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"Boost for boost, engine for engine, a turbo will wax a mechanical supercharger for total power"

That statement is only true with a roots or "vortex" style supercharger. Boost for boost The MPI kit builds the same horsepower as a turbo..

The motor doesnt' say "hey its a turbo and make more power" it just knows its getting more boost..

The centrifigual style supercharger turns at a higher RPM than any turbo out there, FACT!

Turbo's have a place but they use horsepower to make horsepower, a gt 28 takes 9hp to build 10lbs of boost, The rotrex supercharger takes 11hp to make the same boost. The downside of a turbo is the lag and heat buildup. The downside of a supercharger is the drive system, that is the weak link.


MY MPI rhino kit with supercharger, CDI, stock tires, stock exhaust, stock clutching makes 52 RWHP, stock number was 21 RWHP
MY 686 Full race motor made 48 RWHP

 

I am not sure where those HP numbers to drive the blower/turbo's came from. But it sounds odd.

I am no expert either so I don't have any data on it.

But from my understanding, turbo's on your trypical bolt on applications have less loss from driving them as a supercharger. It's supposed to be quite the difference really.




I'm still curious on how they are driving the supercharger on the 660.

Like WHERE is the belt attaching to? Is it gear drive??? Where on earth would it go???
I'm just curious as heck to see this.

I am hoping the oriinal person who posted this didn't buy one of those 12Volt eBay electric superchargers!!!

 

the supercharger drives off the fan drive on the passenger side of the motor, you move the gas tank to the drivers side.

Those numbers on the turbo-supercharger drive are dyno numbers with both units vented to atmosphere.

 

I don't know where you get your facts from but every one is wrong.
Your little centrifugal takes power to turn..........and lots of it at boost. Unlike a turbo, which uses exhaust gas. It does not matter if it's a positive displacement supercharger or a centrifugal supercharger; they both suck HP from the crank. Now they make more than they suck away from the engine. If they didn't, what's the point to adding a direct couple supercharger.
I'd like to gear your direct couple supercharger to the back of a bicycle and see you peddle your little blower to 15 PSI. Ha ha ha ha.......it ain't going to happen!!!!!

I got news for you. The reason a turbo will make more power is because the direct couple supercharger uses energy. It's taking away from the crank HP. There is a reason Indy cars use turbo's........it's simple......THEY MAKE MORE TOTAL HP.

Ha ha ha ha..........where does this come from? Fact? ha ha ha ha
Lets do a little math. Lets say you spin an engine 7K. Now lets say you have a 10 to 1 pulley set-up on a centrifugal blower. (you will never see this because you would have to have a 10" pulley on the crank and a 1" pulley on the supercharger or a 20" pulley on the crank and a 2" pulley on the blower) Even at this ratio the direct couple will only spin 70K; far short of the 100K+ a stock turbo system turns; let alone a race system.
This statement is 180 degrees wrong.
A centrifugal supercharger (dirrect couple) suffers from the same lag as a turbo. With a cetrifugal supercharger boost increases with the square of RPM. Same as with a turbo. They are both inefficient at low RPM unlike a positive displacement blower.

BTW; you get no boost (pressure) if you vent a pump (supercharger) to atmosphere. Pumps don't make pressure; restrictions do. You need to go back to school.

 

Fan drive?

Now I don't really know a Rhine. Isn't it the same engine as a Raptor?

And the fan is ELECTRIC?

I still do not understand where it is coupled.

I'd just like to see it. Because I thought of it before, and thought it would be WAY TOO MUCH engineering and space needed for that for my likes.
So the TURBO is what I did.





TurboDoctor- Now some of them centrifugals actually do have gear drives to multiply the compressor speed over the input pulley speed right??? So I guess they COULD do 100k. But that takes some CRANK POWER!

And I have also read about them type of SuperChargers having LAG just like a Turbo. At low RPM's the compressors don't do too much. I guess it's in the design.



I just tested mine out a little bit, but that I'll post in my thread.

 

True. I think it was Paxton that had nothing but problems with their gearing system. They had a ramp and ball system to try and minimize the lag. They used some wierd oil in the ball system. I'm not sure, but I don't think Paxton is even made anymore? I think Vortex put them under because they had (so I was told) a gearing system that worked.

I guess my point was lost that anytime you have a pump direct coupled to an engine there will be BIG time losses. Not so with your "exhaust snail." This shows up in BSFC every time. The super uses more fuel to make up for losses in the drive.

I have been watching your thread. Sounds like a fun project!!! Don't get greedy with your boost!!!

 

Dude. I know EXACTLY what you speak of. My bro in law installed a turbo on his 318 Dodge Ram. Blew up head gaskets. He got them metal layered ones (like our quads). Then had oil pressure problem. That was from plugged oil pick up screen from gasket materials.

THEN got it back together. Crazy thing makes 11PSI of boost and tuning not right yet. A few BOOMS here and there as we drove it a few miles and it spun several rod bearings and is down again!!!! Of course he only had a 9PSI waste gate spring, so it wasn't intentional to run 11PSI.
We never got to see what was going on to make it pop like it was. Almost sounded like ignition mis firing to me.





The only bad thing is the Turbo guy where I bought this turbo thinks the FIXED waste gate on this thing may be around 12 PSI!

So far it's never touched 10. Been about 8 but again never really tuned and I am running the muffler. Which seems to kill some boost anyway.



I hope to get it all worked out. It's kind of cool because it's all home made except for the new Turbo unit itself. But I cut and welded every bracket, flange, etc. And now the fuel injection.

I wish I had the means to do this stuff before I was married with kids so I could spend more time on it.








Now. Not to be a jacka$$ to the original thread starter. I'd like to see some PICTURES or something of how they are installing the Supercharger.
There's nothing wrong with someone doing a Supercharger instead of a turbo if that's what they want to do.

 

Doctor turbo you need to do a little research. My ROTREX supercharger spins at 150,000rpm at 10lbs of boost... show me a turbo that spins that high. I agree that conventional superchargers do take more power to spin but this one does not... If you like come to utah we will take my 2 rhino's, one with a turbo and the other with the supercharger and dyno both of them... FACT IS FACT

 

alot of turbos, especailly smaller ones peak at 200,000 rpm and some a smidge higher. but rpm doesn't = power, don't get confused, and yeah i belive turbos will get you alot more hp, but if your lookin for the low end power then a supercharger would be a more economical choice.