I don't think Honda people like my opinions lol. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

Some of you people are so hung up on Honda reliability it's sad. Sorry, but maybe Honda is a little more reliable but the fact is that pretty much anything on the market will last a long time and be very reliable. Even if Honda is a little more reliable they still are the class losers in every ATV category. They use dated technology like drum brakes, no front lockers, non-adjustable shocks, air cooling on all of their sport quads, etc, etc, etc.... Sorry, but that's not for me.

Granted ALL makes (including Honda) have models that have issues. The competition is walking all over Honda and the only thing that keeps Honda going is the blind brand loyalty. I can't think of one Honda machine that is better than the competition.

Sooner or later Honda needs to wake up and realize they are at the bottom of the ATV food chain.

 

It might be that Honda is so far advanced that they are about to lap every thing else that is why you think they are behind. For instance 2003 dirt bike forecast, Suzuki 24,877 units. HONDA 122,454 units. Now who is behind?

 

the 400EX and the Rincon are Honda's flagships right now, yes...

are they the fastest in their catagory? No

is speed the ONLY quality that determines what makes one quad better than another? NO

the 400EX handles better and is lighter than ANY of the other sport quads in my opinion, (better sliding rear tires, and no screwy swing-arm geometry like the Z... and better seat/tank ergonomics and much lighter than the Predator)
AND... it is undisputedly more dependable / reliable than ANY of the other sport quads...
in my opinion it's much easier and cheaper to make a quad more powerful than it is to make it better handling....
and there is NO way to make a quad more dependable / reliable
so in my way of thinking..... the 400EX is STILL the best sport quad

NOW... onto the Rincon.... not the fastest, BUT it is the only quad with a REAL transmission.... and is handles better, has more ground clearance with the IRS (perhaps the single most important quality of a 4x4), and is more dependable than the Prairie 650...

you must ask yourself.... was it just coincidence that the Rincon won Baja this year? why do 400EX's still continue to be the quad of choice for MX and XC racing???

How can anyone say that Honda is falling behind...... just because their flagship quads are not the fastest in the market???
there is always someone faster.....

 

I agree with HARW. -I believe that the other companies are playing "catch up" and just when they do. Honda will come out with something new for them to copy. WHERE WERE THE SUZUKI SPORT QUADS FOR YEARS? Then when they do come out with something, they copy from HONDA. The last Suzuki Quadracer was made in 1992. The only "Quadsport" Suzuki had for years was the 80. (only quadrunners & kingquad) Kawasaki has been making the Mojave 250 since 1987 and the Lakota since 1995. They couldn't even give them different plastic. Now Kawasaki has a copy of the Z400 and a heavy, automatic, shaft driven "700 sport quad". Arctic Cat is going to have a sport quad but it is also a copy of the Z400. Yamaha has at least had "sport quads". But the Raptor has just come out in (I think) 2001. The Warrior and Banshee came out in 1987 and the Blaster in 1988. Haven't they been milking out those 3 for a little while? They are supposed to come out with a Raptor 400 (rumor?) which will be good as long as they don't just give us another "Z" copy. But will the Raptor line be all we will see for another 13 years like before? Cannondale didn't last long making the more expensive and faster quads did they? I liked the Cannondales but they screwed up. Now the Bom's are looking to get out of the quad business. Honda made the 300EX in 1993 and that is the oldest of their sport quad line up. The 400ex came out in 1999. (4 years old?) and their beginner 250EX just came out in 2001. Just because a couple quads just recently came out that go a little faster than the 400EX doesn't mean Honda is falling behind. It means that other quads are just now CATCHING UP. Then when Honda comes out with something new it will start all over again. Then the other companies will get a couple of the new Honda quads to examine and copy. Before I came to this forum I liked Honda, but I would buy whatever was best for me at the best price. All of the negative comments I hear about Honda is making me "brand loyal". Most of the time the comments and arguments against Honda are about as strong as a POPCORN FART. 400EX's are still winning races! What happened to Yokley and his "reliable" Suzuki? DNF.

 

Harw, we are not talking dirtbikes here so what's your point.

DSAPP, speed isn't the only factor Honda is behiond on. The 400ex has no reverse and is air cooled also. Try adding those 2 features to your 400ex. Besides, the Z-400 reportedly handles as well, is faster, liquid cooled and has reverse plus the smmothest tranny I have ever seen. The 400ex is behind in a LOT of ways. The Rincon has no low range, no locker, non-adjustable front suspension (if i remember correctly), only 3 speeds, no low range and drum brakes of all things. Now tell me how the Rincon iseve close to the competition. It is seriously lacking in major areas. Oh, it's slow too but that's not the point.

Coyotechaser, I can't imagine how you think other brands are trying to catch up to Honda - they have all far EXCEEDED Honda in the last few years.

Sure, in 1999 when the 400ex came out it was much better than the competition but that was 4 years ago. The Raptor, DS650, C-Dales, Polaris Predator and V-Force 700 are all new and much improved over the old school 400ex. Yes, the 400ex is still winning races and so is the old 250R but that's because they were good for their day and a lot of people have them. MX and GNCC racing is only a very small percentage of quad sales and quad usage. I do agree with you that Yamaha's sport quads have ben arounf for a long time but Ymaha does have the Raptor and don't for get Yamaha is the only major company that had the guts to continue to produce a high performance 2 stroke all this time. Go to the dunes and you will see mostly Banshees. The Banshee is to duning what the 250R or 400ex is to MX.

Nobody is saying that Honda produnces bad quads but come on, there is no way that a person can justify their reasoning that Honda is not behind the times. They are - way, way behind the times and have been surpassed by every other major manufacturer in both sport and utility categories. I've had plenty of Honda products and they were all good but I wouldn't buy a Honda quad right now.

 

Honda sells machines. They outsell every other manafacturer. What more would a business want??? To please you yammie, polarie, suzuki...guys??? No, they only want to make money, which they are doing very well, end of story. They have a market niche that the other manafactureres would kill for but can't attain with all the lockers, belts or disk brakes money can buy!!!

 

As far as im concerned the rincon is the most technology advanced atv on the market. And the new rancher at. what other quad has a gps on it. The rubicon revolutionized the atv world with the hondamatic transmision. Honda will always be the quad that sits in my garage . And as far as reliability goes I have a 97 300 4x4 thats been to hell and back about 25 times and has only an oil change and tune up since I bought it in 97. Now im working on my 2003 300ex. I started to want to trade it off because off lack of performance against the big-bore qauds. I then realized its just a 300 what can i expect. For a 300 it will haul as%. Its fast enough that is threw me the first time i rode it but i got used to the power. It is vertualy the best all around quad you can own and definatley the trail quad I have owned. Just my $0.02 cents. But they do new to make a new hi-po sport quad quick. There lagging in that department. BUt as far as utility quads all hail honda.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

 

Perhaps one of the reasons my honda 300 is behind the times is because it is the only quad in our group of about 35 that is 12 years old and still running like a top....well except for a couple of other hondas in the group...none of the others last long enough to get behind the times....face it, reliability IS a "feature" of a quad and is an important factor to some consumers......i wish my honda would perform like some of the other brands out there...but i also will be keeping my quad for as many years as possible....and gambling on another brand when the best chance for longevity is honda, would be foolish....reliability is an incentive to buy...why would someone call me stupid for wanting reliability!!!!....i really don't care if a 4x4 can do 60 mph...if you wanna go 60, then you won't be doing it on terrain that requires a 4x4....a locker is a different story...yeah i wish my honda had that....but for the rare times that i could have used one, it's not worth the tradeoff for reliability....besides if you don't like honda, don't buy one...what do you care if i have one or not...why are all you other brandowners begging honda to produce a quad with a locker, or disk brakes, or 2 cylinders....other manufactures already do that so go buy them....what do you care if honda makes one or not....my guess is because you know that if honda makes one with the features of other brands you will buy it because of hondas reputation for reliability....can't see any other reason why you would care what the heck honda makes.

 

I am more concerned with quality than quantity. I would much rather have a hot intelligent woman than a hooker or a dumb fat chick. Honda is kinda the old guy of the business and the rest of the companies remind me of hotshot kids trying to prove themselves by out doing each other. Honda has always been a minimalist manufacturer in EVERYTHING they make and they don't play that game. Honda is about refinement and design. They generally make things as simple as possible but they work great. I drive an Honda civic and it is underpowered with no options but it has excellent fit and finish and the reliablity of the engineering is second to none. People that don't like Honda just don't get it.....plain and simple. They are not about the newest, fastest, and fanciest. Every piece of Honda equipment I buy also buys me peace of mind and that is worth much more in my books.