4 valve engine instead of 2.

 

If I am understanding this tranny right Will this be basically the same thing found in a skidsteer loader, if so it will be bullet proof, light weight, and very practical. This new quad sounds great to me.