Though the Pioneer Press is much better than the S&T, it's still very unfortunate. One of these times, I'm gonna try to locate some of these "stealth photogs" and follow them around a bit too. Hmmm, I wonder if they recycle. Do they have a wood fireplace? Are they driving a Hybrid car? I had a pleasant drive this last weekend up to my family's cabin. Along the way, there were numerous "This section of highway adopted by" and often times it was a local ATV club. Great positive exposure. Hmmm, then I got to watching for any sections adopted by an environmental group.....not a one. Could it be they are too busy worrying about what others are doing, other than doing something good themselves? Why must it be that we must continue to look over our shoulders. Last I checked, the Canadian Goose population was soooo out of wack, that the local lakes in downtown Mpls. had trails covered in droppings. Last I checked, we had a run-away deer population. Last I checked, my parents had lost 4 recently spayed cats due to eagles, wolves, etc. In general, a vastly rebounded environmental "snow-globe". Oh, and for global warming, I think Texas had more snow than the southern half of Minnesota this year.

Do the best you can while using this planet. I've personally planted more trees than a vast majority of "environmental extremists". They, like the grass between my toes will continue growing back, that's nature. If they're that obsessed over it's condition, maybe they could stop worrying about how the rest of us enjoy it, and get out themselves. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

I do love it when a Star and Trib rep asks me to subscribe. I affords me the opportunity to calmly and politely step up on my soapbox.....they never seem to have anything to say after that.

One thought in closing, how are we going to dispose of all these huge batteries in these "ecologically conscious" hybrid vehicles?

 

Good stuff Modquad! Where are all these hyprocrits, I never hear of anything they are "doing" besides following us around waiting for, or creating false moves.[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/img]

 

Hear is a challenge for you... how about posting the address to the editor of these "fine" reporters of "news".. along with the article so those of us that live outside the area can write them and set the record straight. I imagine it is an act of futility, but it gives the rest of us an opportunity to get our soap boxes out of the closet as well.

Right now, I think we are seeing the environmentalist in full retreat when people like you and I stand up and tell the other side of the story and set the record straight. They have for many years gotten away with twisting facts, and half truths... and when confronted, they have consistently been putting their tail between their legs and leaving without a whisper.

My only concern is what they will use next in their battle against the evil hoard of ATV riders. Lies, twisting of faacts, pictures with empassioned alarmist rhetoric is not working any more... tying up funds that would be used to build and maintain trails with baseless lawsuites seems to be their action of choice.

I wonder if anyone has ever looked at the ratios of dollars collected to support saving baby seals and how much of it actually gets spent on the intended project. I think you will find a group of HIGHLY paid lobbyists, lawyers, and extremists that are lining their pockets off of innocent and concerned citizens. It is time that each and every environmental organization be taken to task and forced to open their doors to ridicule. Maybe then, we can shut them up and get them to play in the same sandbox. Right now, they are acting like the spoiled kid who takes his ball and goes home when things don't go their way.

The majority of ATV riders as a group are cognizant of the environmental impact their machines can have on the land. We want to work with experts to build better trails... and maintain them.. and share them with the hikers/mountain bikers etc... the real problem is that the environmental groups do not under any condition want to accept compromise and cooperation as a fundamental means for progress. The ONUS is on them now... we have put our hands out and asked them to join us at the table... unfortunately, they refuse to get their hands dirty with the same soil they are supposedly trying to save.

 

Dragginbutt,
I tried going that route, seeing that all the "editorials" posted in the Star Tribune are annonymous, no name or anything to go with it, while the Opinion page, which a lot of these "editorials" appear on, require you to submit your name,address, and work number to be allowed a few lines of comment, while the "no-namers" get a half page to spread their one sided drivel. I have tried on several occasions to get articles posted in their paper, to give a non biased, accurate counter point to the one sided slam jobs they print, but have yet to have anything accepted or printed. Seems to me a lot of our worst enemies also control the media to an extent, or are being paid to. The only pro ATV articles I see are usually from heads of the ATVAM, and then they print a blistering counterpoint to make them look as bad as possible. It would be nice to be able to get feedback printed from an equal amount of well mannered ATV crowd on their views and experiences than just the radical foaming-at-the-mouth tree huggers who ride their SUV to the woods to protest a few ruts in a muddy area ( imagine that, mud that you can't magically float over !! ) The public needs to hear more of BOTH sides, not just the slanted,hateful views of a few.

 

I hear ya.. and understand the frustration... the secret is in numbers.... if they get a large response, eventually they have to take action. Another possibility is to go to the local business owner organizations. The BBB has a strong pull.. and once convicned that their business benefits from teh $ being spent in local shops, restaurants, gas stations, motels etc... you can bet they can apply some serious pressure to sway the media. The Media is like an oil can.. they are always chasing the squeaky wheel... you just need to learn how to squeak louder...

 

Draginbutt, Always good to hear your point of view.

Got this email today...
The session ended with a whimper Monday night --- Sen.
Marty passed HF460 -- a DNR bill with many of the same
non-controversial provisions that are in the Finance bill
-- Rep. Hackbarth, the House author decided against trying
to conferee the bill so it died along with the session.

Gov. Pawlenty called a special session immediately
following the adjournment of the regular session. Both
bodies will continue to work on the conference committees
they were working on during regular session -- right now
not much is happening on the Environment Finance bill
because there is a disagreement between the House &
Governor and the Senate on the LCMR reform issue. Until
that is settled, it is unlikely the committee will get any
spending targets to complete the bill. Look for this all
to drag out several more weeks minimum.

An ATV/OHV subgroup has been appointed by the conference
committee chairs and has met several times to discuss OHV
issues. Several decisions have been made by the subgroup
-- to accept the OHM sound language, and several other tech
changes made by the DNR. The group is also looking at
feasibility study type language for the North Shore trail
-- it is being developed to bring back to the group.

The big areas of disagreement are the gas tax study - our
anti-access friends and Sen. Ruud and Marty are attempting
to dilute the study so we cannot collect as much funding
for our account. In addition, Sen. Marty wants the money
for the Ambassadors program to be available for his
anti-access friends to use against us. Both totally
unacceptable positions.

Both of these augments that are being used against us
really show the true agenda behind these folks. They just
don't want ATVs out on "their" public lands -- period. In
fact, if most had their way, all ATVs & OHVs would be made
illegal, period.

We need to continue to fight them every inch of the way.
If you have not contacted your state representative and
state senator do so as soon as possible. Let them know
that we need their support to fight off these so called
environmentalists who are attempting to deny us access to
our public lands. Please do that today!!

ATVAM will continue to watch the conference committee
during the special session & be available to help on any
OHV language.


"Ride as if everyone is watching; Talk as if everyone is
listening . . ."

www.atvam.org


If you live in mn and want 15 bucks to go a long way....join the atvam, its only 15 bucks, and they are watching over the issues which effect us all. And dont forget to contact your represenative and let them know, youre not a wacko, and you enjoy the atv hobby, and you would like continued access to the woods,and youd like their support. Also remember which of the legislators are the anti atv ones, and dont vote for them, and remind your family and friends to not vote for them.

 

Speaking of ATVAM, when are the spring and fall conventions going to start running "sport ATV" type events. The trail riding is normally a very fun time, the mud-bogs and trailer pulls are for the utilities.....kinda seems like the organization has alienated the 4x2 segment of the market. Yes, I know ATVAM works very hard in the legislative lobby, I have never doubted that. There is a large 4x2 market (also defined as potential dues paying members) in the state. All you have to do is take a visit to a local Dist 23 MX or XC race, no one wants anything to do with ATVAM. I find that kind of a bummer, since when we all unite, we can be even that much more powerful. Any type of 4x2 type event can be held within the confines of private/controlled turf (defined as away from extremist camera lenses). The 4x2 and ATV racing community is dialed in to sound testing, so that's not an issue. Let's bridge the gap, and grow the organization to the size it needs to be for an even louder political voice!!! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]


Power to the people...especially those who ride ATV's.

 

Yeah I read that today, it does sound grim. I just hope the people who support anti-access realize it could turn around to bite them.

 

I just did a Google on --Star Tribune ATV-- and the first article that popped up was headlined "Tracks on the land: Nature pays the price as ATVs hit Minnesota's woods" (http://www.startribune.com/stories/531/1633242-2.html)

The first part of the article documents, unfortunately, more than a little damage to woodlands by ATV'ers riding on logging roads and game trails by spinning their wheels and cutting ruts through wetlands ("mudding,” they called it). The big gripe seems to be ATV'ers riding off the legal trails.

It's such a long article, most people probably don't read all of it. The copy editor who wrote the headline obviously didn't.

The last of the article gives an ATV'er perspective. You might even say it was somewhat positive toward recreational ATV'ing. Here is one quote from that section:

"Tim Browning, DNR trails and waterways regional manager in Brainerd, said the DNR's policy is to offer ATV riding opportunities, including mudding areas, where the environmental effects can be controlled.

"We know that desire, we know that urge is there to see what their machine can do," he said. "They want the challenge, and so we're going to provide it."

However, one thing I learned from the article, and we all need to keep in mind, is that moaning about tree huggers is not the answer to our problems. Much of the negative comment in the article came from farmers, landowners, an Ojibwe tribal official, the Minnesota Deer Hunters Association and the Izaak Walton League.

I frankly don't listen to tree huggers. They have no credibility. But we'd better listen to some of these other folks. It's not just the tree huggers who are getting p----d off.

 

Sure we should listen to them, and they should listen to us. Look how many articles or incidents there really are to report damage etc...not very many. They have to search hard to find these little areas where ATVer's shouldn't be riding.
Same old thing, a couple bad apples spoil the batch. If you look at how many people do follow the rules its just the same as anything else. Car drivers, boat drivers etc. Many more people follow the rules than those that don't.
And I believe in most cases its ignorance, they just don't realize what they are doing, and then some don't care sure.

Its easy to follow a group of people doing anything and find someone breaking the rules. We "ATVAM" do put up a fight and present our facts. Its human nature to pay more attention to whats "wrong" then whats "right".
Do you congradulate someone every time they do something right? probably not
Do you scold someone everytime they do something wrong? probably