You can view all 44 photos. I went with a friend to washington park, NY. He had a griz660 with stock tires and his boy had a scrambler 500.

http://atv.dnsalias.com/atv/index.cg...ec01&pic=6

I bent the front grill in a little when I was the icebreaker in a spot where the ice was 1.5" thick. I got stuck real bad when I got center hung on (pic) 28. The griz660 pulled me out with the winch and then he bravely went in to see if he could make it and stuck too. I got him out by digging the mud down between ruts with my shovel (pic 34). The griz picked up a lot of ice chunks and stored them above the front alxe boots.

I have 28" mudzillas on the prairie and they were awesome almost everywhere. They were tons better than stockers in mud, on tree roots, in snow and in thick ice covered puddles. They handled extremely well, even on pavement. I posted earlier saying they handled bad at high speeds, but they handle very good now that I balanced them (had to add 14oz to one of them). They were not as good on hard ice as stockers. In a mossy flat rock bottom streambed, they really were a lot worse than the stockers.

I never got wet except for my hands and a big chunk of mud flipped me in the eye. My pants were water risistant and I had knee high boots.

 

Great pics....Glad to see you had fun

 

Nyroc,
Thanks for sharing those pictures with us, I appreciate it. I have a few questions though.

1. When you had your stock tires on and raced the Grizzly and Scrambler, what was the result and by how much?
2. In your opinion how much softer is the ride on the Grizzly over the usual bumps?
3. Would you say the 650 handles much more sport like as the magazines have said, and in 3what ways?
4. Did you get hung up in places that the Grizzly did not in terms of ground clearance issues? (stock tires or mudzilla)
5. Now that you guys have been out in all the terrain for many hours what have you guys noticed as the advantages and disadvantes of one quad over the other?

I really appreciate your detailed input on these issues. I have a friend trying to decide between them and I am leaning toward possibly recommending the Grizzly. Sport is not too important for him like it is for me.
Thanks.

 

1. We never raced with my stock tires on. If I were to guess, I would say it would have been just like they say, the Prairie takes it early and stays a bit in front until top speed.
We raced on the snow to see whose tires bit harder in 2x4. The Prairie with the mudzillas launched ahead at first, then as both were spinning, neither one gained any more ground.

2. He did not let me ride the grizzly. I still do not feel this is a drawback on the prairie or an advantage to the grizzly. My ride was great. This was a rough trail.

3. The Prairie is sportier than the Grizzly in that being lower to the ground, it can slide and turn, and may be a little better to jump. The solid axles helps with this too.

4. The 28" mudzillas appeared to make the Praire equal in clearance issues to the grizzly. We both hung about the same. Everywhere bite was a factor, the mudzilla's toasted the stockers on the griz.

5. The biggest things we both noticed are: The Prarie's engine is more reposive, and is much more pleasing on your ears after a long ride. The Prairie's rear brakes are infinitly better than any other quad has. The Prairie's Diff lock is much better than the grizzly if you are still moving. The grizzly diff lock is much better after you get off the quad, you can leave it locked and push with one hand and give it gas with the other. The griz steering effort is much easier and the prairie can make the arms a little tired of yanking on the handlebars. The grizzly did stall from steam but it restarted and was fine, not an issue. The grizzly seems to turn sharper in technical stuff. The grizzly was the loudest of the three. Some people do not like noise. The grizzly shifter sucks a little. The parking break on the griz sucks a little.

The grizzly stores more trail debris as it passes along the trail. That was kinda funny. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img]

We both feel that anybody that tows a utility trailer would rather have a solid axle. Also, people that ride in the water would very much appreciate the Prarie's brake. Any slender person, not very wiry, weak, or toughness challenged would have a hard time with the Prarie's stiff steering. My arms are not sore the day after. I can handle it, but I got a tired arm a couple of times. I have a police officer friend with a sore shoulder that could not ride my quad. I am going to investigate a way to make my steering easier. I think not using the stock rims caused this. The rims I have are wider on the front. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-mad.gif[/img] That is bad for macphersons since the farther you turn, the more your steering has to lift the quad, which is worsened by the wider rims.

I whole heartedly recommend people putting the 28" tire on the quad, just be careful not to get rims that are spaced further out than the stockers in front. I think the way to fix my stiff steering is put my stock rims on the front.

I absolutely love my mudzillas. They have been working so very well everywhere. Not to downgrade anybody's mudrunners. I bet I would like those too. I just felt like I was afraid of poping my stock tires everywhere I went. I love the mudzilla bite. Plus, they have incredible sideways traction. They ate the snow exceptionally well. I feel like I am in great control. They do not appear to be wearing fast at all. Two drawbacks, they don't seem to bite in reverse very well and they do not bite on ice or moss. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-frown.gif[/img]


Jeff, you know the plusses and minuses. There is no perfect quad. The griz is not a bad quad in the least. It is a riot. Overall I would lean toward the prairie. I would let these things decide for me:

-Does he need the ground clearance? Griz all the way.
-does he tow stuff alot? Prarie is a better pick.
-is he weak, and like to ride in really rough places? Griz (less steering effort)
-is he in water lots? Prarie.
-does he plan to use the quad for heavy work, driving slow a lot? Prarie (grizzly's boil the gas in their tanks, and that is no rumor, most people just do not ride that slow all the time)
-Not neccessarily limited by any of the above? Praire. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

 

Nyroc,
Thanks for the detailed response, I really appreciate it. As far as your steering being stiff I'd like to share the observations from my 650. With stock tires the steering was stiff, and I thought it should be easier. When I was researching for tires I saw some mention of the Mudrunners steering easy because the tread design has center patches. The stock tires didn't. This along with other information swayed me to the Mudrunners over Outlaws. I can tell you that the Mudrunners DRAMATICALLY improved the steering. It's very very easy now. I am really happy with this. As far as wider front rims and tires contributing to heavy steering I am not sure. The center riding patch issue makes sense to me though because the center of the tire is the part that touches the ground on most terrain. I would guess that other characteristics of tire design also contribute to easy steering, whatever they are. I just looked on the Maxxis web site at a picture of the Mudzillas and it looks like there is a significant amount of rubber in the middle, so I don't know, but if those tires fit on the stock rims it sounds like you'll make a swap to test. Let us know. What size are the front tires and the rear tires?
Thanks.

 

The fronts are 28x12-8, the backs are 28x12-10

[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/img] [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/img] [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif[/img] The steering is actually not too hard in the middle when I am on dirt and stuff. But when I turn the handle bars far enough out, it is harder. I went and looked at it in the garage, and it is really bad on concrete. I jacked it up and it was easy like I would expect.
I lowered it until it just barely touched tire a little and it got real tough, so I guess it is not spring pivot friction al all. It can't even be all tire pivot friction. The wheels turn when I turn the steering wheels due to the limited slip diff (try it, you'll see. It is cause by steering geometry). I bet this has a lot to do with the stiff steering. I let the jack down a little more until the tire could not skid from spinning due to the limited slip diff and it was almost as stiff as when I let it all the way down. When I pull the diff lock, it is really really hard.

Conclusion? I do not feel the tires are really at fault, although I do not doubt the mudrunner's patch helps a little. I fell that the major reasons for the steering being so dang hard are:
-My wheels are spaced further out.
-My front diff has 20w50 in it, and it is cold right now making the limited slip more limited (stiffer).
-Prairie Macphersion strut system.

These three things add together. The wheels being further out not only makes steering worse on a macpherson system, but makes it worse when there is a stiff diff.

The grizzly owner keeps telling me his steers tighter. It really does not turn that much tighter, it is just that I don't always get the handlebars cranked all the way because it gets harder the farther I turn it. I am going to look into this more. I will put the stockers on and do some kind of test to see the difference in sterring effort.

I know my brother could use the wheels, since he bent his when he rolled it and never got new ones.

 

Oh, sorry to bug everybody that is reading this.

But, on second thought. Do you remember talking to people that said their thumb got tired on their quad? They got used to it.

Maybe I will get use to riding the stiffer steering and it won't be an issue. I'll probably just grow whatever muscle is required to do the job.

 

Hey nyroc,
nice pics. I'm also ready to go for the warn 2500. can you tell me where you put the relay? I had to put it in my rear storage spot on rubicon and that seems to have worked well, but no such easy solution for the 650.
Thanks,demps

 

I put mine under the ritght rear fender, by drilling two holes in the aluminum fender support bracket. see my 650 website. http://atv.dnsalias.com/atv/prairie6...dir=&pic=9

Picture 8 and 10 are also related, so click the back and forward buttons so you can see them.

Yeah, I sat and scratched my head for a while about this one. I decided that any messing around in front of the quad was a bad thing.

The right rear fender has a pocket of space that the tire will never touch. The kit comes with plenty of wire for it. Mount the wires to that relay before bolting it down.

My toggle switch is on the handlebar. It is really nice there except when I am not on the quad. Also, little people do not notice it there as much, which is a plus.