Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
#71
06-11-2006, 10:43 PM
Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
JJonJon
I think anyone would agree that it is more comfortable to ride an atv without a helmet, but it is not safe.
You are young. You think you know everything, but unfortunately you don't. I think back to some of the daring things I did as a teen and I can't believe how stupid I was!
Please re-consider wearing a helmet. You are too young to spend the rest of your life as a vegetable (if you are lucky enough to survive a massive head trauma.)
I know of a 15yr old kid who survived an atv crash and the rest of his life has been ruined because of his decision not to wear a helmet. I bet every day his parents say "if he had only worn a helmet."
I think anyone would agree that it is more comfortable to ride an atv without a helmet, but it is not safe.
You are young. You think you know everything, but unfortunately you don't. I think back to some of the daring things I did as a teen and I can't believe how stupid I was!
Please re-consider wearing a helmet. You are too young to spend the rest of your life as a vegetable (if you are lucky enough to survive a massive head trauma.)
I know of a 15yr old kid who survived an atv crash and the rest of his life has been ruined because of his decision not to wear a helmet. I bet every day his parents say "if he had only worn a helmet."
#72
06-11-2006, 10:52 PM
Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
Suddenly the phrase, "No brain, no pain." comes to mind... [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]
I don't know what age category you fall in Blazer25, but do you ever look back and wonder how you made it this far? When I look back at all the things I did, I'm truly fortunate to be here, the good Lord had other things for me to do.
I will likely never be a safety freak, but there needs to be some common sense and jurisprudence applied at all times, that I will concede. My brother is an absolute safety freak, I say lovingly, but he does drive everyone crazy. Shoot, He tells me my F150 isn't a safe enough vehicle and that I should get rid of it ASAP- pass it on to some other sucker, I guess. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
I don't know what age category you fall in Blazer25, but do you ever look back and wonder how you made it this far? When I look back at all the things I did, I'm truly fortunate to be here, the good Lord had other things for me to do.
I will likely never be a safety freak, but there needs to be some common sense and jurisprudence applied at all times, that I will concede. My brother is an absolute safety freak, I say lovingly, but he does drive everyone crazy. Shoot, He tells me my F150 isn't a safe enough vehicle and that I should get rid of it ASAP- pass it on to some other sucker, I guess. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]
#73
06-11-2006, 11:51 PM
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#74
06-12-2006, 08:16 AM
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Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
"No brain...know pain" thats pretty good. Here is one that I use - "No safety...know pain" & "Know safety...no pain". But then again I am a professional safety freak...its how I put bread on the table.
67x...i would not be allowing my young daughter on a 90 no matter if she is athletic or not. Having a 6 year old girl myself who is involved with every sport and activity available gives me a little insight into that age group. I don't think I would even give her a 50 at this point. And it has nothing to do with her physical ability to sit & drive the machine but more to do with the ability to make proper decisions and level of maturity. Heck I am 38 and I make poor decisions when riding that aren't always the best and I've got a wealth of knowledge & experience when it comes to ATVs. I find it interesting that as someone who is a strong proponant for helmet use and the safeguarding of kids that you would provide your girl with the bike. I am not questioning your parenting skills, just voicing my opinion.
And yes the initial start of this thread was pointed towards my observatiuon after looking at pictures posted on this forum that very few of the pictures showed people riding with helmets. Now after watching this thread grow and reading everything posted I think that helmet use should be mandatory across the board. Whether someone wants to use a helmet or not, for whatever reason, does not mean that I want to pay for the medical system that will have to help you out after an injury that a helmet could have prevented. I am Canadian so our Medicare system is funded by everone. Now before th flood starts let me also say that protective gear is there to help...it is not perfect and people can cite negative examples but the fact that helmet use is better than non-helmet use remains - nobody can logically argue that point.
67x...i would not be allowing my young daughter on a 90 no matter if she is athletic or not. Having a 6 year old girl myself who is involved with every sport and activity available gives me a little insight into that age group. I don't think I would even give her a 50 at this point. And it has nothing to do with her physical ability to sit & drive the machine but more to do with the ability to make proper decisions and level of maturity. Heck I am 38 and I make poor decisions when riding that aren't always the best and I've got a wealth of knowledge & experience when it comes to ATVs. I find it interesting that as someone who is a strong proponant for helmet use and the safeguarding of kids that you would provide your girl with the bike. I am not questioning your parenting skills, just voicing my opinion.
And yes the initial start of this thread was pointed towards my observatiuon after looking at pictures posted on this forum that very few of the pictures showed people riding with helmets. Now after watching this thread grow and reading everything posted I think that helmet use should be mandatory across the board. Whether someone wants to use a helmet or not, for whatever reason, does not mean that I want to pay for the medical system that will have to help you out after an injury that a helmet could have prevented. I am Canadian so our Medicare system is funded by everone. Now before th flood starts let me also say that protective gear is there to help...it is not perfect and people can cite negative examples but the fact that helmet use is better than non-helmet use remains - nobody can logically argue that point.
#75
06-12-2006, 10:38 AM
Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
Ok SafetySean, you and I are pretty close age wise, I'm 37. I have 2 older boys also. I won't question your parenting, so please don't mine, as I said, I feel utterly confident in my daughter, her skills, and her decisioning. I've had no reason to give pause. But, I respect anyone else's feelings about when is the right time- everyone is different. Even when I lived in AZ, the 5 year olds are out racing in the KTM divisions, so what's the diff? It's a way of life.
One of my friend's boys at 7 was clearing major air on his KTM 90 that I wouldn't even attempt! I respect that you don't feel comfy, I do. We're just 2 different people coming from 2 different angles, so please be careful about slinging morality and questioning someone's parenting- that's not at all appropriate.
BTW, my brother does recognize- a very little bit- that he might be OCD about it. He even carries germ gel everytime he goes to a store, especially a grocery store. Not that's not a prudent thing... He insisted my sister buy a $350 car seat over a $120 model because it rated better...and she wasn't exactly in a position to do so at the time. He's funny. He insists on being in on every car or kid related purchase to guide us all. We like to give him a hard time. I like to let his girls get real dirty when they would come over just to watch him wig out about the dirt/germs! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Any way, looks like we probably won't come to eye level on this one, but it's ok. I worked closely with our risk department and they drove me nuts too about the small calculable chances of things coming to pass. My families lives are firmly in God's hands anyway, so if it be time for any of us, we be ready! Take care up there. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img]
One of my friend's boys at 7 was clearing major air on his KTM 90 that I wouldn't even attempt! I respect that you don't feel comfy, I do. We're just 2 different people coming from 2 different angles, so please be careful about slinging morality and questioning someone's parenting- that's not at all appropriate.
BTW, my brother does recognize- a very little bit- that he might be OCD about it. He even carries germ gel everytime he goes to a store, especially a grocery store. Not that's not a prudent thing... He insisted my sister buy a $350 car seat over a $120 model because it rated better...and she wasn't exactly in a position to do so at the time. He's funny. He insists on being in on every car or kid related purchase to guide us all. We like to give him a hard time. I like to let his girls get real dirty when they would come over just to watch him wig out about the dirt/germs! [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Any way, looks like we probably won't come to eye level on this one, but it's ok. I worked closely with our risk department and they drove me nuts too about the small calculable chances of things coming to pass. My families lives are firmly in God's hands anyway, so if it be time for any of us, we be ready! Take care up there. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-cool.gif[/img]
#76
06-12-2006, 01:37 PM
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Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
67x...don't read more into my post than is there. I am quite plain when I state that I am not questioning your parenting skills, merely stating my opinion. As for slinging morality I am only stating that based on my knowledge of my own 6 year old and the others that I am exposed to that cognitively, from a decision making process, that they aren't up to it and from what I have read in your posts I am surprised you would give your girl the bike. That is an opinion, not pushing morality. And don't think from that statement that I think my girl or her friends are slow, backward or behind on a cognitive basis...they are average little girls who don't always remember to pick up their toys or put on a coat when its cold without being told or who leave their backpacks on the schoolbus. They are the same type of little girls who are not permitted to use a real stove, who sometimes spill the milk when pouring it from a 2 liter container, etc. But not little girls who are up to the concentration and decision making requirements associated with riding an ATV. An example of pushing morality would be bringing God into the issue. From your statement on that subject I have to assume that you are a fatalist and do not believe in free will and shaping your own destiny. Anyway, moving on...
A 21 year old man was killed less than a kilometer from where I sit now over the weekend when the ATV he was riding collided with a parked vehicle and then hit a pole. Blunt force head injury was the unofficial COD. This occurred in the wee hours of the morning and alcohol & speed were a factor. He was operating on a paved road at the time. A real bonehead move on his part but a tragedy at the same time that affects not only his family but the community at large. One of our employees here was part of the response team that showed up and this guy had to leave & go home today because he was having trouble dealing with the images left in his mind. If he doesn't come around in a day or so I will have to arrange some councilling for him. Would this guy have survived had he been wearing a helmet? I don't know but then again we will never know that one.
A 21 year old man was killed less than a kilometer from where I sit now over the weekend when the ATV he was riding collided with a parked vehicle and then hit a pole. Blunt force head injury was the unofficial COD. This occurred in the wee hours of the morning and alcohol & speed were a factor. He was operating on a paved road at the time. A real bonehead move on his part but a tragedy at the same time that affects not only his family but the community at large. One of our employees here was part of the response team that showed up and this guy had to leave & go home today because he was having trouble dealing with the images left in his mind. If he doesn't come around in a day or so I will have to arrange some councilling for him. Would this guy have survived had he been wearing a helmet? I don't know but then again we will never know that one.
#77
06-12-2006, 02:50 PM
#78
06-12-2006, 03:43 PM
Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
Yep- found this story that I think we can all appreciate. Any way, SafetySean, no hard feelings, sometimes things come across off in messages. I hope we're cool!
Not even I would be riding the streets w/o a noggin shell, driver's tend to not pay much mind to riders. Story:
ESPN.com: NFL
Monday, June 12, 2006
Big Ben in serious condition after motorcycle accident
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ESPN.com news services
PITTSBURGH -- Steelers quarterback Ben Roethlisberger was badly hurt in a motorcycle crash Monday and undergoing surgery. The extent of his injuries was not known.
Roethlisberger
Roethlisberger was in serious but stable condition, said Dr. Larry Jones, chief of trauma at Mercy Hospital.
"He was talking to me before he left for the operating room," Jones said before the operation. "He's coherent. He's making sense. He knows what happened. He knows where he is. From that standpoint, he's very stable."
The 24-year-old Roethlisberger likes to ride without a helmet, a habit that once prompted coach Bill Cowher to lecture him on the dangers.
The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review reported that Roethlisberger wasn't wearing a helmet. The Associated Press reported it wasn't clear whether he was wearing a helmet or not.
The crash happened at an intersection at the edge of downtown at about 11:30 a.m. A pool of blood was still visible there by early afternoon.
Police spokesman Lt. Kevin Kraus said police and homicide units were investigating the crash, something standard when there is an accident with critical injuries. Kraus would give no details on the extent of Roethlisberger's injuries or if anyone else was injured.
The accident occurred on Second Avenue near the intersection of 10th Street in Pittsburgh, around 11:30 a.m. The route is one often taken in traveling to the Steelers' facility in the Southside section of the city.
Steelers backup quarterback Charlie Batch was at the emergency room. He had no comment.
A silver Chrysler New Yorker with damage to the front passenger fender was removed and Roethlisberger's bike was loaded onto a flatbed truck. Police were detouring traffic around the crash scene as onlookers and media gathered.
One of his agents, Ryan Tollner, is in route to Pittsburgh for what was supposed to be a pre-planned trip and will arrive later Monday.
In only his second year in the NFL, Roethlisberger became the youngest quarterback to lead a team to the Super Bowl championship. He was 23 when he did it last February.
Roethlisberger has said in the past that he prefers not to wear a helmet. He has pointed out Pennsylvania's 35-year-old state law requiring helmets to be worn was amended to make helmets optional.
In May 2005, Cowher warned him about safe riding after Cleveland tight end Kellen Winslow Jr. was injured in a motorcycle accident. Winslow tore knee ligaments and was lost for the season.
"He talked about being a risk-taker and I'm not really a risk-taker. I'm pretty conservative and laid back, but the big thing is to just be careful," Roethlisberger said at the time. "I'll just continue to be careful. I told him we don't ever ride alone, we always ride in a group of people, and I think it makes it even more safe."
Roethlisberger continued to ride after Winslow's accident and that angered Terry Bradshaw, who quarterbacked the Steelers to four Super Bowl victories during the 1970s.
Visiting the Steelers' training camp last summer, Bradshaw remarked: "Ride it when you retire."
ESPN.com football writers Len Pasquarelli and John Clayton and The Associated Press contributed to this report.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ESPN.com: Help | Media Kit | Report a Bug | Contact Us | Site Map | Tools | Jobs at ESPN | Supplier Information | Copyright ©2006 ESPN Internet Ventures. Terms of Use for our Site, Terms of Use for ESPN Motion and Privacy Policy and Safety Information/Your California Privacy Rights are applicable to you. All rights reserved.
Not even I would be riding the streets w/o a noggin shell, driver's tend to not pay much mind to riders. Story:
ESPN.com: NFL
Monday, June 12, 2006
Big Ben in serious condition after motorcycle accident
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ESPN.com news services
PITTSBURGH -- Steelers quarterback Ben Roethlisberger was badly hurt in a motorcycle crash Monday and undergoing surgery. The extent of his injuries was not known.
Roethlisberger
Roethlisberger was in serious but stable condition, said Dr. Larry Jones, chief of trauma at Mercy Hospital.
"He was talking to me before he left for the operating room," Jones said before the operation. "He's coherent. He's making sense. He knows what happened. He knows where he is. From that standpoint, he's very stable."
The 24-year-old Roethlisberger likes to ride without a helmet, a habit that once prompted coach Bill Cowher to lecture him on the dangers.
The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review reported that Roethlisberger wasn't wearing a helmet. The Associated Press reported it wasn't clear whether he was wearing a helmet or not.
The crash happened at an intersection at the edge of downtown at about 11:30 a.m. A pool of blood was still visible there by early afternoon.
Police spokesman Lt. Kevin Kraus said police and homicide units were investigating the crash, something standard when there is an accident with critical injuries. Kraus would give no details on the extent of Roethlisberger's injuries or if anyone else was injured.
The accident occurred on Second Avenue near the intersection of 10th Street in Pittsburgh, around 11:30 a.m. The route is one often taken in traveling to the Steelers' facility in the Southside section of the city.
Steelers backup quarterback Charlie Batch was at the emergency room. He had no comment.
A silver Chrysler New Yorker with damage to the front passenger fender was removed and Roethlisberger's bike was loaded onto a flatbed truck. Police were detouring traffic around the crash scene as onlookers and media gathered.
One of his agents, Ryan Tollner, is in route to Pittsburgh for what was supposed to be a pre-planned trip and will arrive later Monday.
In only his second year in the NFL, Roethlisberger became the youngest quarterback to lead a team to the Super Bowl championship. He was 23 when he did it last February.
Roethlisberger has said in the past that he prefers not to wear a helmet. He has pointed out Pennsylvania's 35-year-old state law requiring helmets to be worn was amended to make helmets optional.
In May 2005, Cowher warned him about safe riding after Cleveland tight end Kellen Winslow Jr. was injured in a motorcycle accident. Winslow tore knee ligaments and was lost for the season.
"He talked about being a risk-taker and I'm not really a risk-taker. I'm pretty conservative and laid back, but the big thing is to just be careful," Roethlisberger said at the time. "I'll just continue to be careful. I told him we don't ever ride alone, we always ride in a group of people, and I think it makes it even more safe."
Roethlisberger continued to ride after Winslow's accident and that angered Terry Bradshaw, who quarterbacked the Steelers to four Super Bowl victories during the 1970s.
Visiting the Steelers' training camp last summer, Bradshaw remarked: "Ride it when you retire."
ESPN.com football writers Len Pasquarelli and John Clayton and The Associated Press contributed to this report.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ESPN.com: Help | Media Kit | Report a Bug | Contact Us | Site Map | Tools | Jobs at ESPN | Supplier Information | Copyright ©2006 ESPN Internet Ventures. Terms of Use for our Site, Terms of Use for ESPN Motion and Privacy Policy and Safety Information/Your California Privacy Rights are applicable to you. All rights reserved.
#79
06-12-2006, 04:11 PM
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Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
Just an update on my earlier post about the fatality where I live...apparently this guy was riding an older Yamaha 200E three-wheeler. He had been spotted earlier in the evening going around with a bunch of young kids sitting on the rack & fenders - now thats a real scary thought.
67x...you are a bigger man than most to extend the olive branch - keep the posts coming!
67x...you are a bigger man than most to extend the olive branch - keep the posts coming!
#80
06-12-2006, 04:49 PM
Helmet Use...Or Lack Of
As far as her ability to handle a 90, if I had any reservations, the 50 would still be here. If you saw her ride, you'd know what I mean. She can park it, understands the dynamics of backing out and turning opposite the intended direction, leaning and shifting weight in turns, etc. She handles it at least as well as the 50, but respects the extra speed- that 50 was boring her as much as her PW quad did before we gave that away, and she is not an absolute beginner anyway. She started at 3 on Power Wheels (hardly comparable, but was in intro), then moved on to ride a friend's Raptor 80. In between, she's ridden with me ad nauseum, always getting a lesson. Everything in our household comes with a lesson attached, just like my dad did with me. Please- don't worry about her and the 90, all kids are different and some are ready earlier. She is also blessed with amazing coordination and athletic ability, uncommon even for kids up to age 9 or so.
Thanks, though, for the concern.
Just about any child can use a gas and a break, but size does matter! All it takes is making a sharp turn and that quad (that is too big for her) will come tumbling on top of her. I am around kids every week (at the track) that ride mini quads and dirtbikes. Some of the younger kids come and sit on my daughters quad. Their feet barely reach the foot rest. When your daughter sits on the quad, is she able to comfortably bend her knees while she is sitting on it? I bet he legs are almost all the way straight!
I have seen people come to the track wanting to race their child and the track won't even consider it (because the mini quad is too big for the rider.) Although ability is a factor, they also consider the size of the machine versus the rider size.