Pistol Purchase any input? Glock/ S&W/ Berretta
#42
Didn't read all the posts in between
I use a Glock 19 with 17 rd mags and I've won several awards with it and put 1000's of rounds thru it with zero problems. (oh and I put a vice on the sight to move it over a bit)
The only mod I did was to stick some hogue rubber over the grip to help it not float in my hand so much when I was sweating bad. If you have a large or X-large glove size I highly reccomend the Hogue rubber slide on grip.
I use a Glock 19 with 17 rd mags and I've won several awards with it and put 1000's of rounds thru it with zero problems. (oh and I put a vice on the sight to move it over a bit)
The only mod I did was to stick some hogue rubber over the grip to help it not float in my hand so much when I was sweating bad. If you have a large or X-large glove size I highly reccomend the Hogue rubber slide on grip.
#43
There are several good 9mm pistols out there. The ones you names are on the list although each has it strong and weak points.
The Glock is simple and reliable. Easy to take apart and parts are plentiful to make it look and shoot like you want. Mags are cheap although the drop free mags often don't and that is a real issue with me. Downside is it will not shoot lead bullets because of the polygonal barrel. May be an issue if you reload but not if you always shoot jacketed bullets. Also, it doesn't have a fully supported chamber so super hot loads may cause problems. Probably not with the 9mm but the 40 cals have such a reputation of blowing up. Changing the barrel to one with traditional rifling and a fully supported chamber will solve these problems. I hat the Glock grip angle although a grip reduction does wonders. But it makes the gun illegal to shoot in IDPA-SSP or in USPSA- Production class.
S&W M&P appears to be a slick setup but it is too new to tell about durability. There are reports already of some parts breakage and that S&W will not sell parts to individuals, even if armorors. You have to send the gun back in to them so count on being without it for a while .
The Beretta PX4 is in a similar boat. It has been out a bit longer but not real popular so a durability record really hasn't been established. Finding parts may be a problem. I have never been a big Beretta fan although most of my experience has been with the 92 series and the FP1201 shotgun.
I have had excellent service from SIG pistols. In 17 years of shooting them, I have only replaced springs. No parts have broken or worn out. Accuracy will generally be above the pistols you mentioned or most other factory guns out there. But for most shooters, whether it shoots 1.5 inch groups or 4 inch groups at 25 yards isn't an issue. Nor is it that important for most self defense situations.
For an out of the box type pistol, probably only the HK will compare to the SIG for quality, reliability, and accuracy. And they cost more than SIGs. The downside to a SIG is if you are a lefty. The controls are really placed wrong for lefties.
When in LE, I could carry a Glock, Beretta, S&W, SIG, or HK. I tested them all and the SIG beat them all on ergonomics and accuracy. Granted this was before the PX4 or M&P.
Glocks had issues with less than perfect ammo sticking in the chamber and with extractors chipping. They also had that weird feeling grip shape that made them point high. They were bad about having light striker hits when dirty too. But that is somewhat an issue with all striker fired pistols.
Berettas had too long of a trigger pull and too many sharp edges. We were always getting cut up or pinched with that open slide of the 92.
S&W wouldn't work with the mag out and Dept policy wouldn't allow changing that. They were also hated by the dept armorers because of all the small pieces inside. Most problems with them was found to be magazines.
HK were too bulky and had crappy (stock) triggers (USP). The decock/safety was placed and shaped to interfere with a comfortable grip. The squeeze cockers were not only big $$$$$ but got so hot after a lot of shooting, you couldn't hold on to them. They were also finicky and the gas system would gag if dirty ammo was shot from them. Fiocchi was almost a guarateed jam in the P7 even though it worked fine in the other guns.
Two other guns to consider are the Kahr and the Springfield XD.
I own 2 Kahr 9mm and they feed and shoot any 9mm ammo I have run through them. Even my super hot 9mm loads for my Open class gun. Very accurate and easy to shoot for such tiny guns. They have become my CCW guns, replacing my Browning Hi Power and my SIG P220- 45.
The XD is what the Glock could be if they put a decent grip angle and shape on it. And if they adapted a trigger that was shaped and felt like a trigger. I like the XD because it is reliable, has acceptable accuracy, great ergonomics, and the magazines will actually drop free.
Still, if you are set on one of the three guns you mentioned, in spite of my semi-bashing, I would take the Glock 19. Even with it's quirks, it is still one of the better guns for it's size and purpose.
The Glock is simple and reliable. Easy to take apart and parts are plentiful to make it look and shoot like you want. Mags are cheap although the drop free mags often don't and that is a real issue with me. Downside is it will not shoot lead bullets because of the polygonal barrel. May be an issue if you reload but not if you always shoot jacketed bullets. Also, it doesn't have a fully supported chamber so super hot loads may cause problems. Probably not with the 9mm but the 40 cals have such a reputation of blowing up. Changing the barrel to one with traditional rifling and a fully supported chamber will solve these problems. I hat the Glock grip angle although a grip reduction does wonders. But it makes the gun illegal to shoot in IDPA-SSP or in USPSA- Production class.
S&W M&P appears to be a slick setup but it is too new to tell about durability. There are reports already of some parts breakage and that S&W will not sell parts to individuals, even if armorors. You have to send the gun back in to them so count on being without it for a while .
The Beretta PX4 is in a similar boat. It has been out a bit longer but not real popular so a durability record really hasn't been established. Finding parts may be a problem. I have never been a big Beretta fan although most of my experience has been with the 92 series and the FP1201 shotgun.
I have had excellent service from SIG pistols. In 17 years of shooting them, I have only replaced springs. No parts have broken or worn out. Accuracy will generally be above the pistols you mentioned or most other factory guns out there. But for most shooters, whether it shoots 1.5 inch groups or 4 inch groups at 25 yards isn't an issue. Nor is it that important for most self defense situations.
For an out of the box type pistol, probably only the HK will compare to the SIG for quality, reliability, and accuracy. And they cost more than SIGs. The downside to a SIG is if you are a lefty. The controls are really placed wrong for lefties.
When in LE, I could carry a Glock, Beretta, S&W, SIG, or HK. I tested them all and the SIG beat them all on ergonomics and accuracy. Granted this was before the PX4 or M&P.
Glocks had issues with less than perfect ammo sticking in the chamber and with extractors chipping. They also had that weird feeling grip shape that made them point high. They were bad about having light striker hits when dirty too. But that is somewhat an issue with all striker fired pistols.
Berettas had too long of a trigger pull and too many sharp edges. We were always getting cut up or pinched with that open slide of the 92.
S&W wouldn't work with the mag out and Dept policy wouldn't allow changing that. They were also hated by the dept armorers because of all the small pieces inside. Most problems with them was found to be magazines.
HK were too bulky and had crappy (stock) triggers (USP). The decock/safety was placed and shaped to interfere with a comfortable grip. The squeeze cockers were not only big $$$$$ but got so hot after a lot of shooting, you couldn't hold on to them. They were also finicky and the gas system would gag if dirty ammo was shot from them. Fiocchi was almost a guarateed jam in the P7 even though it worked fine in the other guns.
Two other guns to consider are the Kahr and the Springfield XD.
I own 2 Kahr 9mm and they feed and shoot any 9mm ammo I have run through them. Even my super hot 9mm loads for my Open class gun. Very accurate and easy to shoot for such tiny guns. They have become my CCW guns, replacing my Browning Hi Power and my SIG P220- 45.
The XD is what the Glock could be if they put a decent grip angle and shape on it. And if they adapted a trigger that was shaped and felt like a trigger. I like the XD because it is reliable, has acceptable accuracy, great ergonomics, and the magazines will actually drop free.
Still, if you are set on one of the three guns you mentioned, in spite of my semi-bashing, I would take the Glock 19. Even with it's quirks, it is still one of the better guns for it's size and purpose.
#44
You've likely purchased by now, but if not I would strongly recomend considering a Sig. I've owned a number of different handguns and really like the Sig P226 and P229. I friend of mine is in the Navy (SEAL Team 4) and that is their standard side arm. They are able to do some amazing shooting with those handguns and they pump a lot of rounds through them each month.
Good luck,
chad
Good luck,
chad
#45
Yes I have purchased. As mentioned in some previous post I went with the Smith and Wesson M&P 9mm LE. With the LE model you can fire the gun without a mag in it, which is nice. The M&P felt the best out of the 3 pistols in the group, and I am loving it. I have around 350 rounds through it and it has worked flawlessly so far. I probably wont be able to shoot IDPA till September, so I will have lots of time for practice inbetween. The only downside to the M&P is the fact it is so new. It is hard to find accesories for it, but that is quickly changing. I would recomment one to anyone that is looking for a 9mm or 40 caliber.
#46
Magazine safety: One of the most ridiculous "safety" contraptions ever inflicted on handgun shooters. I have never heard a semi-reasonable explanation for them. I have however heard of several instances of people getting themselves killed or injured with them. A couple involved an officer accidentally releasing the mag on his weapon (from holster pressure or whatnot) which rendered the weapon inoperable when it was needed.
Like the grip safety on a 1911, the magazine safety is one of those things I utter despise and have disabled as soon as practical if it can be done safely without adversely affecting the weapon.
Like the grip safety on a 1911, the magazine safety is one of those things I utter despise and have disabled as soon as practical if it can be done safely without adversely affecting the weapon.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)




